Contrary to much reporting -- including some of our own - the U.S. Senate probably lacks the Constitutional authority to refuse to seat an appointment made by indicated Governor Rod Blagojevich. As a law school friend writes:FYI. If the Supreme Court took the case, It isn't clear that the Senate has the Constitutional authority to refuse to seat a senator who has been validly appointed under the Constitution.
The tricky part here is that Article 1 of the Constitution stipulates that the Senate is the "Judge of Elections, Returns and Qualifications" of its own members. The Senate actually has fairly broad latitude on questions of "Elections and Returns", which is why it could intervene, say, in the Minnesota recount (as it has done in similar cases in the past). An appointment, however, is not an election, which means the only vehicle open to the Senate is challenging the appointee's qualifications, and the Powell v McCormack precedent stipulates that such a review would be limited to his age, residency or citizenship. What the Senate would have to do instead is actually expel the member they just admitted to the chamber, which requires a 2/3 majority and would be much stickier in terms of precedent -- the Senate has not expelled a member since the Civil War.
Art I Section 5 says that "Each House shall be the Judge of the Elections, Returns and Qualifications of its own Members..."
In Powell v McCormack, the Court held that the House of Reps couldn't refuse to seat Adam Clayton Powell as long as he met the Constitution's qualifications for membership (age, residency, citizenship.).
I guess, theoretically, the Senate could seat the appointee and then expel him with a 2/3rds vote. The Court wouldn't interfere on Political Question grounds: the Constitution doesn't specify the standard for expulsion so it is properly at the discretion of the Senate.
This places even more pressure on the Illinois Legislature to impeach Blagojevich, who in all likelihood is too delusional and/or too stupid to resign his seat. Impeachments have been a rarity in Illinois, and the state's Constitution does not establish specific grounds for a conviction on impeachment proceedings (that is, there's nothing analogous to "treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors" as stated in the US Constitution). But nobody stands anything to gain by defending Blagojevich and he'd seem like a longshot to survive an impeachment trial, even if the legislature is somewhat making up the precedents as it goes along.
EDIT: Short of impeaching Blagojevich, the Illinois Legislature could also rewrite its appointments law in conjunction with establishing a special elections procedure, removing the governor's power to make an appointment, as some states like Oregon have done. See Adam B's legal explainer for more. FURTHER UPDATE: Crain's Chicago Business suggests this is exactly what the state legislature will try and do.
12.09.2008
Senate Might Not Have Authority to Reject Blago Appointment
by Nate Silver @ 9:39 PM...see also blagojevich, elections law, illinois, senate
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83 comments
First!
Well, as long as Blago can't appoint someone who'd have the authority to pardon him....
Well, heck, the fun thing is to speculate on who -- outside himself, which is still possible -- Blagojevich might nominate to the Senate that would be the biggest 'f*** you' from our newly crowned king gangsta governor.
@El Cid
Alan Keyes, of course. Or maybe Jack Ryan.
As far as the constitutional issues, many of the bloggers/writers who have discussed this have been keen enough to note that the Senate would technically need to swear in the appointee before expelling him/her...
As far as practical concerns, I have no doubt in my mind that 2/3rds of the Senate would vote to expel anyone appointed by Blago.
Actually, the biggest Fuck You would be if he nominated Bill Jefferson.
Well, my question is this. How soon can the Illinois legislature impeach Blago? If they can do it quickly, before he appoints anyone (one does presume he's a little busy with the police at the moment. Get it done before bail is assigned and you're home free), then the question of how do we fix this problem becomes purely academic.
Pat Quinn then becomes de facto governor, and he can either appoint or hold an election.
Legislators... start your engines!
The question, however, is what are Illinois' rules for replacing an expelled senator? I would assume (though I haven't read about it) that the governor would again appoint a temporary replacement until a special election can be held, which defeats the entire purpose
If he appoints himself, I think there's no question he'd get expelled immediately; if he appoints someone else, though, they may want to arrange something where the appointed person agrees to resign as soon as Blago resigns / is impeached
Which, of course, is why the optimal solution is for the Ill State Senate to explicitly deal with this
What if he appoints Joe the Plumber?
