1.27.2009

Fili-Buster Watch

Which Senate Republicans have voted the most often with the Obama Administration so far?

Yes, the Senate is actually voting on stuff. Not a lot of stuff, but there are perhaps seven nontrivial votes for us to chew over. These include confirmation votes for Tim Geithner and Hillary Clinton, the bailout extension, both a cloture vote and an up-and-down vote the Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, and both a cloture vote and an up-and-down vote on the Omnibus Public Land Management Act.

One Republican, Olympia Snowe of Maine, has taken the administration's position on all seven votes, as indicated by a blue square in chart below. Two, David Vitter of Louisiana and Jim DeMint of South Carolina, have gone 7-for-7 in opposing the administration (as denoted in red). A couple more thoughts follow after the graphic.



After Snowe, two Republicans have supported the administration on 6 of 7 votes: George Voinovich of Ohio and Judd Gregg of New Hampshire. Voinovich, who always ranks as among the most moderate Republicans, isn't really a surprise, but Gregg, who has a fairly conservative voting record, perhaps is. Such are the perils of running for re-election in a state that Obama won by 10 points.

All of the Republican women voted for Ledbetter, although they're also a fairly moderate lot with the possible exception of Kay Bailey Hutchinson; it would have been interesting to see how Elizabeth Dole would have voted on the measure.
A bunch of western senators supported the administration on the Land Management vote, which may reflect regional considerations rather than partisan ones.

Susan Collins has broken with Olympia Snowe twice, on Geithner and on TARP. I don't know if anything in particular is driving this, although Snowe has two fewer years to go until re-election.

Arlen Specter has not been particularly helpful to the administration so far, nor really has John McCain. Lamar Alexander and the two senators from Utah, somewhat surprisingly, have been on some issues.

On the Ledbetter Act, there were quite a few more votes for cloture than there were for passage, a pattern that may tend to repeat itself on other fairly popular pieces of legislation. Might that include the stimulus? I don't know.

But overall, there aren't too many surprises here. If there's news, it's that Judd Gregg may have emerged as a top-tier potential filibuster-breaking vote.

112 comments

mhz said...

Nate is AMAZING- Who needs Roll CAll- well I guess Nate does.

andrew said...

This is a cool graphic. You should keep a running tally for how the R Senators vote on all the major pieces of legislation from here forward using this same graph.

BTW, now that the frontrunner Alex Sink has decided not to run, what do you think the chances are for a D pickup?

SantaTurdo said...

Nice use of Lego- reminds me of my days in Copenhagen...

SantaTurdo said...

Taegan Moongibbon's wire: More Americans have turned into dumbasses since Nate Silver became a media 'star'.

Alex S. said...

Gregg is making the run of his political life, just like ex-Oregon senator Smith. I am surprised about Murkowski, and, in the other way, about Specter. But well, Specter needed to avoid a primary challenge and for now, he's done it. Vitter is doing the same. Jim DeMint is really the most anti-Obama senator there is at the moment. I wouldn't be surprised if we heard him saying that he wants Obama to fail.
Hmm, I wonder what keeps Sen. Snowe in the Repubican party. Is there any issue left? She's pro-choice, accepts that climate change is man-made, economically progressive... Well, at least she can probably have her senate seat for as long as she wants.
Btw, lol @ Sen. Bunning. Doesn't want to anger a single voter so he abstains.

Seth said...

This is a brilliant graphic. I'd definitely like to see more like this in the future. Good work.

D said...

"Susan Collins has broken with Olympia Snowe twice, on Geithner and on TARP. I don't know if anything in particular is driving this, although Snowe has two fewer years to go until re-election."


Olympia Snowe is an institution in Maine. She has nothing to fear from any challengers, Republican or Democrat, for as long as she chooses to run.

And in this, you may have your answer as to what's driving the difference between Collens' and Snowe's voting so far. Like Arlen Spector, Collens is still potentially susceptible to a challenge from her right.

wv: fooph. I don't have anything witty for this one. It's just such a cool word, I had to share.

SNED said...

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/01/27/castellanos.minnesota/index.html

Yet another person with absolutely no understanding of the recount in Minnesota weighs in on CNN. Why do they keep giving clueless people a forum like this?

(I hate the WV but:
mulazing

I find it bleeping mulazing people just don't understand the how transparent the recount was.)

Omar said...

A correction about Lily Ledbetter: it required 60 votes to pass. So voting for cloture on LL, and then voting against LL, isn't necessarily indicative of a reticence to filibuster.

Another Mike said...

Collins simply is more conservative than is Snowe. I think they're both voting their consciences.

What's up with 12 Republicans voting for cloture on Ledbetter but then voting against the actual bill? Likewise, 4 Republicans voted for cloture on the Lands Bill but then voted against it.

The Southern Socialist said...

Love this kind of graphic, but I'd also be interested to see the same thing for the Democrats. I'm sure that there would be a lot more blue, but where the red dots are could be very interesting...

liberal_defender_of_freedom said...

Those voting against the Ledbetter act are gutless turds, seriously.

Michael said...

Omar posted the following:

"A correction about Lily Ledbetter: it required 60 votes to pass."

AFTER cloture? Are you SURE? Please explain.

kimmy said...

That ledbetter act must have been toxic ...

juvanya said...

The Dems should use the Lily Ledbetter stuff to accuse the GOP of being an enemy of women.

Joe The Fake Virginian said...

This Mainer-In-Exile knows that Senator Olympia Snowe has NOTHING to fear in any future senate election.

She is adored and respected, by enemies and friends in the state. Her positions are clearly defined and usually easily predictable. Like her constituents, she can hold some otherwise contradictory opinions, such as not really caring about pushing a social agenda while insisting on fiscal responsibility.

