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2009-02-10T22:56:00.000-05:00

Ultimately, what this campaign has showed us is wh...

2008-05-27T22:03:23.290-04:00

Ultimately, what this campaign has showed us is what a COMPLETE JOKE journalism and media coverage are. I used to think that only Fox News was biased, but it appears not one single journalist is able to coverage the campaign in an objective way.

Part of the art of political rhetoric is saying so...

2008-05-27T21:12:06.161-04:00

Part of the art of political rhetoric is saying something without saying it. By making the RFK reference, I think it's pretty clear that the intent was to get the idea or the possibility of assassination "out there". The Clintons don't say much without thinking through twice over. What she said in SD is almost verbatim what she said to TIme in March. The gamble was that the comment wouldn't raise any red flags and be taken in the context of primary timing, rather than "maybe he'll be killed".

i am 36 years old, female, white, hold a JD and an...

2008-05-27T14:42:13.940-04:00

i am 36 years old, female, white, hold a JD and an MS, and I support obama (although i originally hoped-- until it became completely futile--that gore would run, after which i supported kucinich until he withdrew).

i found hillary's comment grotesque--to me it was similar to a freudian slip in that it reveals her thought processes: it shows that she is actively considering, if not assuming, that obama will be assassinated, and wants to be around to reap the benefit if it happens--like a vulture on a corpse.

i have only discussed this with my parents: my mother is 62, white, holds two MA's, supports obama, and felt exactly as i did (she has supported obama all along). my father is 61, white, holds a BA, and supports clinton (but because he wants bill back in the white house not because he really supports hillary); he felt the same way as my mother and i, and that hillary had lost her mind.

i was slow to move to obama, but one reason i did move to him was because i became increasingly disgusted with how clinton was campaigning--she reminds me too much of the republicans. her practice of constantly changing the goal posts and rules is indefensible--we don't need anymore leaders who believe the rules do not apply to them. i also have become disgusted with the clinton chorus that women, such as myself, who do not support hillary are self-loathing. she and her most rabid female supporters, like ferraro, are reinforcing negative stereotypes about my gender--they are making it harder for us to be taken seriously--not easier.

ps: to the poster curious about MBTI, i am an infj (i agree with the poster who replie dto you that N's probably interpreted her comments more negatively than S's--and for the same reason).

pps: great site! thanks so much!

I agree with the earlier commenter saying that Oba...

2008-05-27T13:27:40.948-04:00

I agree with the earlier commenter saying that Obama has done little to unite those nearly half of us in the Dem. primaries that supported Clinton. I don't want to vote for either Obama or McCain, and am planning on writing her name in unless Obama taps her for VP, or at least asks. I like the Lincoln scenario. He can be Lincoln, not by choosing a cabinet afterwards of rivals, but starting with vice president. He doesn't seem to be much of a guy that likes to appoint people who are not 'yes men' though (and they are almost all men, btw). I hope he chooses Clinton as VP, because his recent behavior is over the line.

Glad you brought this up, Poblano, because I'd bee...

2008-05-27T08:46:25.066-04:00

Glad you brought this up, Poblano, because I'd been thinking that the reaction was excessive though not entirely unjust when we consider the whole context.

I was 19 when RFK was assassinated and remember that day very well. Seems to me that what HRC said was not grossly offensive in itself, but still it was revealing. Lately the Clintons have fallen into the bad habit of thinking out loud about the increasingly remote (and often unpleasant) scenarios that could give HRC the nomination. So, maybe someone will shoot him. Or, maybe white Americans are at bottom more racist than most of us had hoped.

I also remember the 1992 primary race which the Clintons have just been spinning beyond recognition. Jerry Brown had effectively conceded that contest by early June.

My husand and I are 64, and we lived through the a...