I don't know. I think it's moot because accepting an appointment from Blagojevich would be political suicide at this point. Unless, of course, he appointed himself, in which case he'd surely be expelled.
Then it would be Senator Joe The Fake Illinoisian.
Does anyone here defend Blagojevich? I don't I just wonder if there's anyone loony enough to still like this guy.
possible appointments:
Sammy Sosa
Ron Santo
Steve Stone
Jimmy Piersall
Ozzie Guillen
Ken Williams
Hawk Harrelson
Will Ferrell
Vince Vaughn
Bill Murray
Nate Silver
deadskunk, that's exactly why he should appoint someone whose political career is toast already! Or better yet, appoint someone he despises, just to slime them by associating them with him!
Blago should pick Sarah Palin! Let,s see if she can shop her way out of it!
Wow, what a mess this whole thing is. Looks like the Dems are gonna have 57 seats for a while at least, once again snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
:-)
Suge, you're completely ignoring the possibility that Pat Quinn will be the one to appoint Obama's replacement... which would bring the count to 58/59 if Franken wins.
@Nate: TYPO " . . . by indicated. . . ."
Should be "indicted," not "indicated."
wv: ressinja (really cheap Albanian wine)
"the Illinois Legislature could also rewrite its appointments law"
And the governor could veto it. Of course, the legislature could override the veto. But there's nothing to stop him from appointing someone before vetoing (or signing) the bill. This guy isn't likely to back down. I won't be surprised if he appoints his wife.
Well, the possibilities are, in order of likelihood:
1. The IL legislature passes a bill in the next week or two mandating a special election for the open seat. The election winner takes the seat, with (likely Quinn) appointing the interim Democrat senator.
2. The IL legislature impeaches Blago. They then either pass a special election law, or Quinn appoints an acceptable Senator. An election is more likely.
3. Blago tries to appoint one or multiple people. They decline due to the obvious imminent expulsion. Either 1 or 2 then happens.
4. Blago appoints himself. This is within his rights. The Senate promptly expels him, and either 1 or 2 happens.
5. Blago finds a Republican to appoint, and Republicans vote in lockstep not to expel him. The Senate has no other option, and said appointee must be voted out in 2010. This would be the ultimate f-you move, but as it wouldn't actually help Blago at all, it doesn't seem like his style. It is possible though.
Maybe so, but how long will it be before Pat Quinn will take office? My guess is that impeachment proceedings will take a long time because of procedural rules, regardless of how unanimously the body agrees that Blogo's got to go.
Thus it appears that the Senate seat will remain empty for at least a few months unless if Blogo is even crazier than he seems.
So Obama can count on one less seat during the very important first 100 days. :-(
This gift just keeps on giving, doesn't it? Entertainment at its best. Shame it's IRL, really.
IF Blagojevich were to make the appointment, it would create a huge mess which everyone will be scrambling to figure out how to clean up. But he won't do it. The power to make that appointment is the only bargaining chip he has left, and he doubtless still thinks he can make a deal so he won't spend most of the rest of his life in a federal prison. But he needs that bargaining chip. Using it, by making the appointment, would be killing the hostage. He won't do it.
To summarize succinctly the obvious point made by others here: no legitimate contender for the seat would accept the Blago appointment.
Even if they impeach him quickly, that doesn't stop him from appointing someone before the impeachment/conviction vote. Blago holds the cards.
Here's another idea which may or may not be too tin-hatty: Blago cuts a deal with Bush for a pardon in exchange for appointing a Rethuglican.
Powell v McCormack
This case said nothing about the House not being able to judge of the appropriateness of an appointment, as opposed to an electoral, process of the choice of a member. The House tried to refuse to seat Powell after his election, not appointment, to the House. The problem was that they did not refuse to seat him because the election that he won was thought to be corrupt or tainted, which the House had every right to be the judge of, but because Powell was otherwise thought to be corrupt. The court ruled that the majority of the House that voted to refuse to seat him after he won re-election was unjustly trying to exercise the otherwise just power to expel corrupt members, but doing so unjustly under the cover of refusal to seat, because expulsion would have required 2/3, which they couldn't muster, whereas refusal to seat only requires the simple majority they could muster. The way the majority tried to justify this scheme of "it's really expulsion, but we'll call it refusal to seat", was by the claim that Powell's corruption made him unqualified by reason of moral turpitude to run for the office. But the Constitution does not list good moral character as a qualification for this office, the majority can't just invent qualifications, therefore the majority's attempt to refuse to seat Powell, when it had neither a claim that the electoral process was imperfect, nor that the candidate failed to meet the specified qualifications, was invalid.