Senator Susan Collins is merely tolerated and only belongs in the conversation because she is also a female, Republican Senator from Maine.

Finally, when dealing with Senators from small population states, one must always remember that SENATOR is the typical pinnacle of political power that can be achieved. Governor is a joke, because of legislated and societal term limits.

Usually, senators from low-population states "retire" from their seats by becoming part of an administration. From Maine, this would be Senators George Mitchell and William Cohen. Otherwise, they stay in office for as long as they desire.

Omar said...

Mike:

There are frequently unanimous consent agreements which specify the rules surrounding a piece of legislation, i.e. 60 votes are required to pass, in exchange for limiting the time of debate. If you look up roll calls on the Senate web page, it'll say the threshold of passage; in this case, it was 3/5.

Now, why there was both a cloture vote and a unanimous consent agreement, I can't tell. Senate business can be be slowed by all sorts of nonsense from what I understand, so maybe the agreement was a concession that the Dems made in favor of expediting LL's passage.

Shefik said...

Hey all. Nate pointed out that some senators voted AGAINST cloture, but FOR passage... But can someone explain to me why senators like Robert and Graham would vote FOR cloture, but AGAINST passage?

Shefik said...

Roberts, rather -- my bad.

Skeptic said...

Nate gets five stars on this article. It is a great analysis and very telling. The MSM is devoid of analysis like this and too involved in spinning whatever it is they happen to want to spin. This also shows that the hoopla over the magic 60 has been the most overblown item since Y2K. More is better but these cloture votes hardly ever break along party lines.

DCM in FL said...

waiting for the comparable DEM chart to see if all the Blue Dawgs are toeing the line - as well as to see who is not voting or absent or 'vacant'...

WV - hearian [what the MN SCOTUS is undergoing with the Colmean suit]

Greg said...

@Another Mike AND Shefik

One reason people would vote for cloture but against the bill is that they don't want to see a filibuster. Just because you're a Republican doesn't mean you want to fight against every single piece of Democratic legislation as hard as you can. You vote for cloture so you don't have to worry about annoying filibusters, but vote against it so you can tell your constituencies and party that you're doing what they want.

Skeptic said...

What's up with McCain and McConnell? Identical records. Is McConnell now mavericky or is McCain really a conservative dud faking maverickiness?

LAW said...

Absolutely fascinating graphic. Can you keep doing this on a regular basis?

Chachy said...

I'm surprised, actually, at how much diversity there is in these voting patterns. I'm not surprised by Snowe or Voinovich; and I'm not surprised by DeMint and Vitter. I am surprised at how many R senators clump in the middle: 12 of them voted no on only 2 or 3 of these issues.

I really think the Dems 59 votes are stronger than people are giving them credit for. If every one of those 12 Senators votes for cloture just 5% of the time - on top of the 3 legitimately moderate votes of Snowe, Voinovich and, I guess, Gregg - the Democrats ought to be able to kill the filibuster the vast majority of the time.

Cameron said...

I join with those who have commented on this graphic as being an awesome way to track the votes. It would be wonderful if you continued tracking votes this way, perhaps with the full congress instead of just the Republicans.

Shefik said...

Thanks, Greg! That makes sense.

Pragmatus said...

I agree--let's see the entire Senate votes next time, but I'd also advocate for separate Democratic-Republican columns.

obsessed said...

Wow - I LOVE that chart - very clear and very informative. Please please please install this puppy in the frame, like the old election graphics. This could get very interesting as more and more Senate votes occur.

obsessed said...

DCM: waiting for the comparable DEM chart to see if all the Blue Dawgs are toeing the line

great idea!

Cugel said...

I got your bi-partisanship right here, buddy!

Digby has this pefectly right, we can forget about the phony promise of "bi-partisanship" from Republicans. They WANT Obama to fail because they don't want another New Deal, and they will do everything in their power to scream and throw tantrums and get in the way. And the corporate media has bought it hook line and sinker:

The GOP hissy fit has worked like a charm. The villagers are all on the same page: the "problem," as always, is that Democrats are not doing everything they are precisely told to do by the Republicans. They are being partisan. The Republicans weeping and wailing like Victorian spinsters works every time.

Brewer went on to harangue a Democratic spokesman about all these allegedly superfluous programs in the bill and finally demanded: "The Democrats were wrong, right? They were wrong!" Now, Brewer is a very silly media person. But she doesn't think this stuff up on her own. She follows the party line. And it's pretty clear which party that is."


It's time Democrats started fighting back against this insane media spin "these people don't pay taxes!" (except that they do: payroll and excise taxes of course), but apparently that doesn't count to the media blowhards!

And womens' reproductive services "has nothing to do with the economy, right?!" except that it's a service in high demand, and they have to go out and hire health-care workers to meet it, don't they?

This crap just goes on and on.

Obama can totally forget about doing anything to appease Republicans. THERE IS NO Bi-partisanship. "Bi-partisan" is simply a word meaning: "you should ignore all the people who got you elected and do everything Republicans say."

Well, screw that noise and the horse it rode in on! We got 8 years of the shaft anytime a Democrat tried to come up with an idea -- Bush even vetoed anything Democrats tried to do, and there was NO such thing as "bi-partisanship."

It's time Obama figured out that he's NOT going to win over these people, no matter what "concessions" he makes. They are out to destroy him! NO Compromise!

Mainer said...

Hate to say it, but Collins is not vulnerable in Maine, even from the right.

