Congress actually, like, voted on something today. In fact, it was a fairly high-profile measure, the State Children's Health Insurance Program or SCHIP, which may be familiar to you as the measure that Hillary Clinton often claimed credit for during the Presidential primaries.
SCHIP passed the House by a vote of 289-139 today, getting the support of all but two Democrats and just under a quarter of Republicans. This compares with a margin of 273-156 in October 2007 when the House tried and failed to override a presidential veto on same initiative.
Does the bill's improved performance this time around simply reflect the additional seats that the Democrats have gained in the Congress? Or have minds actually been changed by Obama or the broader political environment?
The answer is a little bit of both. There are seven Congressmen, six Republicans and one Democrat, who voted for the bill today but hadn't voted to override the veto in 2007 even though they were in Congress at that time. Thy are:
- Lincoln Diaz-Balart, a moderately conservative Republican from South Florida;
- Mario Diaz-Balart, Lincoln's brother, to whom the same description applies;
- IIleana Ros-Lehtinen, another compound-named Cuban-American Republican from South Florida;
- Rodney Frelinghuysen, a fairly moderate Republican from the New Jersey suburbs;
- Mike D. Rogers, a conservative but somewhat idiosyncratic Congressman from AL-3, a racially mixed district in Eastern Alabama;
- Long Island Republican Peter King, who did not record a vote in 2007, and who is reportedly now interested in running for Senate;
- and Democrat Gene Taylor, who represents a very conservative district in the Southeast corner of Mississippi.
Conversely, there are two Representatives, both of them Republicans, who voted to override the President's veto in 2007 but voted against the bill now:
- Tom Latham from IA-4, which is a proverbial swing district in the northern portion of Iowa;
- and Cathy McMorris-Rodgers from eastern Washington state, an up-and-comer who just became vice chair of the House Republican Conference.
I'm not sure you can detect any particular pattern among the people who switched sides; there are a combination of Republican, Democratic and swing districts represented here, and several different regions of the country. There may be idiosyncratic factors in play in certain instances -- McMorris-Rodgers, for instance, voting against the bill because she just assumed a leadership position and needs to show her cojones.
Still, there was a net gain of 5 votes for the Democrats among about ~390 incumbent Congressmen. That's hardly paradigm-altering, obviously, but it makes some difference at the margins. Conceived of a bit differently, the Democrats gained the votes of about 1 in every 20 legislators who voted against the bill in 2007, while losing the votes of about 1 in every 100 who voted against it. If the same percentages carry over to the Senate, that could mean an extra 1-2 votes for them on key pieces of legislation.
1.14.2009
Signs of Democratic Coattails in SCHIP Vote?
by Nate Silver @ 9:11 PM...see also coattails, health care, house, house republicans
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47 comments
First!
I think my life is pretty much complete at that point. ;)
I think the differences are statistically indistinguishable. The Rethuglicans are going to remain Rethuglicans in the House. And it's there the Democrats have a dominating lead.
(I watched Michelle Bachman disgrace herself on CSPAN this afternoon, in yapping on the floor of the House about Barney Frank's proposed bill to nowhere to impose conditions on the bailout money already paid out and to be paid out. Boy is she a piece of work. I hope the Dems run somebody a little better than Tink in 2 years. She really is an embarassment. In the league of Sarah Palin.)
Quite a large increase of total votes in favor this time. Sixteen. Sure most are the new Dems. But here in Pennsylvania, our old, retiring Republican - Petersen - voted against SCHIP. But our new Republican - Thomson - voter FOR it. One of the counties in his red district actually went blue and others were much closer than before. Some of us made a big issue of the vote against SCHIP. May have had something to do with him seeing the light.
Sure hope so.
It's ridiculous that America socializes health care for those 65 and older, but doesn't for everyone else; from an economic perspective this is particularly ridiculous. Working people fuel the current economy and children fuel the economy's future; these are the people paying more taxes. From an economic perspective, retirees are a burden. If we are going to provide socialized medicine to anyone, we should make sure we actually spend money saving the lives of those who are contributing most to the tax base.
