Comments on FiveThirtyEight: Politics Done Right: A Proud Moment for America

酒店經紀人, 菲梵酒店經紀, 酒店經紀, 禮服酒店上班, 酒店小姐兼職, 便服酒店經紀, ...

2009-10-09T08:56:16.904-04:00

酒店經紀人,
菲梵酒店經紀,
酒店經紀,
禮服酒店上班,
酒店小姐兼職,
便服酒店經紀,
酒店打工經紀,
制服酒店工作,
專業酒店經紀,
合法酒店經紀,
酒店暑假打工,
酒店寒假打工,
酒店經紀人,
菲梵酒店經紀,
酒店經紀,
禮服酒店上班,
酒店經紀人,
菲梵酒店經紀,
酒店經紀,
禮服酒店上班,
酒店小姐兼職,
便服酒店工作,
酒店打工經紀,
制服酒店經紀,
專業酒店經紀,
合法酒店經紀,
酒店暑假打工,
酒店寒假打工,
酒店經紀人,
菲梵酒店經紀,
酒店經紀,
禮服酒店上班,
酒店小姐兼職,
便服酒店工作,
酒店打工經紀,
制服酒店經紀,
酒店經紀,
菲
梵,

豆豆聊天室 aio交友愛情館 2008真情寫真 2009真情寫真 aa片免費看捷克論壇微風論壇 ...

2009-03-28T05:16:00.000-04:00

豆豆聊天室 aio交友愛情館 2008真情寫真 2009真情寫真 aa片免費看捷克論壇微風論壇大眾論壇 plus論壇 080視訊聊天室情色視訊交友90739 美女交友-成人聊天室色情小說做愛成人圖片區豆豆色情聊天室 080豆豆聊天室小辣妹影音交友網台中情人聊天室桃園星願聊天室高雄網友聊天室新中台灣聊天室中部網友聊天室嘉義之光聊天室基隆海岸聊天室中壢網友聊天室南台灣聊天室南部聊坊聊天室台南不夜城聊天室南部網友聊天室屏東網友聊天室台南網友聊天室屏東聊坊聊天室雲林網友聊天室大學生BBS聊天室網路學院聊天室屏東夜語聊天室孤男寡女聊天室一網情深聊天室心靈饗宴聊天室流星花園聊天室食色男女色情聊天室真愛宣言交友聊天室情人皇朝聊天室上班族成人聊天室上班族f1影音視訊聊天室哈雷視訊聊天室 080影音視訊聊天室 38不夜城聊天室援交聊天室080 080哈啦聊天室台北已婚聊天室已婚廣場聊天室夢幻家族聊天室摸摸扣扣同學會聊天室 520情色聊天室 QQ成人交友聊天室免費視訊網愛聊天室愛情公寓免費聊天室拉子性愛聊天室柔情網友聊天室哈啦影音交友網哈啦影音視訊聊天室櫻井莉亞三點全露寫真集 123上班族聊天室尋夢園上班族聊天室成人聊天室上班族 080上班族聊天室 6k聊天室粉紅豆豆聊天室 080豆豆聊天網新豆豆聊天室 080聊天室免費音樂試聽流行音樂試聽免費aa片試看免費a長片線上看色情貼影片免費a長片本土成人貼圖站大台灣情色網台灣男人幫論壇 A圖網嘟嘟成人電影網火辣春夢貼圖網情色貼圖俱樂部台灣成人電影絲襪美腿樂園 18美女貼圖區柔情聊天網 707網愛聊天室聯盟台北69色情貼圖區 38女孩情色網台灣映像館波波成人情色網站美女成人貼圖區無碼貼圖力量色妹妹性愛貼圖區日本女優貼圖網日本美少女貼圖區亞洲風暴情色貼圖網哈啦聊天室美少女自拍貼圖辣妹成人情色網台北女孩情色網辣手貼圖情色網 AV無碼女優影片男女情色寫真貼圖 a片天使俱樂部萍水相逢遊戲區平水相逢遊戲區免費視訊交友90739 免費視訊聊天辣妹視訊 - 影音聊天網 080視訊聊天室日本美女肛交美女工廠貼圖區百分百貼圖區亞洲成人電影情色網台灣本土自拍貼圖網麻辣貼圖情色網好色客成人圖片貼圖區 711成人AV貼圖區台灣美女貼圖區筱萱成人論壇咪咪情色貼圖區 momokoko同學會視訊 kk272視訊情色文學小站成人情色貼圖區嘟嘟成人網嘟嘟情人色網 - 貼圖區免費色情a片下載台灣情色論壇成人影片分享免費視訊聊天區微風成人論壇 kiss文學區 taiwankiss文學區

情趣用品,情趣用品,情趣用品,情趣用品,情趣用品,情趣用品,情趣用品,情趣用品,情趣用品,情趣用品,...