The word "election" meant "choice" at the time the Constitution was written. A senator is elected to the office whether the choice is made by the people of that state, by its legislature (as was the mode of election for most states for most of our history), or by its governor. Any method of election is subject to corrupt or otherwise imperfect practice, and the Senate has the final responsibility to judge whether or not the imperfection is serious enough to render the process invalid, and to refuse to seat the member on those grounds. I would think that bribing a governor to elect you is pretty straightforwardly a serious enough imperfection in implementing Illinois' scheme to name interim Senators, that the Senate would be compelled to judge such an election invalid. To think otherwise, you would have to imagine that Illinois intended the appointment power in such cases to be the personal, "bleeping goldmine", property of the governor, to be disposed of as he sees fit, the good of the people of Illinois be damned.
It's "try TO do," not "try AND do."
Using it, by making the appointment, would be killing the hostage. He won't do it.
Before all this went down, I made a bad assumption that Blago was sane. I figured he knew which way the wind blew and there was no way in hell that he bucked the President Elect and was just going to be a rubber stamp.
All that is out the window, he's nuts or stupid.
After re-reading the 17th Amendment, I take back what I said about the governor vetoing a legislative move to change the appointment procedure. It appears he doesn't have veto power on that.
Ed M. - he's both, but remember his motivation is ALWAYS "How does this help me personally" I guarantee you that right now he's trying to come up with schemes to use his appointment power to keep himself out of prison. I like Eugenian's idea - that's exactly Blago's style - but even before all this became public Bush would have never entertained the notion even for a second.
Ed, I'm going with nuts. Did you see the conversations he had? He knew he was being observed! Some of the things he said are just absolutely damning! I don't know how anyone could think he's sane
As such, there really is no way to predict what he will do.
Also, consider this: at this point, what does he have to lose? Can it really get any worse for Blago? Unless he anally rapes a nun while clubbing a baby seal to death on national TV, he's just about as fucked as he's going to get. Consequently, he's a free agent. He can follow whatever snarky impulse strikes his fancy at this point, and it will neither harm nor benefit him.
Unless....
he strikes a deal for a reduced sentence. He agrees not to appoint some half-witted jackass as a last act of defiance, and they agree that he will eventually see daylight again, and maybe gets to do his time in a nice country-club prison like the one Michael Milken spent his mandatory vacation at.
To be effective though, he has to prove that he realizes just what a position he is in. In one sense he was correct when he said, "This thing is golden, you don't just give it away". If he uses that golden thing as bait, he can talk his way out of Shitsville State Prison. But he,d have to make it plain that he intends to sue that power of his to appoint if they don't give him what he wants.
Oh, Chicago, you beautifully corrupt town! Just when we here in NOLA were getting depressed from the fame Bill Jefferson brought us, you come riding to the rescue with something so obnoxious, people have already forgotten who Jefferson was. I love ya, Chi-town!
I agree Statler. He's completely insane and therefore there's no predicting what he will do. I wouldn't put it past him to make some screw-you appointment.
He's looking to make a deal. Blago's always looking to make a deal. It won't work, though. The state leg is going to take away his power to appoint and call for a special election (for the Senate seat). The question is how long the seat will be vacant. It's ironic that as Obama works his agenda through Congress the one vote he'll be missing in the Senate will come from his own seat.
Zach,
There are two ways to do this, and Blago knows it.
1) He can make things very messy. He appoints himself, the Senate has to go through the whole ritual of expelling him, the drama drags out int he press for months, practically destroying any remaining credibility the Illinois Democratic Party has left. The end result is the same, in that he'll never even make it to Capitol Hill before he's booted, but he gets his final Fuck You in before he goes to prison. Even if the legislature does change the laws, they'd have to do it before he appoints, or else the whole thing winds up in court, where he can drag it out even longer.