This is off topic but I cannot find out elsewhere so am desperately seeking info here...
What gives with the Minnesota Senate contest? That is, what is the schedule and procedure for the contest phase with the 3 judge panel? Coleman wants to start the hearing in February but the law says 20 days after filing contest which is January 26.
Is this more like a trial or more like a hearing?
Franken's filing, as usual, is concise, well written, and based on law and precedent. He makes the point over and over that this court has NO jurisdiction over a Federal Senate seat - only the Senate can judge members qualifications. So they should certify him. And he also rebuts all other arguments - overvotes, lost ballots, absentee ballots, etc.
Coleman's brief is weird - I don't understand it at all. He seems to be asking for a re-recount without specifying what and where he actually wants to recount. He actually has blanks where the precinct and dates are to be.
Now two groups in Minnesota are suing the SOS. Franken's group - 65 voters - want their wrongly rejected absentee ballots counted. (Interesting aside - they all state in their filing that they voted for Franken.)
The Coleman group wants duplicate ballots uncounted - although they do not have any actual ballots to cite. If the recount has already been certified by the Canvassing Board, isn't it too late to start counting again? But what other relief would the absentee voters have?
Is there a lawyer somewhere who can make sense of this?
HELP!!
Where's the cool CD map for this
vote?
I thought even more impressive was the 68-24 vote in the Senate for Bingaman's Lnd Management Act. Republicans didn't even try to filibuster. I think maybe people have so far been overestimating the Senate republicans ability to stop legislation with just 41 members - they really have like no margin for error whatsoever.
Minnesota contest: Lots of info here, updated daily:
http://winerev.dailykos.com/
and one of mine
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/1/8/114047/1724/800/681601
Thanks, Nate. I will be calling Vitter and Landrieu first thing before class to demand they support SCHIP when it hits the Senate floor.
I am not sure that you can convert changes in the House to changes in the Senate. Because of gerrymandering, most House Republicans are from districts which are not particular in favor of SCHIP and most House Democrats are from districts that like SCHIP. Senators have much more closely divided constituencies. As such, they have to be more aware of the desire of the majority for improved health care.
As to Minnesota, schedule and procedure are apparently still to be set by the three judge panel which was appointed earlier this week.
I think Franken likes the fact that Coleman proposed such an extended schedule since it will increase the chance that the Minnesota Supreme Court will order the election certified.
You know, now that all the old 2008 data is off the front page here, it reminds me...
It would be interesting to see a review of the performance of pollsters in the 2008 election. Also a review of the performance of 538's pollster ratings and regression analysis. And an update of the electoral history charts, which I've been unable to update for some time.
It seems odd to go through all that trouble during the 2008 campaign to try and predict what would happen, and then not to do at least one post reviewing what actually did happen.
I second jpm's request - I'd like to see the cool cd map of this vote.
JPM - Many, many thanks. Just what an obsessed reader like me was looking for. I read Daily KOS every day but somehow missed this section.
If the S-CHIP vote gained four votes from Republicans, and if there are 21 more Democrats and fewer Republicans in the House than last year, how come S-CHIP gained "just" 16-17 votes?
It must have lost the votes of several of the new Democrats in Congress, who are mostly on the rightward edge of the party. This should make you wonder how reliable they are if they vote against better healthcare for kids, a core Democratic principle.
The "Rethuglican" thing, even though frequently absolutely true, is childish. An environment which allows infantile insults like Rethuglican or Dumbocrat to be thrown around with glee is an environment that fosters participants like Mule Rider.