2009-02-08T03:42:00.000-05:00

This idea that Obama couldn't have been elected i...

2009-01-26T07:23:00.000-05:00

This idea that Obama couldn't have been elected in Europe is misleading, and seems to suggest that Americans are more tolerant than their European counterparts. I do not think this is the case. Barack Obama had much higher approval ratings in Europe than the US, and if Europeans were voting on the same Obama/McCain choice then his victory would have been much more overwhelming.

I do agree that it is unlikely Europe would elect a Barack Obama. However, it's also highly unlikely that Europe would elect a George Bush. This is not to say that Americans are less discerning, or that Europeans are more racist, it's just the difference of political systems. The US lurches to further extremes of left/right than Europe, as each half of a quite divided country takes a turn to choose. Parliamentary systems tend to have more continuity, and leaders are appointed by political parties or coalitions of parties rather than by the public.

The hostility I occasionally feel toward religion ...

2009-01-21T08:37:00.000-05:00

The hostility I occasionally feel toward religion is not directed at religion itself, more at the idea of exclusivity. It strikes me as wholesomely arrogant to assume that your path to Truth is the only valid one for all people everywhere, and that you have some sort of holy mission to convert the world to your views. To me, life is a loneley struggle for all of us, in which every man must tackle the big questions on his own. Like Kierkegaard.

Unlike many, I'm not convinced that all paths lead to the same outcome when it comes to faith. Was Ghandi any less spiritually enlightened than St Francis of Assisi? No. It's easy to think that if you get caught up in the fairy tales of talking snakes or conversant flaming shrubbery. People sometimes think the talking snake is the whole point of the story, that if they do not believe that a snake actually held a conversation with these two folks in this garden then they're not true followers of the faith-and they entirely miss the moral of the story that's being communicated. The really enlightened people of any faith are less concerned with the details of the metaphor and more concerned with the point. Mother Theresa stated herself she didn't even believe in Jesus anymore at the end-that didn't stop her from believing in helping people in need, did it? She still practiced christian charity, even when she wasn't so sure about christ.

Nor do I think that any idea is so sacrosanct it cannot be challenged. Nor do I believe that anyone should be indoctrinated in metaphysics at a young age. Those things retard religious development more than anything. We tell the kids when they're young, "There's three Gods-in-One, and that's it, never bother to ask yourself what that means or if some deeper meaning is implied by that, and upon pain of chastisement, never ever suggest that it might be false" Which just invites people to behave either as total robots (soulless and dead already) or to freak out and say (as any reasonable person would), "Fuck this. I have a mind of my own, and if belonging to your group means I can't use it, then I'm leaving"

I also distrust preachers and priests, who think they have all the answers. They don't, because nobody does. Charlatans and cheap hacks will stage manage a religious 'experience' with good lighting, flashy clothes, theatrical delivery. It's all vaudeville. And it's all crap. Faith is intended to be a struggle that takes place entirely at the individual level, not Rice-A-Roni. You don't just pour it out of a box and mix it with some holy water and wait a few hours for it to boil. Preachers who jhand you the box of Instant Faith are frauds, all of them.

The religion itself is separate from the buildings it is housed in and the people who put on fancy clothes and gesticulate wildly at the sky. That shit is theatre. Real faith takes place inside your mind, and is as related to that drama as true love is to a soap opera. I tolerate religion. I don't tolerate soap operas.

dcm,If toleration comes with clothespins, it does ...

2009-01-21T08:12:00.000-05:00

dcm,

If toleration comes with clothespins, it does so only in your mind. What you have described is not tolerance, but antipathy.

We both live in the Deep South, and we're both used to people misusing words. Malapropisms are common here. Just today I heard somebody use the word 'redact' as if it meant 'to inteerupt'. And we famously 'misunderestimated' Bush.

It's not like that in the rest of the country. In places where they do not maim the English language as a hobby, toleration implies coexistence without judgment-neither approval nor disapproval.For example, I can tolerate your love of pistachio ice cream without either become a fellow pistachio fanatic or considering your tastes provincial for adopting such a nontraditional flavor. After all, I'll stick to mint chocolate chip, and you enjoy your pistachio, and we'll both tolerate the other for being green.

"[mentioning nonbelievers as Americans] may undo a...

2009-01-21T05:44:00.000-05:00

"[mentioning nonbelievers as Americans] may undo all the good he has done himself with the faith community of late. Bone headed."