2) He can make things nice and easy. He agrees to sit down and shut up and resign his post as Governor without appointing anyone.
Option 1 is free. Option 2 will cost you.
I think the speculations about Blago using the appointment as a bargaining chip give too much credit to the idea of rule by law. Sure, on paper he has the right to make the appointment, but no one believes he should have that right. If he were to announce tomorrow that his wife is the new senator from Illinois, what's to stop everyone involved from just saying "no, she's not" and ignoring the appointment? I'm sure it would go to the courts, but in high profile cases like this where the system seems to be breaking down (think 2000 recount and Terry Shiavo) the courts tend to rule whichever way avoids greater conflict. I don't think he has a leg to stand on.
Justin,
Because it,s the fucking law. The state does not have the power to just ignore whatever laws it doesn't like. If it did, they could wiretap your phones without going thru a FISA court.or detain you indefinitely in some offshore prison camp without bringing any charges against you or allowing you access to the courts. errr... welll... okay fine ya got me, ya happy now?????
No seriously, the rule of law has to be respected by the government. Unless your last name is Bush. Then you have a free pass to do whatever the fuck you feel like.
But that's the point, really. The last eight years has established the precedent of action before justification. It seems like the legality of most of what Bush did the last eight years is still being debated and he's practically out the door. These days if you can make any type of legal argument that your side is right (like Blago's breach of public trust invalidated his oath of office or something like that)then you can proceed as though it's fact and let the courts figure it out later. I'm not saying it's right, but the political climate these days is very much "it's better to beg for forgiveness than ask for permission." I guess another way to think about this is, if everyone involved decided to ignore a Blago appointee, who would hold them accountable? Would there really be any repercussions? Again, I'm not saying it's right, but the rule of law is dependent upon an honest and faithful government and, as this whole affair has pointed out, that may be in short supply.
Oh, for the good old days when you could just tar and feather them, or string them up...
I just wanted to point out that Nate's assumption in his previous post about the number of Senators required for cloture is wrong. There is no denominator in the fraction required for cloture, because there is no fraction! It is not 3/5! The number required for cloture is 60 votes, period! Before the rule was changed in the min-1970's, the fraction was 2/3 of those present and voting.
Oh, BLAGO! No one liked you, we just had no way to get ride of you.
What kind of dumbass tries to LITERALLY sell a Senate seat by saying, literally "I'm going to sell this Senate seat" after being under investigation since he was inaugurated? The only surprise was that Aaron Schock wasn't outside the door with his checkbook.
Democrats are lucky that there are no rising Republican stars in the state.
Blagojevich will make everyone's lives miserable until he gets what he wants or is impeached. Unfortunately for him, he gave them all the evidence they needed to convict, and unless he has some amazing skeletons in the closet, he doesn't have anything to bargain with.
And finally, I sure hope that Illinois voters support a Constitutional Convention next election, so we can deal with some of this crap.
I just woke up from a two month coma, can anybody tell me what is going on. the last I can recall John McCain was leading ODUMBO in the polls by several points. Who won?
O MY GOD!!!! ODUMBO WON! But he was from the most corrupt state in America. Tony REZKO and him were bosom buddies. Now I find the GOV. of the State is selling ODUMBO'S seat in the Senate!!! I need to go back into my coma.
Just what is the CURRENT make-up (D's vs. R's) of the Illinois Legislature?
REZKO is the bag man for the Gov. of Ill. and he sold ODUMBO a piece of property far below market price. What is the Quid Pro Quo? WHAT DID OBAMA KNOW? AND WHEN DID HE KNOW IT??????????????????????????????????????????????
ALL OF AMERICA WANTS TO KNOW!!!!!!!!!
BY THE WAY NATE SILVER-YOU ARE A WANKER! YOU WERE A WANKER WHEN I WAS IN MY COMA,YOU WERE A WANKER WHEN THE GA SENATE RACE WAS WON IN A BLOWOUT BY THE REPUBLICANS, AND A WANKER WHEN THE REPUBLICANS WON THE TWO HOUSE SEATS IN LOUISIANA, AND YOU ARE NOW A WANKER WHEN WE FIND OUT THAT ODUMBO'S MONAY MAN IN CHICAGO IS THE BAG MAN FOR THE MOST CORRUPT GOVERNOR IN AMERICA!