She has a different voting record from Snowe because Snowe is a true moderate and Collins is not. People in and out of Maine tend to think of them as about the same -- they are not. Collins talks a good game about bipartisanship but is clearly more conservative than Snowe. Sometimes that comes out on cloture votes or amendments, but it always comes out. Unfortunately, now that Collins has a seat on the Appropriations committee, she'll be quite loathe to give up that seat.

Rudy said...

What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.

Nate's chart should be kept for both sides of the aisle. It would be just as iluminating on the Dem side, especially when the Dems start wondering why filibusters work so easily.

Why haven't those congressional Dems learned from the Republican mistakes when it controlled both the presendency and congress, promptly overreaching and begging for filibusters?

If the point is whether the so-called stimulus bill can pass and survive a filibuster, no it cannot. I don't even think they can get all the dem senators to shut down a filibuster on this ode to pork.

Huge mistake by the congressional leadership to try to muscle such a ridiculous overreach. The honeymoon will be over with nary an orgasm, all because they insisted on working the back door prematurely.

Statler N Waldorf said...

Please let Franken take his seat soon.

Michael said...

Rudy, I think your prediction is totally off the wall. The stimulus will pass both houses handily. Cugel, all Obama needs is a working majority that includes some Republicans some of the time. Remember how Reagan's door was always open for any member of Congress, Democratic or Republican? Same with Obama. As for reproductive services, that'll be passed in another bill.

Katharine said...

Great Job. But I didn't really expect to see any nostalgia, even of the hypothetical sort, for Elizabeth Dole. I can say that we don't miss her.

Would love to see this continued including the democrats and other legislation.

Rudy said...

We'll see, Michael. I think you're sorely overestimating. But that's par for the course for the power hungry until reality sets in.

Allen said...

Let me join hordes asking for a similar chart to be kept for the Dems as well. In addition to Begich (to whom I gave money) there are a number of other nominal Dems who may vote read rather than blue (like the newly appointed senator from NY).

Chris said...

Apologies, but may I have a tantrum?

Will everyone on the left stop their freaking garment-rending over Kristen Gillibrand already?

Yeah, she's a blue dog, and she's more conservative than most other NY Democrats. But Jesus, even New York's Republicans would be more aligned with D's in most of the country.

Not only that, she's from NY. She starts acting like a Republican, she's likely going to have her ass handed to her in 2010.

So she's a member of the NRA. SO FREAKING WHAT. I trust that she'll do fine, just like I had faith that pretty much, y'know, anyone else, y'know, on the, y'know, shortlist would have done, y'know, fine. Y'know. (Yeah, I think Caroline would have made an okay senator. She couldn't be worse than Inhofe. Or even as embarrassing as Burris was making the TV show rounds.)

I thought Democrats were known for not foisting ideological purity on every member to the point where they're all lockstep with whatever Olbermann says.

Okay, I'm done. I'm just...Christ, give the woman a chance, will you?

NU Star said...

Not sure why this Nate Silver site gets so much attention, while this awesome one gets ignored: http://burritobracket.blogspot.com/

Chris said...

That said, I would like to see who is holding and who is breaking on the other side of the aisle with Big O. It'd seem like...uh...4 Dems (we're at 99 now, right? And 58-41 split) broke on the Geithner nom, for example. And 4 further sat it out. (Since Bond was the only Republican to sit out Geithner's confirmation and the split on the right was 10-30.)

I can understand breaking on Geithner (lol taxes), but still.

Also, watching Maddow right now. (Well, the rebroadcast.) Did Blago just drag one of my senators into this? NO. BAD HELMET-HAIRED GOVERNOR. BAD. KEEP NJ AWAY FROM THE CRAZY.

But I'm like paying half attention, so.

Allen said...

Chris -

No, you may not have a tantrum. I think my words were that she and Begich (not bothering to mention the blue dogs whom we already know about) "may vote read [ok, I meant red] than blue". It isn't just the new NY senator's (I'd name her but I don't want to make an idiot of myself by not spelling her name correctly) position as 100% rated by the NRA but also her anti-choice position. So I'm just saying let's have Nate track ALL the Dem votes and we can all make an informed opinion.

Blanche said...

Five thirty eighters,
Can someone GPS Diaper Dave's Depends and get us some hooker video so we can get rid of this literal assclown? Even by our loose Louisiana standards he is an embarrassment as a Senator. Anyone? Anyone? Oh, and in the House we could surely do without Combover John Fleming...is there anyone on wide stance watch these days? I will make you some jambalaya you will relive on your deathbed if you can help.

DCM in FL said...

BLANCHE

tap, tap, tap
wiggle, wiggle...

I heard they were hangin out with Chain Gang Charlie over here in Tallahassee on the weekends

[just doing research - honest]

anyway, I luv me some jambalaya ! how bout some gumbo & a few crawdads too...

David said...

Can someone please explain this to me? I guess I am an idiot and misreading the graph.

It looks like Enzi voted against cloture in S. 22, which means he supported a potential filibuster?

Yet, he voted for it?

Is that right? If not, please explain it, if it is then please explain his vote.

I understand wanting a bill to go to a vote and then voting nay, but this makes no sense to me.

David said...

You really should have Lieberman on this list as he is a Republican at heart.

DCM in FL said...
This post has been removed by the author.
DCM in FL said...

DAVID

note that Alexander, Corker & even Specter also voted against cloture on 22 before they voted for the bill.

maybe the GOPers were just flexing their mini-muscle to see how many cloture votes the DEMs could [or couldn't] actually muster...

only 2 GOPers [Ms Lindsay Graham & Roberts] voted the reverse - for cloture on 22 but then against the actual bill.

that actually makes more intuitive sense - just avoid the filibuster & vote the bill up or down

JMNorris said...