The very fact that this may be true deligitimizes the faith community as total hypocrites to the ideals of their spiritual leaders.

I very much hope for the faith community's own sake that such petty exclusionism is beneath them.

Statements like these are rather demonstrative of ...

2009-01-21T05:02:00.000-05:00

Statements like these are rather demonstrative of US ignorance of what happens outside US borders:

"it's highly unlikely that any nation in Europe or most of the rest of the world would have elected someone like Barack Hussein Obama as their leader."

You mean a minority figure despite previous persecution and ongoing discrimination?

Just look at the third world: it's happened many times before. Latin America has indigenous heads of state -- something unthinkable in the US. India has had Sikh prime ministers, and you better believe that Sikhs have been persecuted. An there are many other examples.

As for Europe, it is, on average, more racist than the US, and unlikely to produce an African-European head of state anytime soon. But there have been Jewish prime ministers in France and the UK.

I understand if people are getting caught in the emotions of the Obama inauguration moment. But it's no reason to become totally full of yourself and ignore the fact other have already done similar things before.

The commentary on Europe is unfortunate.In Europe ...

2009-01-21T04:48:00.000-05:00

The commentary on Europe is unfortunate.

In Europe in this moment 4 women occupy the highest position in their countries and that is not a novelty for many many years.

In France, Sarkosy was not even born in France.

Yes there are very strange things in Europe. But Europe is not leading the way in using anti-terrorism legislation to persecute *standard* cases.

Waterboarding.. sold as not torture.
Track record on electing.. Bush. On the large numbers who voted on a ticket with Palin. 2000 and 2004 elections. Creationism. Falsifying evidences to invade a foreign country - in this century. 53% of news on climate change scientifically biased.

Soo, I don't understand what are the bases for that moral superiority.

You have elected Obama. Good. Congratulations.
That is not a certificate of grandiosity.
Is only a good indicator for the possibility of future grandiosity.

Rafa--your characterization of Einstein is a gross...

2009-01-21T01:41:00.000-05:00

Rafa--your characterization of Einstein is a gross oversimplification. I would suggest that you read "Subtle is the Lord", a scientific biography of Einstein by Abraham Pais, a fellow physicist if you want to get a better idea of Einstein's views.

SnWsorry, but you said "I think it's better to be ...

2009-01-21T01:08:00.000-05:00

SnW

sorry, but you said "I think it's better to be tolerant"

gawd almighty - but that word 'tolerant' I find so extremely patronizing

cuz to me it implies that one actually find the subject in question so offensive/noxious/dangerous that a clothespin on the nose [or latex gloves or hazmat suit] is required to 'tolerate' those who are different

at least that is my take, although you did use it in proper CW context...

again, sorry to rag on you BUT I am tired of being patronized & 'tolerated' by those who are more equal than others...

Well, we've gone over religion and politics. Why n...

2009-01-21T00:41:00.000-05:00

Well, we've gone over religion and politics. Why not talk about sex now so we can really piss everyone off :)

I'm not sure if I qualify as an atheist or not. I see the question of 'is there a God' as of secondary importance to the idea of the question of what is a proper mental state.

For example, let's assume that there is more to the universe than we are capable of perceiving. Not a huge stretch of the imagination, since there are things logic cannot answer (like, what is dark matter, or what makes a prion infectious), where faith fails us (like The Problem of Evil). There are also things which we cannot even perceive, such as dimensions higher than the fourth-mathematically speaking these may exist, according to Superstring theory. Now, if there are things we cannot perceive sensorally and there are concepts we cannot master logically or through faith, then it is entirely possible that we are so limited that every human conception of God(s) that have ever existed are flawed inherently-the same way a person who is completely delusional cannot grasp the true nature of himself or a blind person cannot see a painting or a deaf person cannot hear music. Sure approximations may exist-the madman may think he is Napoleon, the blind person might listen to a description and imagine the painting, and the deaf person might feel the vibrations on the floor or wall. But that's it, it's just a shadow of the real thing.

Which is why I think it's better to be tolerant of different religions-we're all just guessing anyway, and your guess is just as good as mine. And atheism too, because for all we know, they could be right as well.

The basic ideas common to most religions and humanistic philosophies-questioning, treating others with respect, compassion and valuing life- these things we can all agree are to be cherished. If I find something in the Bible, the Bhagivad Ghita, the Dahmmapada, or even the Koran that expresses those values eloquently, I latch onto it the same way I would a beautiful piece of music. I have no ideal what Beethoven was thinking about when he wrote the moonlight sonata. But it's pretty, isn't it?

re: Edge comments / atheism Of the atheists I per...