SILVER, WHAT DO YOU KNOW AND WHEN DID YOU KNOW IT?
Whoops- I posted this on an old thread (twice) by accident.
I get the impression that a lot of you not from Il don't realize that many IL Dems (people in the legislature, not mere bloggers) had been actively calling for impeachment for some time. Blago was mainly protected by Senate Pres. Emil Jones. (This is why Nate was crazy to call for Jones' appointment to the Senate slot a week or two ago.)
I suspect Jones may be #4, because #4 was supposed to be very close to Blago and willing to step aside if Blago needed to "parachute" himself into the seat. That only makes sense for a placeholder appointment like Jones.
Could be wrong, I'm interested to hear what other people think.
Statler,
"Option 1 is free. Option 2 will cost you." You're right, that is EXACTLY the ultimatum that Blago is offering right now. But bargaining with him now just proves his view of his appointment power was correct, and isn't that a big part of what he's being indicted for? That's why the leg feels compelled to act quickly to avoid Option 1, but Blago could (and probably would) act quicker and appoint himself IF he sees no other option. The Dems desperately need him to be prevented for exercising the powers of his office. Maybe the best solution is for the judge to deny him bail.
AGAIN, SILVER, WHAT DO YOU KNOW AND WHEN DID YOU KNOW IT?
Michael--
I think Jones is likely a safe bet to be involved. This should shake up all levels of the state, and we can really start dealing with the craphole we're in.
Even the local paper here downstate, which is fairly democratic, has been editorializing for recall authority and impeachment for months.
All day, I've just wanted someone to go on every news channel and shout that Illinois couldn't stand him either. The way he got caught was a surprise, but that he got caught was not a surprise. He's a douche, or as the Daily Show called him, a "jack-off".
'jack black said...
AGAIN, SILVER, WHAT DO YOU KNOW AND WHEN DID YOU KNOW IT?"
Looks like Mule is back under another name!
Well, there is one potentially negative side effect I can forsee....
Once the government no longer sees itself as restrained to obey the laws of the land as they are written, there are no more sacred cows, including the Bill of Rights. Once the Constitution becomes just a piece of paper or some quaint historical document, our system of government will break down to a mere mob or personality cult.
Bush illegally violated the Constitution a and got away with it. This sets a very dangerous precedent, which I doubt he or his Party were thinking about at the time. The same excesses that were perpetrated upon opponents of the Bush Regime can now be applied to opponents of the Obama regime - including most of those who so vocally supported Bush's actions during the past eight years.
If we allow ourselves to develop a fully imperial Presidency, then whoever is in power at the time holds all the cards, and whoever isn't in power at that moment has no rights. In another 42 days, most of Fox News' audience will have to switch places with the people they formerly regarded as a whining nuisance. Given that power concedes nothing voluntarily, I see no reason why we should expect Obama to restrict his own powers, which have been vastly expanded by his predecessor. Bush can try to pardon himself all he wants, but if I were Obama, I'd have him sent to Guantànamo Bay immediately upon assuming office.
Shall we allow ourselves to degenerate completely to some anarchic mess like Somalia, where whatever warlord happens to have the biggest gun handy at the time is the absolute ruler of the day? Shred whatever scraps of democracy we have left in favor of a personality cult? Dissolve the Congress and establish some politburo to rubber stamp the President's every whim?
As satisfying as it would be to see Bill O'Reilly getting waterboarded on CNN, I don't want this. Naïve as this may sound, I prefer the style of government we had before the Bush disaster, when the rule of law trumped the whims of those in charge.
Have you ever heard of the names Marius and Sulla?
They were the original dictators- in the days of the Roman Republic, a dictator was appointed during times of national crisis and given absolute power for a set period of time, so they could have a free hand to govern without facing legal consequences or seeking the approval of the Senate. Only these two decided they didn't want to give up their powers when it was time to do so. They ultimately destroyed the Roman Republic by setting precedents which Caesar would later follow and use as justification for his Empire.
I do not want an American Empire. I see such a thing as a disaster, a repudiation of every moral concept which defines us as a nation, and a degeneration into something brutal and oppressive.
