Comments on FiveThirtyEight: Politics Done Right: Hey Rick, Can We Talk?

Melanie, I have bad news for you. You ARE trappe...

2009-06-13T19:03:32.592-04:00

Melanie,
I have bad news for you. You ARE trapped there w/ a bunch of crazies! You're in TEXAS. Do yourself a favor and move while you can. Nearly any place is better. I'm from the South and whenever people would talk about how they "did their time in Texas" and wouldn't ever go back, I just assumed they didn't like Southerners. Wrong! Having lived in Texas I see now that just plain didn't like Texas!

If Texas seceded: * Route 66 would span two count...

2009-04-28T14:43:00.000-04:00

If Texas seceded:

* Route 66 would span two countries;
* Cadillac Ranch would not be American anymore;
* LBJ's Library would in foreign territory;
* New Mexico, Oklahoma, Arkansas and Louisiana would have to setup border patrols;
* Texas would have to re-open their embassy in Paris, 1 Place Vendome (France was the first foreign power to recognize Texas as a country in 1839);
* "Amarillo by Morning" would be a song about going abroad;
* El Paso would be a border town to three different countries;
* King of the Hill would be as foreign as Mangas;
* Texas would have it's own NAVY

Mr. Waldorf, It seems that my comment has struck ...

2009-04-23T22:09:00.000-04:00

Mr. Waldorf,

It seems that my comment has struck quite a chord with you, and I find this somewhat surprising. I'm not exact ally sure how my comments led you to believe that I hate America. I was simply stating that Texas is a valuable asset to the Union. No where did I ever say or even insinuate that Texas should leave the Union. In fact, I though that it was pretty clear that I didn't agree with secessionist at all.

I don't think that I've spit on our democracy what so ever. I was saying that we should not try to create a country with a one party system. I want a country where people have the right to choose our leaders. I think that that is actually very supportive of democratic values.

Not sure where the whole tax thing came from, but rest assured that I pay my taxes every week. I'm guessing that you're trying to make me look like an democracy hating, tax evading, vet spitting upon heathen. Since nowhere in my comment did I ever come near to saying something like that, this just makes you look foolish for attacking my person.

I hope that I haven't been too long winded so far, but I would like to make another point. When trying to discredit someones argument, I wouldn't use a silly comment that is completely irrelevant to the fact.

In conclusion, I have absolutely no clue where you animosity is coming from and why it's directed at me. I'm sorry that you didn't actually read what I said and just decided to spew hateful comments in my direction. I will reiterative, in plain English, that I do not think that Texas should succeed from the Union.

P.S. I know that I don't have a right to malign my fellow countrymen, but I'm guess that you do since that's all you've done to me and all Texas sans Bill Hicks. Also, when arguing with someone you should try to refrain from cussing...excessively. It makes you sound like a 14 year old arguing if Mortal Kombat or Mario Brothers is a better video game.

If Texas wants to go, I don't think we can morally...

2009-04-22T21:32:00.000-04:00

If Texas wants to go, I don't think we can morally hold them.

There are plusses and minuses for both parties. When my state, California, saw our choice defeated for President in 2000 and 2004, I don't remember the Governor calling for secession.

The main loss to the US would be the loss of oil/natural gas. But I'm sure that we'd make it up somehow. Could be greater motivation to develop alternative fuels.

If Texas needs to be free, fine. I'll write my Congressperson, and both Senators if it would help.

btw, I only think it's fair that Texas takes a per capita share of the national debt with you, especially since it was W who ran it up. ;-)

But my best wishes to the Free Republic of Texas. Good luck.

Texas will not try to break away... BUT... Constit...

2009-04-22T19:57:00.000-04:00

Texas will not try to break away... BUT... Constitutionalists would (correctly) point out that the ability and right to break out of a union of states is exactly what keeps a federal body in check.

shiner bock sucks.

2009-04-22T11:43:00.000-04:00

shiner bock sucks.

Well if we were to let Texas truly be the Lone Sta...

2009-04-21T01:05:00.000-04:00

Well if we were to let Texas truly be the Lone Star State.. we should definitely not allow them to take Austin. That city rules. It's an oasis in a sea of s hit.

Jacques:Thank you Tyler for one of the only logica...

2009-04-20T15:50:00.000-04:00

Jacques:Thank you Tyler for one of the only logical comments on this story.

Most of America has no concept of what it actually means to live in Texas. I have hosted a large number of visitors from other states and they are all completely suprised at what they see.

Don't forget that Texas produces 28% of the US oil and natural gas production and has 25% of US refining capacity.