2009-01-21T00:12:00.000-05:00

re: Edge comments / atheism

Of the atheists I personally know, absolutely none state they "know with certainty" there is no God as traditionally defined.

You disagree with those who say they "know with certainty" there is no God...but where are these people? You are basically savaging a Straw Man.

The vast majority of atheists either assert their *belief* (not certainty) that there is no God, or reject the proposition that there "certainly is a God".

I wouldn't go as far as certainty, but that's the case for most everything anyway. I do think the probability such a god exists is roughly on par with the probability that The Flying Spaghetti Monster exists. Or, that there is a planet somewhere in the a universe that is precisely the same shape as Darth Vader's head, with or without helmet.

Dear Nate--Thanks for posting these two quick upda...

2009-01-20T23:43:00.000-05:00

Dear Nate--
Thanks for posting these two quick updates despite the hectic busyness of the capitol. Much appreciated.
-JJ
p.s. we would sincerely appreciate it if you'd hire someone to disemvowel the usual trolls in your comment threads. Leave their consonants to posterity, but the people writing under the personas PeteKent, Simpleton, and rays242 in this thread, for example, are not posting in good faith. They are trying very, very hard to disrupt and prevent any interesting conversations from developing organically, and their presence does your fine work a disservice.

Edge said...Let's ignore all the scientists and th...

2009-01-20T23:06:00.000-05:00

Edge said...
Let's ignore all the scientists and the fact that the polar ice caps are melting because it was cold where you're at.

The fact is that global sea ice is at the same level it was in 1979.

http://voices.kansascity.com/node/3197

I read the unscientific comment by a right-wing rag publisher.

But what I found very strange was that the publisher of the that unscientific commentary didn't provide any proof.

Go to http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/sea.ice.anomaly.timeseries.jpg to see the total sea ice for the period 1979 to present, and you will see that there is a decline in sea ice - gradual, but noticeable when you go back 30 years.

Oh, and here is an article from The Telegraph, dated 10 November, 2008, with this statement:
The North Pole has become an island for the first time in human history as climate change has made it possible to circumnavigate the Arctic ice cap.

The historic development was revealed by satellite images taken last week showing that both the north-west and north-east passages have been opened by melting ice.

"For as much as some parts of the world have devel...

2009-01-20T21:50:00.000-05:00

"For as much as some parts of the world have developed a habit of looking down on America, it's highly unlikely that any nation in Europe or most of the rest of the world would have elected someone like Barack Hussein Obama as their leader. "

What a cop out... European nations have been electing female presidents / prime ministers for years for example, and yet only in 2008 was there a serious female candidate for either party, yet alone one getting their parties nomination. That sort of thinking is half the reason the rest of the world "looks down on America".

George Washington during the darkest hours of the ...

2009-01-20T21:22:00.000-05:00

George Washington during the darkest hours of the founding of this country had simpletons with which to deal. Unpatriotic souls! More intent with tearing down instead of building up. Focused more on destroying this country than finding solutions to it's many problems. Simpletons.

George Bush did more in 8 years to damage this country than Nazi Germany during War World 2. Obama has a big job ahead to rectify the damage of the Republicans over the last 8 years.

Good Luck President Obama. You have the support of many millions of Americans. But, beware of the unpatriotic simpletons who would destroy this country.

There is equally no way to prove the nonexistence ...

2009-01-20T21:15:00.000-05:00

There is equally no way to prove the nonexistence of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

True, and I'm not out to prove or disprove that. I haven't made any dogmatic references either way. But people have on the point I was making which you childishly changed the subject to obfuscate the point.

Others, who either see no evidence of such a power and therefore conclude that there is no such power

That's fine for them. I didn't condemn the position. I simply said those who say they "know with certainty" a God does not exist are not capable of making such a statement.

or who believe in a different type of deity, should equally be left to their own beliefs or disbeliefs.

I agree. I'm leaving people to their beliefs. I just want to be left alone in mine.

There is surely nothing whatsoever logical about faith, and that's why it's called faith.

I would disagree somewhat with your broad generalization. There's a lot more factual, archaeological, and other supportive and tangible things that support one's believing to make it (faith) a much more logical position than many in the mainstream secular world would like to admit.

As for the ridiculous idea that Christians are oppressed in the U.S., that statement from you really proves that you are a paranoid nut.