2008-05-27T01:31:09.376-04:00

My husand and I are 64, and we lived through the assassinations of John and Robert Kennedy and Martin Luther King. we were both severely socked when we read Hillary's statement. She is almost the same age and she must remember these times as well as we do. Don't forget, MLK's death was followed by riots and National Guard on the streets of Washington, D.C. (where I lived at the time). These were memorable and shocking times, and I'm disgusted by Hillary that she would mention them so lightly. What exactly does this say about her mind? It's hard to say, but I certainly don't want her to be president!!

Honestly, I am mad at barack, but i will probably ...

2008-05-27T00:26:07.165-04:00

Honestly, I am mad at barack, but i will probably vote for him because I could never support Mccain. However, if he does not put her on the ticket, which she should be able to force on the convention floor during the vice president vote, I will seriously consider voting for a third party candidate. If he comes out and offers it to her which i do not expect, they would tell me a lot about his character and his desire to unite. I think my opinion would rise of him. After all, he always talks about Lincoln and his approach to appointmnents. It would be nice to see that Barack actually practices what he preaches.

Short of quitting the race or putting her on the t...

2008-05-27T00:20:53.882-04:00

Short of quitting the race or putting her on the ticket, what could Obama do to make you happy?

how can the party come together when barack is doi...

2008-05-27T00:18:13.941-04:00

how can the party come together when barack is doing everything he can to fuel the fire of dislike. What he did this weekend hardened supporters of his against hillary and her supporters against him. You better talk to him and tell him to start healing the wounds and unite which he so often proclaims to be able to do. He is behind. He better get on the ball.

Barack Obama can handle a convention. He has peop...

2008-05-27T00:09:00.312-04:00

Barack Obama can handle a convention. He has people in place who have prepared themselves for a convention fight. Even if it goes to the convention, Obama is likely to win.

The problem is that a bitter convention fight only a couple of months before the election is likely to result in an exhausted campaign and a divided party, giving the Republicans an opening through which to steal the White House.

As far as I'm concerned, I would have accepted any of the top seven Democrats as President (sorry, Mike), but that's not the issue any more. I supported Edwards then Hillary, but Obama won the nomination. It's time for the party to come together and work on defeating McCain.

Congrats to Barack for winning the nomination. Co...

2008-05-27T00:05:28.763-04:00

Congrats to Barack for winning the nomination. Congrats to John Mccain for winning the general election. Oh well dems, maybe next time we won't let these young bucks who know anything about politics or these left wing rich freaks pick our candidate anymore, but somehow I doubt it. Anyway there is always 2012

to anon 8:43What is the matter? Can't barack hand...

2008-05-26T23:58:04.371-04:00

to anon 8:43

What is the matter? Can't barack handle a convention? The fact of the matter is the party is already split and with people like you pissing people like me off it doesn't seem to be on the way to healing. Face facts, She is the better candidate. I am a lifelong democrat and will never voter for an inexperience lying arrogant hypocrite who lacks any leadership qualities. Stop pretending she is more divisive than he is. He has done some pretty dirty things. He is just much better at hiding them. But you know what its politics. Its for the big boys (or girls in this case) so suck it up.

Hillary Clinton has done absolutely nothing wrong....

2008-05-26T23:50:36.298-04:00

Hillary Clinton has done absolutely nothing wrong. I have paid close attention to the constant attacks she receives from vile people like you and the media. Get over yourself and stop wasting so much energy hating someone. It is not worth it.

Everyone I've spoken to was, and still is, appalle...

2008-05-26T23:41:22.314-04:00

Everyone I've spoken to was, and still is, appalled. If you've paid close attention to the Clintons--you're not supposed to, by the way--they have been using sleezy word games and dog whistles of various kinds throughout the campaign. The RFK comment was a trumpet blare.

The power of the Clintons is entirely negative at this point. Yes, they have continued to sow discord in the midst of a humiliating defeat, and many in the party remain intimidated by them. What Hillary Clinton has demonstrated, in addition to being unfit to run a campaign let alone the USA, is that she's not the icon of feminism she was touted to be. A strong feminist wouldn't have felt the need to constantly "prove" her toughness--one of the worst characteristics of men like George Bush and John McCain. Obama has been the strongest man AND the feminist in the race.