@SNED

Good link. Castellanos looks to me a bit like Jon Lovitz, fitting given the latter's most well-known SNL character. The sad thing is that the pro-Franken article this was paired with is also very bad. Begala sounds as if Coleman should still drop out even if Coleman's case was strong. Please. Coleman should give up because he doesn't have a legal leg to stand on, not because he's inconveniencing MN.

mirrormirror said...

Totally OT, but I thought this was interesting given our recent debate following Nate's espousal of the tired old 'only in America' maxim...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/iris-lee/icelandic-pm-would-be-wor_b_161311.html

Chris said...

Apologies.

I see what you're getting at, but it was kind of a knee-jerk reaction to the blogosphere's "OMG SHE'S A REPUBLICAN SHE'LL AMEND THE CONSTITUTION TO BAN GAY MARRIAGE FOREVER AND COCKBLOCK OBAMA AT EVERY STEP" reaction to anything related to her. I shouldn't have directed that at you, per se.

That said, I do agree that it'd be interesting to see the breakdown so far for Dems, though I think they're pretty much a solid bloc so far. As I did a quick calculation, though - on the two votes where I know the numbers, Dems were almost entirely in lockstep with the administration. (Well, kind of. I think 1 abstained for Clinton (was that Kennedy?), and 4 abstained for Geithner, and 4 voted against him.)

For the record, I also thought Gillibrand (I did use her name - I'm actually more apt to have messed up her first name) was pro-choice, but perhaps I'm projecting.

Anyway. So, excusing that...I decided to do a bit of Google-Fu over at WaPo. The average party score for a Democrat currently is 95.6%, and the average for a Republican is 74.6%. (Now, voting with Republicans is not inherently the same as voting against Democrats, so this isn't the same analysis as Nate's post. But you know.) Breakdown in next comment.

Michael said...

Cugel, who the hell are "the villagers"? I keep reading that obscure reference on Daily Kos. I figured out some time that it doesn't refer to residents of Greenwich Village.

Rudy, you're a complete idiot for calling an American citizen who's not in government "power hungry." You're also nuts for thinking that a unified Republican party will block the economic stimulus and usher in a depression. And basically, my suspicion is that you're a stupid troll. There will not be 41 Republican votes to filibuster the stimulus to death in the Senate. I'll bet somewhere between 5 and 10 Senate Republicans will vote for it outright, either because their states desperately need it or they simply support it, even if it doesn't have the ideal ratio of tax cuts and spending for their taste.

Mike in Maryland said...

Anyone who wants to see the roll call votes can go to http://thomas.loc.gov/home/rollcallvotes.html

That page lets you select House or Senate, and goes from the current session of the 111th Congress back to the second session of the 101st Congress (1989-90) for the Senate, first session of the 101st Congress (1989-90) for the House.

Rudy said...

Michael, get a grip. The so-called stimulus package has very little stimulus in it and is a Porky Pig wish list. How can you be surprised at that if you're paying any attention at all to the real world? Surely you've looked beyond the title of the bill.

The filibuster threat will be effective in redirecting the emphasis here, and if the Dems are so stubborn to not put more real stimulus in it and cut the crap, it is they who are at fault, not Republicans who won't support it.

Don't be a drone.

Chris said...

Okay, back. But first:

DCM: only 2 GOPers [Ms Lindsay Graham

Oh no you di'nt.

I laughed. I shouldn't have, but I did.

Anyway. So, last comment was discussing something I found on WaPo (not an in-depth analysis, but you know).

Interestingly, one of the senators with a perfect record of voting with Dems so far?

Mark Begich (D-AK).

Currently, the least in-line senator on the blue side is...*drumroll*

Russ Feingold, who's broken with the party on 3 occasions so far. (75% alignment on 12 votes, so 3 times so far he's broken.) This is more than more traditional worries like Jim Webb (D-VA) and Ben Nelson (D-NE) (who, on the same number of votes, have 83.3% alignment), and Tester, Lincoln, and Landrieu (who, on the votes they've taken - same number as Feingold - have only broken ONCE).

As a matter of fact, excluding Feingold, Webb, and Nelson, none of the Democratic senators have voted against party on more than one occasion. (Of course, there have been abstentions, but...well.) Feingold is in the same tier as Lamar Alexander (R-TN) and James Risch (R-ID), and has broken with party at least as often as Mel Martinez (R-FL), Thad Cochran (R-MS), and Arlen Specter (R-PA) have. (Martinez and Specter each took one less vote than Feingold, so they have slightly lower scores. Cochran took one more vote, and thus has a higher score.)

Unsurprisingly, the most itinerant senator on the right side is Olympia Snowe (R-ME) in a landslide. What's not striking is so much her placement as her score - she voted with Republicans only 25% (3/12) of the time, miles behind Susan Collins' (R-ME) second-place score of 53.8% (7/13). Not surprisingly, Judd Gregg (R-NH) and George Voinovich (R-OH) are right behind with 54.5% scores (6/11).

It's early in this session still - this Congress has been in office less than a month. But so far, Dems have been pretty much in step, with their LOWEST scoring Dem beating the Republican average and only 2 other Democrats dissenting more than once.

Also, for the record:

Lindsey Graham (R-SC) voted with the Republican party on 9/11 votes. (Yes, 9/11, or 81.8%.) Just thought you might like to know.