On-topic, the real question is the content of the bill, without which, we're really making an apples-to-oranges. They're not simply binary voting SCHIP good/SCHIP bad, but on the balance of the costs and benefits. You'd really need to have specific information from people that did change their votes - speculation is quite difficult given the enormous number of variables involved, even if the bills are identical. Given the small sample size, I'm not sure we can really draw any larger conclusions.
the comparison in votes would appear to indicate pretty short coattails
but the margin is more than comfortable & no need to worry about a veto overide
the Congressional cartogram on the right would be close to worthless at that scale for effective analysis
Nate, where is the Senate version ? Maybe give it a test drive now using the Land Management Act votes ???
sure hope you decided to use version D [or a better version] & change GREEN=IND to YELLOW
Brian Jenkins:
"If the S-CHIP vote gained four votes from Republicans, and if there are 21 more Democrats and fewer Republicans in the House than last year, how come S-CHIP gained `just' 16-17 votes?
It must have lost the votes of several of the new Democrats in Congress"
Brian, that reasoning is incorrect. Remember that there are always some Representatives who don't vote.
The 3 Cuban Republicans voted for the bill because it included a provision that allowed legal immigrants to get Medicare and Medicaid as soon as they got their green cards, instead of waiting 5 years. So that provision accounts for almost half the Republican pickups on the bill.
I'd guess another factor is that most major entitlements (Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, welfare, etc.) are initially proposed by the left, but eventually it becomes unthinkable to terminate them. Would Republicans vote to end Social Security entirely, now?
Will there be coat-tails on the TARP funds? This vote may not be analyze-able as alot of votes switched AFTER Paulson wasted the first TARP funds, but...
Republicans already seem to agree that Obama has more cred on the economy than the entire Bush administration:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/01/14/obama-would-spend-bailout_n_158052.html
Hi guys,
I read two post below about Palin.
What can I say Nate...you said she is talented,I think she's really far away from talent,but in the other hand,I think she is really dangerous not only for USA but for the entire planet.
So better hope for Obama making a well done job in the office.
btw:
where is Sir Sean Quinn ??
I really miss him !
bye.
:)
Sigh. Why am I not surprised to see that my Congressman, Ken Calvert, who has the dubious distinction of being named one of the most corrupt members of Congress, voted against this legislation.
At least Boxer and Feinstein look solid to support it in the Senate.
California is so schizophrenic. No wonder we're nearly bankrupt.
Nate-
"Thy are" should be "They are"
Thy truly needs a spell checker. Type in Firefox, the spellchecker is free. Just sayin
wv - hestoss - being seated by Grace Jones at your fav restaurant
matador,
There is a difference between 'talented' and 'intelliget'. Nate said Palin is talented. He did NOT say she is intelligent.
Brad, don't you realize that a spell checker wouldn't help with "Thy are"? "Thy" is a word.
@ ABowers: Deffo go and check out The UpTake, a citizen journo site that, when there's something to cover, provides as much live streaming coverage as it can cobble together.
Archived video galore from the recount phase, and a "live blog" (please --don't call it "chat") that you can jump in on. Who knew that participatory democracy as a group exercise in watching paint dry could be so much fun!
So bookmark it, and when arguments before the three-judge panel get going, you can bet that the good folks from The 'Take will be all over it. Get invoLOLved!
The "Rethuglican" thing, even though frequently absolutely true, is childish.
Correct, which is why I refer to them something else that I wouldn't presume to post to the comments section of a family-friendly blog --but I'll go so far as to say that it makes creative use of a thoroughly crude gynecological epithet that calls to mind Ann Coulter, Michele Bachmann, "Mean" Jean Schmidt, etc.
Michael-
Don't you realize that almost all spell checkers have a grammar chesker, and I think they flag old English. "Thy" is singular, BTW, "are" is not...
Regarding the 3 from South Florida, they all faced serious challengers in the last election.
The pressure they faced, including the ongoing TV commercials slamming them on their repeated votes against SCHIP, is what made them come around this time.
It's a simple story of people trying to keep their jobs. I wouldn't look too much deeper for an answer.