My problem with the comments were that her "explan...

2008-05-26T22:14:46.665-04:00

My problem with the comments were that her "explanation" for them was terrible.

I'm willing to accept that she didn't mean what it sounded like she meant (even if the example she was given for what she was TRYING to say was disingenuous at best). However, there's no question that her comment was sloppy and stupid, and she should've immediately followed it up with a "I am sorry for the way that I worded my response. I in no way meant any harm by it and was simply trying to point to another timeline I thought was relevant. I certainly understand that this is a sensitive issue, and I sincerely apologize to everyone who felt justifiably offended."

No, instead, she blames everyone else for blowing it out of proportion, and completely fails to recognize the sensitivity of the issue. I don't believe she was trying to say something so offensive in her original comment, but her response to it has been disturbing, to say the least.

Misprint there: "the last word." Now anyone else c...

2008-05-26T21:55:01.605-04:00

Misprint there: "the last word." Now anyone else can have the last word!

At the very real risk of getting into one of those...

2008-05-26T21:51:58.437-04:00

At the very real risk of getting into one of those classic Internet fights for the last word, I'm going to respond to the "Anon" who I've tangled with. I'm going to try to do it in such a way that lowers the temperature a little bit, or at least that refrains from raising it.

You have every right to your opinion, as do I. I wasn't calling disagreement foolish or childish. I was reacting to your use of the word hate which I'll get into in a second here. And my use of the worry "sorry" was sarcastic, not literal. You might not like sarcasm, but sarcasm happens.

Since I've used my real name for these posts, you can go to the Seattle Times's website, where in addition to the Op-Ed that I linked to, you can do a search for my many letters to the editor that they've printed. A few things should leap out at you. First, I'm generally left of center. Second, I don't pull too many punches. Third, I'm often sarcastic. Bad habit, I suppose.

But what you won't find is the word "hate" in anything I've written. To me, that word is in pretty much the same category as the typical obscenity. When you uncork it, you've declared that you've stopped using your cerebral cortex and are now in lizard brain territory.

Ecclesiastes teaches us that there's a time to hate, but I haven't found it yet. The closest I've come were right after 9/11; during Hurricane Katrina; and when the full story of the Bush administration's use of torture emerged. Of those three, the use of torture brings me the closest to "hating" the people who ordered it.

But I still can't go there, because once you hate you stop thinking. And once you stop thinking, you stop being fully human. So, you can get mad as hell, but "hatred?" Not in my kit bad, I'm afraid.

I think that, in most cases, people who use the H-word don't mean it. In this culture, you hear it most often from two groups: junior high school girls who "hate" (fill in the blank) and right-wing talk show hosts who accuse anyone to the left of them of "hatred."

It's not a word I like, to put it mildly. So, I'm glad you recharacterized your viewpoint with respect to Hillary Clinton. I'd still differ with you, but that's all. There's certainly room to do that.

One last point to make, and that's the use of resentment in politics. This will be my 9th or 10th presidential election, and if there's one thing I've observed about the Republicans and the right wing in general, it's that they're driven to find enemies. The communists. The homosexuals. The unruly poor. The "islamofascists."

It bothers me a lot, and it's hard to deal with because of the risk of becoming a mirror image. One of a number of things that have impressed me about Sen. Obama is that he's trying to break that mold. So, I suppose when I read one of his supporters expressing "hate," I find it jarring. Trust me, I don't for a minute think that politics is a matter of a group singalong to Kumbaya, but I do think we can solve these things without resorting to hatred and the naming of enemies.

I've gone on way too long, so I'll let anyone else have (as that one rat bastard on Faux News says -- and yes, I'm a hypocrite, too) "the lat word." Just remember, we're on the same side, and I think that includes Hillary Clinton too.