Only 1 Republican has a record of voting with his party 100% of the time - and that'd be Saxby "I'm More Of A Hero Than The Triple Amputee" Chambliss (R-GA). I believe 44 Democratic senators voted with their parties 100% of the time, but among those are Biden, Clinton, and Salazar - who are not part of this Congress anymore. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-NY - and I believe I misspelled her name earlier, oops) also has a 100% rating but only has two votes under her belt. So, taking that into account, you can honestly say that so far, 40 Democratic senators have 100% records, and 1 does but we'll put an asterisk next to her name because she just got in two days ago.

Vitter broke once (on the Clinton confirmation, I believe), and DeMint twice (once was on the Clinton vote).

So, at a glance...while a comparison would be interesting, I hope you enjoy seeing lots of blue.

Mike in Maryland said...

Rudy said...
The filibuster threat will be effective in redirecting the emphasis here, and if the Dems are so stubborn to not put more real stimulus in it and cut the crap. . . .

Care to define what YOU call crap and what YOU call stimulus?

Chris said...

...and of course, I meant to say that Russ Feingold was D-WI, but you guys already knew that.

I didn't use their full names, but - again - Jon Tester's D-MT, Blanche Lincoln's D-AR, and Mary Landrieu's D-LA. (To not put too fine a point on it, if you know anything about Louisiana, that last one should have been obvious.)

Opus 132 said...

Anybody know why Feingold voted against cloture on the Public Land Management Act?

He was the only Democrat to do so.

loomisnews said...

Nice breakdown to make your point graphically.

I think you shoulda left out the Clinton nomination though, it's so lopsided it obscures more than illuminates the issues.

W/o it in, it shows 10 solid anti-Obama senators (almost 25% of sitting GOP senators) who reflect the real core of the party.

Rudy said...

That's exactly the problem, Mike in MD. The definition of stimulus has been so tortured in this bill that it's hard to find much real stimulus in there.

Real stimulus creates productive economic activity that can be sustained and expanded by priming the pump. Tax cuts are the proven best way of doing that. Anything that creates incentives for people to be productive is stimulus. There's not nearly enough of that in this bill, and way too much slow-starting wish-list pork to favored political constituencies. That list is long, and constitutes what I and most others would call crap. Sure, one can argue that any spending is somewhat stimulative, but so is hiring people to dig holes and hiring others to fill them back up.

gotoran said...

Please don't even BEGIN to suggest that there's any such as a fillibuster any more. There isn't, but the Democrat senate majority should start forcing the issue. That's right, a REAL fillibuster where the opposition must stand up and read for hours on end from a phone book. The "gentlemen's" agreement that both sides have not to REALLY fillibuster is most nauseating. In this economic climate, it would be WONDERFUL to watch the media coverage of the GOP reading from the phone book, and then explaining to the reporters why they're blocking the stimulus package.

RufusRules said...

There may be no need to worry about filibusters if Obama keeps this up. Boehner and Cantor could have trouble keeping control of the troops in the wake of the Obama charm offensive.

Paul from Santa Fe said...

EMILY's List says Gillibrand is pro-choice. Ellen Malcolm just sent around an e-mail saying so. They pay pretty close attention to that particular matter, so I tend to believe them.

Mrs B said...

Rufus that was a good link and shows just what the GOP is up to - telling their guys to vote against the stimulus BEFORE they heard what Obama had to say. Just a little bit stupid. The telling bit in the article was where Obama said he was disappointed that the GOP senators weren't actually as familiar with the content of the stimulus as he would have liked.

Stone said...

Yeah, Rudy, tax cuts will do, sure...
Sprout your Republican talking points somewhere else.

Care to explain what all this "pork" is supposed to be?

RufusRules said...

@Mrs B: telling their guys to vote against the stimulus BEFORE they heard what Obama had to say.

Ah yes, zombie politics. And both parties are guilty of it. How cool would it be if Obama could effect some change in that regard? Consider: our elected representatives thinking for themselves and engaging in the process of governing for the benefit of the people, not in the furtherance of ideology or because their party leader "says so." What a concept.

RufusRules said...

Caveat: Not the Rod Blagojevich version of "governing for the benefit of the people."

Cugel said...

Michael, the "Villagers" are the out of touch, inside-the-beltway media talking-heads, who always go to the same parties with the same so-called "experts" who are responsible for everything that's gone wrong the last 8 years, and all put the same idiots on TV and express the same opinions, like a band of sheep. It's all so drearily predictable.

They're the idiots who were all lined up about how Bush was like Lincoln or Churchill after 9-11 and ignored all the warning signals about Iraq. They're the morons who were wrong about absolutely everything from torture to Afghanistan, to the effects of de-regulation.

And now they are doing what media idiots all do: channel every right-wing talking point: rather like Rudy does here!

The stimulus package is "all loaded up with pork." Of course! What we really need is another 10-15% TAX CUT for millionaires, because absolutely everything in this country can always be fixed by a tax cut for the rich!

The ONLY thing that will actually work to right the economy now is GOVERNMENT spending money and hiring people. Give money to state governments so they can avoid slashing state budgets for schools and health-care for instance. Roads and bridges. Funding the arts hires builders and musicians. Direct federal hiring programs, because companies are continuing to lay people off.

IN short, Republicans are acting like THEY won the damn election! You LOST! Get USED TO IT!

We, those millions and millions who voted for Obama, and NOT the media assholes WANT government to do more, directly hiring people and we DON'T want more across the board tax cuts for the rich!

But, the media Villagers are all doing the same crap they have been for the last 8 years, worshiping at the cult of every right-wing blowhard who comes on TV and screams about "pork" and for tax-cuts like they won the election, and ignoring the rest of us who want the exact opposite!

Mike in Maryland said...

Our RepubliCANT troll Rudy said...
Real stimulus creates productive economic activity that can be sustained and expanded by priming the pump.