But one of the real treasures of Texas is the people. Can you call your neighbor at 3 in the morning because you're out of town and your alarm system is going off? Do you get 10s of offers to help you get your car started when you're in a parking lot with the hood up? Do you get a wave and a smile and a hello while you're walking into the grocery store? If you don't live in Texas, likely not.Yep. I've always made a point to know my neighbors. I've been helped with my car by strangers, and I've helped strangers with their cars, and a dozen more things when I lived in Washington, Missouri, Kansas, and now New Mexico.

Don't forget that the rest of the US has 72% of the oil production and 75% of the refining capacity of the US.

Dividing Texas into 5 states could serve Dems well...

2009-04-20T12:52:00.000-04:00

Dividing Texas into 5 states could serve Dems well. Depending on how the lines are drawn, Dems could easily end up with control of 3 states (according to results of 2008 Obama/McCain contest). But who would draw the lines?

Bush doesn't defeat Kerry in 2004 without Texas - ...

2009-04-19T14:21:00.000-04:00

Bush doesn't defeat Kerry in 2004 without Texas - the question is whether McCain defeats Gore!

BTW, Mr Silver, one of your bloggers has posted a ...

2009-04-19T13:17:00.000-04:00

BTW, Mr Silver, one of your bloggers has posted a threat to kill the POTUSA. Alert the FBI. Seriously.

The Texas Gov's remarks are just one of many "test...

2009-04-19T12:58:00.000-04:00

The Texas Gov's remarks are just one of many "test missiles" that those who lost the last election are sending up in hope that one of them reaches orbital velocity.

In this case, the imagery of secessionist South is so abhorent to so many people -- bearing with it the history of 600,000 American lives lost -- that this whole trial balloon was stupid to begin with. Americans declaring indendence from Americans is no way for a "democrat" (whether Republican, Democrat, or what have you) to behave.

And so is the "teabag" meme out of touch with both facts about tax burdens and with historical imagery of an oppressive foreign monarch who has denied voice and representation to Americans.

The basic problem for the GOP at this time is that it has chosen a 2010 election strategy that requires it so be stubornly "anti-" (anti everything Obama or the majority party proposes) in hopes that current policies will fail and the economy will go to hell as a result.

That strategy may work if what some of the leading liberal economists (e.g., Stiglitz) are saying is true: that the small size of the stimulus package, and the way it is aimed (saving Wall Street first of all) will fail to reverse the economic slide.

But it behooves the GOP in that case to be on the side of reason -- with concrete policies and programs of their own -- not being viewed just as the "party of No" or as promoting some of the most crazy ideas that we are hearing from secessionists and batshit crazy neo-Nazis.

It's useful to bear in mind that our electoral system rewards parties that can form governing majorities. "Majority winner take all" voting promotes this idea. We could, of course, change that system to one that gives smaller parties, even regional parties a better shot at having a voice in representative institutions such as the Congress. But that's not under consideration at this time.

But the GOP seems bent on cementing its minority status, by alienating the "middle" of the American populace -- both ideological moderates, pragmatists, and independents. It's probably a losing strategy -- because we are not Europe, with its many proportional representation (PR) elections.

If TX were to form 5 states, I would imagine one e...

2009-04-19T10:31:00.000-04:00

If TX were to form 5 states, I would imagine one each would be formed around Houston, San Antonio, and Dallas, filling the eastern half of old Texas. Splitting the less populous western half would be problematic. El Paso in the extreme southwest corner could anchor one state in the Rio Grande Valley. But a state in the panhandle would only have small cities like Odessa and Amarillo. You can look at Vanderbei's Purple America, http://www.princeton.edu/~rvdb/JAVA/election2008/ (scroll down to 2nd map) to see how this would work out red/blue-wise. Maybe 3 red states in the north and 2 blue states in the south.
No, TX cannot secede but they do have the right to form 5 states, and have 10 Senators instead of 2. Scarier than secession, huh.

108 Senators. Texas cannot secede but it can be ma...

2009-04-19T08:09:00.000-04:00

108 Senators. Texas cannot secede but it can be made into 5 states. http://www.tsl.state.tx.us/ref/abouttx/annexation/march1845.html
Imagine the area of Texas having 10 Senators instead of 2.

Ah, the old "doesn't know their ass from a hole in...

2009-04-19T01:38:00.000-04:00

Ah, the old "doesn't know their ass from a hole in the ground" story.

One version I heard that might best fit this situation:

One day in Medieval Times, two monks suddenly heard the Father Superior outside shouting and calling for his donkey. The monks went out, and found that the Father Superior was gesticulating at an object in the distance. Moving a bit, they discovered that the Father Superior was shouting and gesticulating towards a cave on the opposite side of the valley.

One monk said to the other "Poor Father Superior. His eyesight is now so bad, he doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground."

In the case of certain people in Tex-ass, it isn't their eyesight that has deteriorated so much, but the ability of their brain to conceive and perceive a logical thought process. Assuming, of course, that their brain could ever conceive and perceive logic. In many people in Tex-ass (not all, of course, but many), it could be argued that their brains never developed to the extent they ever could conceive and perceive logic.