"Let's be very clear. Clinton does not need to giv...

2008-05-26T21:43:05.443-04:00

"Let's be very clear. Clinton does not need to give valid reasons to stay in the race. In this country, we have something called a democracy. She has ever right to take it to the convention. If you don't believe in this, then you don't believe in what has founded America and frankly don't deserve to be a member of this great country."

Hillary Clinton will lose the delegate race to Barack Obama. If she wants to stay in the race, she does have to give those delegates a reason to ignore the fact that she lost and give their votes to her. If she can't and she has yet to do so, there's no point in her continuing on.

Hillary Clinton has a right to take it to the convention. But, if she does, she's not likely to achieve the result she wants, namely winning the Presidency. A bitter convention battle coupled with months of her undermining the legitimacy of the process from the podium is likely to seriously hurt the Democratic Party's chance of taking the White House this year, at a time when the party is well-positioned to do so and at a time when the negative consequences of a Republican taking the White House have never been more clear.

Given the divisive rhetoric she's already employed, if she continues, she's likely to do damage to the party's relationship with young voters and African-American voters, thus hurting the party's chances in future electoral cycles. She's also likely to do damage to her own political future and her family's legacy.

She can run out the clock if she wants, but there's no upside any more.

Hey everybody, chill. We have a historical electi...

2008-05-26T21:23:05.516-04:00

Hey everybody, chill. We have a historical election occurring and all anyone can do is talk trash. The first female is running against the first african american. It is a great moment in american history and all you can do is argue. They are both good candidates who would make a far better president than Mccain, so just relax and let it play out.

Let's be very clear. Clinton does not need to giv...

2008-05-26T21:17:27.356-04:00

Let's be very clear. Clinton does not need to give valid reasons to stay in the race. In this country, we have something called a democracy. She has ever right to take it to the convention. If you don't believe in this, then you don't believe in what has founded America and frankly don't deserve to be a member of this great country.

Obama supporter!

"Sorry, but"You are either sorry or not. 'But's' a...

2008-05-26T20:45:56.079-04:00

"Sorry, but"

You are either sorry or not. 'But's' are for people that really aren't *sorry* for insulting someone with petty names, but just want to justify it with an excuse.

But you have given me pause, and a chance to reflect. I figure if a condescending person like yourself, who chooses to label someone who disgrees as a 'child' and 'foolish'- yet can be so highly evolved to forgive race baiting after giving the Clintons $7,100- then the least I can do is to not feel 'hate'.

So, I will choose to merely feel intense loathing. You can keep your reaction to that to yourself, or continue to insult. Suprise me by keeping your need to advise me to yourself. And if you do decide to post an unsolicited reply, perhaps you can include a real apology for the personal attack.

Child? Condescension is an ugly thing, too.Sorry, ...

2008-05-26T19:35:39.424-04:00

Child? Condescension is an ugly thing, too.

Sorry, but when someone runs around saying they "hate" someone, I think it's appropriate to condescend in return. It was a childish statement.

Do 'good Democrats' play the race card?

Her having played the race card is a matter of my opinion and interpretation. It is also a matter of degree. I obviously felt uncomfortable enough with it to disassociate myself with her campaign and, in doing so, tell her that I felt it unDemocratic to do what she did.

That said, I think if one looks at the totality of Clinton's career, that she qualifies as a "good Democrat." That, too, is a matter of opinion about which reasonable people can reasonably disagree.

But "hate the Clintons?" Sorry, but I think that's foolish.

hosertohoosier, More likely the other way around. ...

2008-05-26T19:34:50.076-04:00

hosertohoosier, More likely the other way around. It drives the Ns nuts because they make an automatic subconscious link to a potential Obama assassination, but the Ss just see it at face value.

Comments on FiveThirtyEight: Politics Done Right: Limited Sample Size Department

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