One thing that is being described as pork by RepubliCANT Congress critters is the repair of the National Mall.

The National Park that receives the most visitors BY FAR of all the National Parks is the National Mall. The Park Service estimates that it would take about $75 million to fund needed repairs, from resodding to repairing/replacing the irrigation system. Repair to and around the memorials and monuments, such as the sea wall at the Jefferson Memorials.

Who would be paid for that maintenance? Mostly employees of small businesses. If the small business gets a contract, keeps it's employees paid from this work, it just might be able to survive the recession, and eventually grow. If the money is taken out of the stimulus package, the contracts can't be awarded, the small business will go out of business, and the employees will be laid off.

Sounds to me like fixing the National Mall, the monuments and memorials are the type of non-pork that will help small businesses, their employees, and keep the companies out of bankruptcy, keep the employees off the unemployment rolls, keep the employees from having to use welfare and/or food banks, etc.

The national memorial to World War II has NO maintenance budget, yet it is on the National Mall. With millions of visitors per year, there will be wear and tear, and maintenance will be needed. The stimulus package contains money to make sure there is at least a minimal amount of upkeep and maintenance for the WW II Memorial. And who will do the upkeep and maintenance? A lot of small businesses, and the employees of those small businesses.

In other words, funds to help maintain and repair the National Mall IS a stimulus to the economy.

thatmarvelousape said...

"Tax cuts are the proven best way of doing that."

Proven by who? Conservative pundits? Certainly not by history... and definitely not by actual economists, whose actual work and research indicates that the most effective means of stimulus are, in order:

(1) Direct spending on shovel-ready projects
(2) Payroll/income tax cuts
(3) Business tax cuts

With that said, I agree there is a shameful load of pork in the bill, though not as much as you claim. Still, progressives on the left would better serve the agenda by going after the pork instead of the tax cuts. Tax cuts, while not optimally effective, are at least somewhat effective, and given that pork represents an easier political target, challenging suboptimal spending provisions represents the best way to increase the share of infrastructure and mass transit spending.

mhz said...
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mhz said...
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trialsanderrors said...

For the 110th Senate, Olympia Snowe's DW-Nominate Score was +0.034 (- = liberal, + = conservative). Susan Collins's was +0.073. Maybe Collins is more conservative than Snowe, but their voting behavior is essentially interchangeable.

joel said...

I don`t see any way the GOP can pull off a fillibuster. My guess is every senator from a blue state Obama won and who is up for re-election in 2010 would vote against it like Spector, Gregg, maybe Burr and the ones who are retiring have nothing to lose if they really want to go against the party.
I doubt Collins and Snowe would vote for one since the represent a state that voted big for Obama. I just think the GOP is totally impotent and if they are smart won`t try to fillibuster anything Obama wants to do at this point.

mhz said...

@Goatdan- Have you ever seen
"Mr. Smith Goes to Washington"?

The person/people executing the filibuster is/are more likely to read from the Constitution and Fox News transcripts in order to garble together some message.
The TV media and others will then force the crap down our throats because DRAMA SELLS.

Look what Blago is accomplishing right now and everyone in TV media, including Rachel Maddow, is feeding him.

DNFTT is not a functional principle for the MSM or most for-profit, publicly-traded TV media outlets.

Unfortunately feeding trolls, like deadly fast-food, is a sure sell in this country at this point in time.

Education reform anyone?

sarasotajoe said...

"All of the Republican women voted for Ledbetter."

More interesting is that Specter is the only Republican man who voted for it, making Ledbetter the bill with the least Republican support. Juvanya has a point, and Dems should capitalize on this indefensible stance of Republican men.

sarasotajoe said...

And, yes - this is a cool graphic and I would like to see it reprised frequently. But Nate, you really got a lot of us excited with the Senate and congressional district voting maps for each bill, and I'm hoping you can get those up too. Not that you're not busy...

sarasotajoe said...

Mitch McConnell voted for cloture on Ledbetter? Wow. Maybe he saw that the filibuster was a lost cause.

Statler N Waldorf said...

OT, but relevant :)

Ted Haggard Busted Yet Again
from gay.com

On Friday, The New Life Church in Colorado Springs, former pulpit of scandal-ridden Ted Haggard, announced the details of a previously undisclosed sexual relationship Haggard had with a young male church volunteer. The announcement comes just as Haggard, 52, has begun attempting to rebuild his reputation. He is in the middle of a media tour promoting an HBO documentary airing next Thursday about his time out of the spotlight. He recently taped an interview with Oprah Winfrey and has an upcoming slot on CNN's Larry King Live.

Brady Boyd, the current senior pastor said that the church had wanted to keep the relationship (which apparently went on for a “long period of time” and began when the young man was of legal age) a private matter, but was prompted to disclose the details when he was contacted by a Colorado Springs TV station and informed that the young man planned to release full details of the relationship to the press.

The church reached a legal settlement with the young man agreeing to pay for education and counseling on the condition that the relationship was never publicly discussed. He added that the church won’t take any legal action against the man even if he violates the terms of the settlement and talks about the relationship to the media. The publicity surrounding the upcoming documentary, reported to somewhat portray Haggard as a victim, may have motivated the young man to come forward.

Why can’t these religious leaders keep it in their pants?



Posted by Jerry Gulley II on January 26, 2009 in In the media | DIGG THIS | Email this post | Back to gay.com

skipk said...

The graphic can be improved by ordering the bills according to how favorably they were viewed. Chronology is not destiny

Eric said...

Haven't commented much since the election, but this has to be said.