Now, Bush may very well have been Marius for a time. But by disregarding the law when it comes to Blago, you open the door to a Sulla to follow him, and a Caesar after that. And by doing so you rape the very country that produced you. After all, what is this country if not the sum of it's laws? We are not defined by an ethnicity the way European countries are, nor a language or a common faith. All we are is that Constitution. The Rule of Law is, in more than just a metaphorical sense, us. To damage it is to damage all of us.
So be careful before you decide to kill it off for good.
Oh, and I've totally decided that Pat Quinn is the mastermind of this whole thing. He was Lt. Gov under Ryan, Blago, and I assume Kerner and Walker back in the day since he's got to be on his 16th term.
Too much too soon, jack black impersonator; you needed to warm us up before you let your persona slip.
Remember "He"? Now there was a master troll.
Wellp - not from that there Ill-a-noise place yonder - but I do know that a Man is presumed innocent until proven guilty by a jury of his peers. 'Least that's the 'merica I come up in. Dunno how y'all got so damn smart you missed that.
Jed
Correction to my earlier guess- It turns out #4 was a Blago 'deputy'- someone more obscure than Jones. That leaves Jones back in the running for #5.
BTW Schakowsky was #3, mentioned only once. Blago leaked her name as a possibility just to try to extort more out of somebody else. She was never under consideration. Sort of a Scott Boras move.
Oh Jed, if that,s really true, then explain Guantànamo Bay, Abu Ghraib, and the CIA Black Sites for us, will you? What trials were given before punishment was meted out to those poor bastards?
Unless you're saying that you disagree with the Bush Doctrine because you find it unconstitutional.
Sadly, the same Rule of Law that requires us to respect Blago's right to a fair trial is the same Rule of Law me must respect should he decide to appoint. Which brings us to thsi dilemma: do we who have expressed such contempt for the above mentioned abuses of the Law allow ourselves to become violators of the law like those we hold in contempt?
Do we deal with a murderer by murdering him, thereby becoming murderers ourselves? And then, who will do their duty and murder us in kind? Should we all just kill each other in a mass summary execution, just to make sure that justice is meted out accordingly, and that every murderer is properly murdered in turn?
Likewise, do we ignore our own violations of the law just to punish those who have violated it? Do we become Blago to punish Blago? And who will punish us after we do that? Does it ever end?
Dunno how y'all got so damn smart you missed that.
And I guess on whatever planet you're from, nobody ever discusses what the future of a suspect might be after incredibly incriminating evidence against him is released, or is allowed to have an opinion on guilt or innocence until he's convicted.
News outlets say "alleged" to protect themselves from libel actions. Random pseudonymous blog commenters and people discussing a case around a water cooler don't. Get a grip.
whoa there. only pokin fer fun Mr. Standard N. Warmbums III. That goes to you too RickShaw.
What do you know (not to recycle the phrase, but...) about what you hear? Someone says someone has audio 'proof', and to the public it's a done deal - he's guilty. He may well be, but I, and I'm damn certain you don't know. Don't you think it odd you are so certain?
grip got.
;)
I still don't get why some Illinois authorities are calling for an impeachment AND a special election.Why not just an impeachment (which would be followed by Quinn appointing a DEMOCRATIC senator who will take his seat almost immediately after the impeachment).
Am I missing something?
You are all forgetting something: Blago's actions from now until he is sentenced (assuming conviction) will be considered by the judge in imposing a sentence. His personal well-being is therefore undermined by any "fuck-you" moves, such as appointing himself or his wife as Senator. Of course, he may be insane.
Also, what will happen is that the Illinois legislature will reconvene to FIRST strip the governor of the right to appoint a Senatorial Replacement, while also (or soon thereafter) passing a special election law.
wv: abesadst. Like Fitzgerald said, he's rolling over in his grave. Saddest, indeed!
Opus,
It's CYA. Quinn's probably not a Blago crony, but he is associated with him by his position as Lieutenant Gov,Granted, they didn't run on the same ticket, and they're not even all that friendly to each other - my understanding is they rarely speak, except on business - but the Court of Public Opinion, as our Jed or shall I call him Jedi friend here has pointed out, has already found Blago guilty and might just do the same to Quinn. For no other reason than a pissed off mob looking for someone to hang will settle for anyone that vaguely resembles their target. Like Quinn.