Mike in Maryland

My Blogger ID is http://www.blogger.com/profile/02848893412251095965

Texas - the other line in the song above describes...

2009-04-18T19:13:00.000-04:00

Texas - the other line in the song above describes how rednecks are just too stupid to live up north, they are too busy being bigots.

Hmmm, they want to split into 5 states? We add DC and Puerto Rico and split California into 10.

This whole secession deal was originally hatched d...

2009-04-18T19:03:00.000-04:00

This whole secession deal was originally hatched during the so-called "democrat mutiny" a few years ago. Tom Delay was using his offices in the U.S. House to oversee a NEW redistricting plan for Texas. Never mind the fact that Texas had been redistricted after the 2000 census, that wasn't good enough. Under the Rovian philosophy of a multi- generational Republican majorities, the idea was to make the redistricting so total so as to preclude a majority of democrats in all but a few congressional districts. Of course the Democrats resisted and when the Republican majority in the State Government tried to ram it through the state Legislature, the Democrats actually left the state in order to force a no quorum and a no vote. This caused Delay and Perry to use the FBI and Homeland Security to track down the runaway Senators and try and drag them back to Texas. This was, of course a no-no and eventually Tom Delay lost his seat because of his overreaching tactics. But what was discussed on some right-wing blogs during this time was the fact that Texas can, by it's interpretation of it acceptance into the Union, carve itself into 5 more states, (they were actually looking at the New Mexico and Arizona Territories for this, but the Territories themselves became their own states)
Never mind the history challenged thinking of the Republican Party. flash forward and you have Gov. Perry trotting out this old chestnut and then Tom Delay, declaring the "option" of Texas morphing into 5 very conservative States that would alter the balance of the Senate (adding the 10 new Senators, of course, to the Republican Party.)

Only one problem, while Texas claimed it had the right to FORM the new states, from the rotting carcass of Old Texas, the U.S. under its constitution has the only right to ADD any new states to the Union. Now, how long have the Republicans kept the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico from being added as a state?

So while Texas can divide, it cannot conquer, and in fact, all of the existing Senators and Congressmen would also be dis-enfranchised as the old original Texas would have to be re-admitted. How likely would that happen in a Democratically controlled Senate, House and Presidency. So a morphing from a Republican single Mother Texas into a very republican Texas Family of 5 states was a great way to add more Republican Senators, or to try and threaten to.

This is why the idea never got enough traction before.
But these are desperate times for the GOP, and desperate time require desperate ideas, even if they don't pan out, the shocjk value can get attention.

Attention,yes, but no secession and no 5 state Texas Monty.

Heh, I see someone already registered the fivethir...

2009-04-18T18:50:00.000-04:00

Heh, I see someone already registered the fivethirtysix.com domain. just in case

Yes polls_apart, I was listening to some rare Newm...

2009-04-18T18:48:00.000-04:00

Yes polls_apart, I was listening to some rare Newman live stuff in the car today and when I heard this song I actually thought of this string - LOL!

@fred: For those who don't know, the song in your ...

2009-04-18T18:34:00.000-04:00

@fred:
For those who don't know, the song in your link is by Randy Newman.

WV: surgensa: conducting surveillance in Iraq?

The average secessionist: http://en.wikipedia.org...

2009-04-18T17:59:00.000-04:00

The average secessionist:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lester_Maddox

And a song describing him, and the secessionists as, "rednecks who don't know their ass from a hole in the ground":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7I1wtPUOtM&feature=PlayList&p=55B7E6118E08B938&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=28

Secession? Hell, why wait for that? Let's go for...

2009-04-18T17:57:00.000-04:00

Secession? Hell, why wait for that? Let's go for expulsion!

Glen- The secessionists of 1861 were traitors. T...

2009-04-18T16:34:00.000-04:00

Glen-

The secessionists of 1861 were traitors. There was nothing honorable about slavery or disloyalty to the United States. These are the same people who invented the concentration camp.

Do not make heroes out of monsters and madmen. Every one of them should have been hanged

what a great post Sir Nate! and what a great and f...

2009-04-18T14:38:00.000-04:00

what a great post Sir Nate!
and what a great and funny discussion inside (ok there were Muley-contrairian-secessionist-Renegade but He is endemic...)

and last but not least what a great US's President:

http://tv.repubblica.it/copertina/obama-dialogo-con-cuba/31855?video

ciao.
:)

As far as the other southern states suceeding if T...

2009-04-18T14:33:00.000-04:00

As far as the other southern states suceeding if Texas does, oh PLEASE let it be so! That would rid the U.S. of 80% of the ignorant, fundamentalist right-wing kooks, and basically BOOST the collective IQ of the U.S!