The Republicans lost. They had their turn. They did damage that's close to irreparable. The only way to attempt to repair it is to do what Obama and company want. These games that Boehner and Limbaugh et al. are playing should be wholly ignored. Their opinions are no longer relevant. We'll talk in 8 years or sooner if something goes wrong, but for now just shut up and sit on your hands RepubliCONs. you got us in this mess, now get out of the way. Period. End of story.

John Galt said...

you got us in this mess, now get out of the way. Period. End of story.

Just the attitude I like to see (/sarcasm).

If you think Democrats/liberals have clean hands in nearly bankrupting and ruining this country, then you are sadly mistaken.

This country has been in a backwards slide since WWII. And if memory serves, Democrats/liberals have controlled the Executive and Legislative Branches much more often than have Republicans.

Statler N Waldorf said...

Oh John,

You did lose. At the end of the day, you can hurl all the insults at us you chose.


You still lost.

And there's a reason why. Either 1) You screwed up royally and need to do a little soul searching to find out what went wronmg and how to fix your party or 2) You just think Americans are stupid when they vote.

So, which is it? Did you fuck up, or are Americans idiots?

With love,


Statler

thatmarvelousape said...

>>This country has been in a backwards slide since WWII.<<

Yes, who can deny that the post-World War II era was the darkest and least prosperous period in American history? Why, before FDR, America had never experienced a financial panic! Not one!

/snark

John Galt said...

At the end of the day, you can hurl all the insults at us you chose.

I want you to re-read my post and see if you can honestly explain how anything I said - I mean, even one letter - is an insult. Methinks you need to look up the definition of "insult" first. That was the most laughable reply I have ever seen.

Yes, who can deny that the post-World War II era was the darkest and least prosperous period in American history? Why, before FDR, America had never experienced a financial panic! Not one!

So you're saying that economic forces have ebbed and flowed long before George Bush came in office and that perilous times and panics happened even without Bush' "tired policies" with which you blame everything else on today? Just want you on the record saying that. Because you're goose is cooked either way you try and argue it.

Again, you lose.

Statler N Waldorf said...

Galt, you lost. You are a loser. Period.

Now, you could say that a new President that just started a few weeks ago inherited the mess created by whoever went before him, but The Bush Recession started after 8 years of.... his own rule.

Sorry, you can,t blame this one on the past Presidents.

mhz said...

@skipk- I second your motion!

Alternatively a look at both arrangements: by chronology and repub acceptance/rejection.

The two images side by side may be interesting to consider- Time trends vs issue trends may become visible.

wv-conde- Where is Ms.Conde Rice these days- I wonder if she is watching the news?

counsellorben said...

Let's talk about Arlen Specter.

Between his votes so far and his questioning of Eric Holder, it appears that he is concerned about the 2010 Republican primary, and is positioning himself further to the right.

It will be interesting to see if he continues to tack further to the right, and the effect this move will have on both the Republican and Democratic primaries for his seat.

Blame said...

Stalter

"Sorry, you can,t blame this one on the past Presidents."

Actualy there is enough to go around, and why limit the blame to Presidents?

One could say that the seeds of this disaster go back to deregulation under Clinton. Then again Democrat suported "easy credit" for housing played a large part.

Every politician who demanded a larger share of the pie for his/her supporters/special interest group deserves an equal share of the blame.

Let S/he who stood up for financial prudence, infrastructure and energy indipendence (but not food to alcahol)cast the first stone.

wv -hymshing. Sequel to "the shining" set in a The New Life Church Quire and features Ted Haggard.

thatmarvelousape said...

Because you're goose is cooked either way you try and argue it. Again, you lose.

Nice strawman, but I was responding specifically to your comment that "America is in a backward slide." The only thing you've accomplished by acknowledging my comment is refuting your own hyperbolic rant. Good job!

Statler N Waldorf said...

Blame,

You know, there once was a time when Presidents took responsibility for errors occurring under their watch. Now it seems Bush wants to dodge responsibility.

When you take that job, you open yourself up to critiques of your performance. You appoint the cabinet, so their errors are your errors in the same way that guests you bring along to a party you have been invited to are your responsibility. The laws you allow to pass without veto and the laws you do veto are both your responsibility. The wars you fight, they way they were fought, the economy you oversaw-the buck stops here, for all of it.

It takes a degree of maturity to look the angry horde in the eye and say, "I am responsible. Blame me". A degree Bush lacks. His farewell speech downplayed his mistakes or flat out denied them despite the preponderance of evidence.


This slimy "It wasn't me! It was everybody else's fault" would be acceptable for a grade schooler explaining why he has not cleaned his room or done his homework. It is sickening in a President.

Vinny said...

People will vote for cloture so they don't look bad and obstructionist, but then vote against the bill so they can have that on record. It's a win-win for them.

Real Joe said...

bill is going to fail

Indiana Douche said...

This cloture business is hysterical, considering the people obstructing are the ones who whined incessantly about an "up or down vote" when Dubya was trying to get his judges confirmed. I guess it's ok for Republicans to filibuster, but should Democrats filibuster the entire country will collapse.

John Galt said...

Statler,

You come across as affable, at least, but you are a buffoon nonetheless. Now that, my friend, is an insult.

I point out that there's plenty of blame to go around and that Dems/Libs hands are just as dirty when analyzing the demise of our economy, and you have the audacity to say that I insulted you first before digressing into a bunch of childish insults yourself calling me a "loser" in the form of an immature taunt.

That immediately discredits you as having anything substantive to discuss, so please excuse me as I have adults to interact with instead of a boorish moron like yourself (another insult, in case you are struggling with the concept).

And thatmarvelousape, you too show to be a clueless boob. Again, I make one simple point, you retort with a snark, and I point out that by your logic, one cannot make the same argument liberals make in the present tense and be historically consistent.