Any appointment he makes would be suspect in the public eye. Blago's taint pretty much extends to anyone involved even marginally in his Administration - he's the Jack Abramoff of Illinois right now.
But, if the people of Illinois select their own Senator in a special election, well... it's pretty hard to slime the guy they pick.
Opus 132, yes, you are missing something. Namely, the fact that this scandal has undermined the credibility of the whole "governor appoints senatorial replacement" system. There will forever be a bad scent of quid pro quo around anyone appointed, even by Quinn.
Hey, do you think this will effect the other Senate seats vacated by Biden and Clinton? I mean, in NY the Gov appoints as well. While Governor Patterson's record so far has been as ethical as you can get, I wonder if the entire concept of gubernatorial appointments hasn't been tainted by this, since it's just as likely that a Governor Blago could get elected in Illinois as it is anywhere else in the Union, and voters in their home states might look at their own Chief Executives and decide they have too much power.
Whaddaya think? Is the gubernatorially appointed Senator a thing of the past?
They should make senatorial appointment the Lt. Gov.'s job. It would be his only job, but at least it would be fun.
Would the DNC really support any push for a special election? There's a chance that a sleeper-R could pull out the win, especially Peter Fitzgerald.
The back-curtain drama as this unfolds is going to be epic. Fitz, get the wiretaps!
Anybody appointed by Blago will be immediately discredited. Let's see, who does he most want to see discredited? How about Fitzgerald? He's going to appoint Fitzgerald to the Senate seat!
"He's going to appoint Fitzgerald to the Senate seat!"
Peter or Patrick?
Statler and Kennyb-
I see your point but can't say i agree with it.
I guess that I see every political turn of events right now as part of a fight to the death with the Republican enemy. (I'm sure the Rove trained Republican party feels the same way about the Democrats.) In this fight I want every possible additional soldier.And that means there should be no way a Republican senator from Illinois can emerge from this mess! There is too much at stake.
NO SPECIAL ELECTION,DAMN IT.
Opus - Yes, that's an unfortunate feautre of a democracy: sometimes your enemy wins.
If the people of IL decide that the Democrats have shown themselves to be unsuitable in positions of power, then they should be allowed to express that. I don't agree with that line of thinking (and it almost certainly won't happen, depending on events), but there you go.
*feature
I hate typos, especially when they're my own
@ polls_apart (.....The number required for cloture is 60 votes, period! Before the rule was changed in the min-1970's, the fraction was 2/3 of those present and voting....)
According to Wikipedia's article on cloture, "the new rule also changed the requirement for determining the number of votes needed for a cloture motion's passage from those Senators "present and voting" to those Senators "duly chosen and sworn", meaning that in a 'normal' Senate 60 votes are required regardless of how many votes are cast.
Until Senator #100 has been duly sworn in however, it seems to me that brings us back to Nate's 59.4 votes...
Why hasn't anyone mentioned that Blago could sit on any special election/appointment legislation for up to 60 days after it is handed to him before he has to sign it, veto it, or just let it become law?
It is right there in the IL Consitution. And Blago seems like the type to milk this for as long as he can.
So your talking at least mid-February before an veto override or a special election could be setup. That is a great way to put the IL Senate seat and the Governorship into play in 2010, let this drag out for 3-4 months.
The only course of action they have is impeachment. That is the only way they could get Blago out of there by the end of the year or early January.
Even then, he could in theory appoint someone today, making this all moot and throwing the ball into the U.S Senate's court.
Blago: How about Mike Ditka? Or Michael Jordan? Da Bears! Da Bulls!
Chris G. said: "Why hasn't anyone mentioned that Blago could sit on any special election/appointment legislation for up to 60 days after it is handed to him before he has to sign it, veto it, or just let it become law?
It is right there in the IL Consitution"
But the US Constitution (17th amendment) gives the power to determine how vacancies are filled, and what role if any the governor is to have, to the state legislature ALONE. The governor does not get to sign, or veto, or sit on it.
I'm surprised nobody has thought of the absolutely perfect Blago fuck-you-all appointment: I give you
SENATOR TONY REZKO!
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