Christians are hated. Maybe not oppressed, yet. And there's the whole discussion of CINO's - Christian's in Name Only. Conventional wisdom is that in the final days, the forces of evil will actually rise up through the "Christian church" and hide behind the facade of legitimacy and have the numbers to back them up, even if it's all a ruse and the people aren't actually "Christian." Notice how someone who holds a more literal interpretation of the Bible is excoriated as a freak and nutjob yet the openly sinful ones are accepted because they're "with the times." I'll tell you one thing. There's plenty of places in the Bible where God wound up standing with those very select few who were being tormented and harassed and the "cool ones" who were hip were who he was most opposed to.

Every U.S. president has been a Christian

Yeaahhhhno. We've had a lot of "Deists" but not necessarily all Christians.

and Christians are the clear majority of every federal and state legislature in the country, as well as the judiciary and the private sector.

Again, watch the CINO's.

But I'm sure they'll be putting Christians into concentration camps soon...zzz....

I'm sure it seemed illogical that someone who actually come close to exterminating the Jews about 50 years before the Holocaust. See how that turned out.

Edge posted thusly:"The strict position, one of af...

2009-01-20T20:50:00.000-05:00

Edge posted thusly:

"The strict position, one of affirming there is no God, is not valid. To state with certainty that there is no all-knowing, all-present, all-encompassing Power with infinite capabilities, one would have to have such infintie capabilities and omnipresence themselves. To my knowledge, no one does, and as such, can not say for sure there is no God."

There is equally no way to prove the nonexistence of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. If you choose to believe in an all-knowing, all-present, all-encompassing Power with infinite capabilities, that's great. Others, who either see no evidence of such a power and therefore conclude that there is no such power, or who believe in a different type of deity, should equally be left to their own beliefs or disbeliefs. There is surely nothing whatsoever logical about faith, and that's why it's called faith.

As for the ridiculous idea that Christians are oppressed in the U.S., that statement from you really proves that you are a paranoid nut. Every U.S. president has been a Christian, and Christians are the clear majority of every federal and state legislature in the country, as well as the judiciary and the private sector. But I'm sure they'll be putting Christians into concentration camps soon...zzz....

The obvious counterpoint to the "Only in America" ...

2009-01-20T20:44:00.000-05:00

The obvious counterpoint to the "Only in America" stuff is Canada. We first elected a francophone Prime Minister in 1896. We've been alternating French and English PMs ever since. Obviously, anti-French bigotry is not nearly as vitriolic as anti-black bigotry is in the States, but it certainly exists, and I think the relevant question in this case is about significant minorities. The United States should not be given extra credit for being more brutal in the past to their minorities.

That said, it's a great day for America. With any luck, it will be the start of a great era for the world.

Thank you, Nate.I won't let my mellow be harshed b...

2009-01-20T20:30:00.000-05:00

Thank you, Nate.

I won't let my mellow be harshed by either the neocon gloomers or the liberals who didn't quite get all that they want. This is a great day.

This is a great day--for Pete Kent and Statler N. Waldorf!

(209th?)

beamann - I already laid claim to the right wing c...

2009-01-20T19:23:00.000-05:00

beamann - I already laid claim to the right wing conspiracy about Roberts intentionally botching the oath.

But, I really hope we don't go back down the path of vast right wing conspiracies. However true they may be.

Eight more years. Eight more years. A bit premature, but here's to hope and optimism.

I thought that Sarah Palin was the american equiva...

2009-01-20T19:22:00.000-05:00

I thought that Sarah Palin was the american equivalent of european right-wing leaders, like the Austrian one who died, and Le Pen and the ones in the Netherlands...

On topic, I agree with Nate's assessment of the quality. Can't quite agree on the comparison to Europe. I don't even know if there is any fair parallel (blacks have been enslaved for about 300 years, another 100 years with limited rights to participate in the political system, and 40 years to build a political network). The Algerians have been in France for what... 50 years? And the Pakistani in Britain, and the Turks in Germany... Really hard to compare.
America had to fight against it's own prejudices to elect Barack Obama, the european countries are fighting to get minorities actually involved into their societies, but the minorities don't really care. There is no political movement like the Civil Rights movement in Europe, probably because it isn't really necessary.

"marc said... ...Although, on second thought, it w...

2009-01-20T19:20:00.000-05:00

"marc said...
...Although, on second thought, it will probably turn into a new birth certificate wingnut zombie mythos, i.e. that Obama is not the president because he didn't take the oath properly."

Ah, dang! I was hoping I would be the first to suggest that!!

Actually, it could fit into the nutjob playbook on either side of the spectrum: the extreme left kooks could claim that Roberts deliberately botched the oath as part of a right-wing conspiracy to invalidate Obama's presidency!

But here's hoping that the political crazies of all stripes are dispatched to the dustbin of history!

new threadup the down escaltor...

2009-01-20T19:19:00.000-05:00

new thread

up the down escaltor...