Nope. Spell check and grammar check aren't the same. I use Firefox, for example, which has a built-in spell checker, but thank God, no built-in grammar checker. I think grammar checkers suck, by the way, and were programmed by people who have a poor command of English grammar. To give one example, Microsoft Word's grammar checker would have a comma appear before every instance of "who" and "which." "I want you to meet the man, who is wearing a pink shirt" is incorrect unless "the man" is a nickname he's known by, or perhaps if he's the only man in the room. There should be no comma in that instance because the "who" clause is otherwise central and not incidental to the identification of the man. I'm a college professor, writing tutor, and published author, and I am here to tell you, there is no substitute for proofreading. Period. Though a spell-checker without automatic substitution can be helpful at the margins.
hear, hear Michael on grammar checkers. We have lots of tussles where I am over the so-called "Oxford comma". I'm not wedded to a set of rules. For me, it's all about clarifying the sense of a sentence.
Oh, and on topic, I think what this shows is that if enough constituents put pressure on their representative to vote for something, then they will do it - precisely because they are afraid they won't get re-elected. As the US appears to be getting more Democrat, then the House should move towards a more Democrat-leaning stance overall, as Republicans in districts which are moving Dem have to adjust their positions to maintain the support of their electorates.
Mrs B, thanks for taking things back on topic.
I think you're right in cases where Republicans still represent districts which are becoming more Democratic-leaning, to the point where they are swing or nearly swing districts. But the thing is, most such districts are by now already represented by Democrats, leaving mostly hard-right districts under hard-right Republican representation. And some of those districts, for example in the Deep South and Appalachia, moved even further Republican in the 2008 election. So while the increase in Democratic representation will undoubtedly move the House in a more liberal direction, it's quite a bit less clear that the leftward movement will rub off on the Republican members, generally.
I think it is interesting that 3 of these new votes came from FL - which is now the epitome of a swing state.
I wanted to write "swingingest" there, but am not sure that description would create quite the impression I wanted: it conjures up bowls of car keys, polyester and bad 70s hair cuts.......
2 of those votes from FL were from a married couple, lets be a bit wary of making sweeping comments about the broad House based on one household.
FL's Senate seat may well be red in 2010, as the leading repub is a strong Bushie (Jeb in this case) and a cuban.
I don't see how you can say that IA-4 (Latham) is a "proverbially swing district." It may not be as solidly Republican as King's district,but it is strongly Republican. I can't imagine a Democrat winning in 4. In any case, Iowa will lose a seat after the 2010 Census and there will be redistricting (which is actually done in an impartial, fair way here).
a bit off topic, but relates back to the Caroline Kennedy thread:
so how many people in the House are either a) related to each other or b) related to a previous senator/representative?
McMorris-Rodgers, ... needs to show her cojones.
Previously, she bucked her party; this time she voted along with them. How is that showing cojones? Sound more that she needed to show her sheep-like blind devotion to the party.
Michael Chibnik:
The figures I've seen for IA-4 show its PVI as barely Democratic, something like D +0.2. Of course, that's for presidential votes, not House.
Brad: Jeb Bush announced like 2 weeks ago that he will not be running for the Senate in 2010.
The pattern I see is that most of these congresspersons needed to show their conservative bonafides in an election year, but they actually knew that in practical terms, it wasn't right, so they voted for it once it was safe.
Called Vitter and Landrieu's offices to ask for them to vote in favor of SCHIP. Feeling like Landrieu might, not so sure about Vitter.
On "compound names":
You know Hispanic people generally use two last names, right? So the whole hyphenation "compound name" thing really in a way our construction, because they wouldn't be hyphenated in Spanish, they'd just be your two last names. It's a result of imposing our strict "one last name only" policy on their "what do you mean you only use one of your parents' last names? Of course I use both of them, I have two parents" situation.
The only people who think that Rodney Frelinghuysen is a moderate only pay attention to who he stands next to for photo opps, not who he supports once he gets to Capitol Hill. I am surprised he voted in favor of this, he has consistently opposed anything that helps the people in his district throughout his tenure.
http://www.tomwyka.com/downloads/rodney_report_card_bw.pdf
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