And your best line is to throw the old "strawman" line back at me to obfuscate the discussion? What are you, on the junior varsity debate team at BFE High School? Get a grip. Again, I say, shut your mouth unless you want to engage in adult discussions.

Real Joe said...

we republicans still have the power

lol

The Winch said...

With an average of 16 Republican votes each time, that bodes well for the Senate actually getting stuff done, at least for a while.

However, I would also like to see such a graphic for the Democrats because there's always a significant chunk of Democrats who vote Republican like.

Statler N Waldorf said...

It's just you against the world, isn't it Galt? Everyone else is to blame, not you.

Maybe you can blame all the voters that voted against the GOP in November too. Dodge that responsibility as long as you can, and keep blaming everybody else.


As long as you do, we Dems will continue to rack up huge victories. Nobody loves a whiner, least of all a sore loser.

John Galt said...

It's just you against the world, isn't it Galt? Everyone else is to blame, not you.

I'm guessing you don't even have a clue as to what my name stands for and embodies. If you did, you wouldn't have made that appallingly ironic statement.

Dodge that responsibility as long as you can, and keep blaming everybody else.

I'm not. I take responsibility for my actions and the actions of those I support, be they Democrats or Republicans. I was merely pointing out what you're trying to hammer me with - that Dems/Libs have not taken their fair share of responsibility in this mess. THEY are the ones who have been dodging responsibility for years now and have had the fortune of an idiot like Bush to use as a whipping boy. Granted, he did bring much of it on himself but they have hidden their own inadequacies behind his blatant ignorance. That will no longer be the case as the failings and incompetence of Democrats/Libs will now be fully transparent and on display with Bush no longer around to hide behind.

Aren't you a little bit scared now that you don't have him as a scapegoat? For at least the last five years, you've been able to simply interject the word "Bush" into any argument and claim the upper hand as he made for an easy target as the leader of the country with unbridled power while he controlled the executive office and Republicans controlled Congress through 2006. Now that a Dem is in office and Dems controll the House and Senate by broad margins, there will only be one party whose feet the blame will be laid at if/when things continue to deteriorate.

As long as you do, we Dems will continue to rack up huge victories. Nobody loves a whiner, least of all a sore loser.

Don't count your chickens just yet, but I welcome you to maintain that level of hubris into the future and see where it gets you. As for nobody liking whiners/sore losers, you're exactly right! And people were very disgusted with many Dems/Libs for exactly that for the last 8 years of incessant whining and bitching while Bush was in office. It's funny how no one can see these disgusting traits except when people of the opposing party exhibit them. My how the tables have turned.

Matthew Black said...

All, SantaTurdo and John Galt are both M.R. accounts. Please don't engage them and certainly ignore them.

This is the same guy who last week was posting under rays242 threatening the President.

John Galt said...

All, SantaTurdo and John Galt are both M.R. accounts. Please don't engage them and certainly ignore them.

This is the same guy who last week was posting under rays242 threatening the President.


Umm, I'm not sure what you mean. I am in no way affiliated with the "SantaTurdo" whose comment can be seen above, and I don't have a clue what an M.R. account is.

I saw the rays242 handle the other day when browsing comments and did remember some rather disturbing comments made by him, but again, I have no affiliation with that name.

Why are you trying to silence me be accusing me of being someone else? And lying about it, to boot. That doesn't make sense.

I've made rational statements. People can feel free to ignore them or not, but don't accuse me of being someone I'm not and especially someone quoted on here that was threatening the President.

You need to get a life.

Statler N Waldorf said...

Go9t it, MB. Will do.

John Galt said...

Matthew Black,

I'm waiting on you to explain why you accused me of being associated with someone who threatened the President. Or are you just going to ignore me like you urged others to do? Did you just want to silence me by making false accusations about me because you don't agree with me and don't like differing opinions cluttering up your cherished board here?

That's rather juvenile, if you ask me. Maybe I'll just spout random accusations about you.

Matthew Black said...

Galt - why don't you open access to your profile so we can all see when you created your account?

You're not fooling anyone.

thatmarvelousape said...

Is there anything more juvenile than taking your handle from an Ayn Rand character?

John Galt said...

Okay, Matthew, I've opened access. I have nothing to hide. I posted under the name "Edge" for a little while before changing to "John Galt" recently. That's the only sinister thing I've done in terms of my account.

I'm not rays242. That's incredibly wrong.

@thatmarvelousape,

You're not one to be the authority on who's juvenille or not when your handle is simply a stated observation of you being a more advanced version of a lesser primate.

Hoosierbrad said...

Wow, I am impressed, especially on the Lily Ledbetter cloture vote, but the proof will be in the pudding when they get around to card voting on labor issues. I hope that can get past cloture, as well.

Hoosierbrad said...

John Galt said - This country has been in a backwards slide since WWII. And if memory serves, Democrats/liberals have controlled the Executive and Legislative Branches much more often than have Republicans.

Wow, the U.S. became the richest nation on earth after WW II, with the highest standard of living and with a reduction in poverty the likes of which the world had never seen before, at least until Ronnie Reagon and his Repub economic gurus started us in this economic downward spiral. I LOL at your comment.

Ragin Cajun said...

Snowe's record doesn't have anything to do with when she's getting reelected. Snowe has simply always been more moderate than Collins. Collins is a moderate Republican, Snowe is a liberal one. Collins often breaks with the party lines on the really big issues, Snowe cannot be counted to do that.

信次 said...

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Jennifer said...

yeah, great column. i agree, definitely keep this graphic going.

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