10.15.2008

Today's Polls, 10/15

The polls take a back seat to tonight's debate -- we'll be liveblogging, of course -- but let's give you the numbers and then touch upon a couple of high-level themes:



Still lots of blue in that table. But this was at least a day in which things did not appear to get any worse for John McCain. McCain improved his position in three of the seven tracking polls; Obama gained in one, and the other three were flat. In most of the state polling -- like the set of CNN polls for instance -- the trends were basically flat from the last time in the polls were in the field. That's certainly better for McCain than Obama continuing to gain ground. (By the way, we use the version of the CNN polling with third-party candidates included, which is why our numbers may differ from other sources).

Meanwhile, our model is starting to make some decisions about just where it thinks Obama's momentum is manifesting itself. Specifically, it thinks that he's gained the most in states with lots of white, working class Clinton voters -- a result which might be intuited by the huge numbers that he's posting in Pennsylvania, or the fact that there's now another West Virginia poll out that shows the race nearly tied.

As a result, we're now coloring West Virginia white (toss-up) rather than pink (lean McCain). The model also thinks that Arkansas could be quite interesting the next time that it gets polled. The flip side is that Obama doesn't seem to have quite as much momentum in the Western half of the country, where Clinton generally performed poorly during the primaries.

253 comments

eve said...

Goat said...

"I hope we never get the frankly bizarre negative advertising campaigns over here though - I can't see that kind of thing washing with the electorate (remember when the Tories tried it with devil-eyed Blair? They were laughed out of town)."

It's not working here, either. By negative, I don't mean ads that point out issue-oriented difference. Such as the kind that might say "Obama voted for X and that's bad," if he really did vote for X. I mean the character assassinations. McCain and the RNC have been running lots of those. They are aimed at the independent voter and those ads are driving the independent voter to Obama.

So thanks McCain and RNC!

Alyssa said...

Mule Rider said...
"Crazy Prediction for Tonight's Debate: McCain comes in drunk, rambles incoherently for about 10 minutes about lowering taxes, calls Obama a baby-killing Muslim, and then leaves immediately.

Obama is speechless....left standing with mouth wide open. We awake on October 16th to see Obama ahead 80-20 nationwide. He cruises to an electoral sweep on 11/4."


Here's to hopin. If this happens I'll skip my ass to a church on Sunday for the first time in 26 years, and still be laughing.

ndav357 said...

Pre-debate jitters. Hit Sen. O for 300, Hagan and Martin for 100 each. Go BLUE!

Will said...

C'mon, AR is not nearly as red as MS or AL. I've lived here all my life and live in the most staunchly Republican part of the state (Wal-Mart Land) and even here you suddenly see more Obama signs, stickers, etc. than you would ever expect. In the rest of the state, thanks to Clinton, Pryor, Lincoln, Bumpers tradition, there is a base to draw from and the economic downturn has forced those uncomfortable with Obama to reconsider.

I don't think Obama will win, but it will probably be closer than most expect.

Eric said...

Trevor said...
Eric--it's just a single seat out of 25 in the state, so I don't know how much of a drag it will be.

Mahoney replaced Mark "maf54" Foley of all people, and is getting busted for a sex scandal too...now that's funny.


Is it a populous district? And is there a decent Republican alternative?

Darío said...

RCP puts Obama 58-38 in MA Obama up in Rasmussen.
The true result was 62-34 Obama.
Why they put other result?.
You´re right Nate, RCP is bastard.

mc9cain said...

Anybody talking about Palin running for anything again is crazy. Can you imagine her in one of those early debates against the 8 white rich guys in the GOP? I mean c'mon. The girl IS Miss South Carolina - nothing short of a total embarrassment to the GOP although a good majority of them won't admit it until the election is over. She wouldn't have made it out of the first round of debates for the Repub nomination. And she will be lucky to win as Governor again.

Eric said...

Do you folks think there will be some lean Republican older women that will vote for Obama to feel good that they voted for a "Black" man before they die? I'm not trying to be facetious. I bet there's a decent chunk who feel like any prejudice they've felt over the years can be forgiven if they vote for him. Is that strange?

Bex of Ambridge said...

@goat:

I know that '97 didn't turn out like we'd hoped (although I wasn't actually old enough to vote in that election) but I do think that Labour did (does) lots of really good things for this country. I genuinely do. They aren't the old labour I would like but I still think they made significant achievements, especially early on.

I also think that '97 was a truly incredible night, and one I will always remember. That mood of joy and hope did seize the country for quite a while I think, and it was awesome!

I think the same can be achieved on November 4th and, although it isn't going to be probably as life-changing as it will feel then (especially if there are Portillo type moments) it still will mean a significant shift in party politics in the US and therefore the world.

I'm the eternal optimist though...

Justin said...

NEED AN ANSWER! Please Help....

Need to know if I should donate money to Obama's website, or to a senate race that is tight (if the latter, am I allowed to if I do not reside in that state? And also, If I can....I was thinking of donating for Hagan...that way we can have no Doles and no Bush's in American politics anymore!)

It's only $25, but hey, at least I am opening my checkbook, right?

newsfromOH said...

Eric,

Obama's already got major numbers of lawyers on his side (including me!). We've got great procedures to speed up delays at the polls so I don't anticipate really long lines.

The Cleveland federal bench is largely Democratic with a couple of moderate Repubs and only one crazed Bushie that I know of. Their efforts in 2004 didn't bear much fruit and the process has strengthened even more since then (we used push pin/chad ballots back then--now it's the paper, color the bubble ballots which can be filled out on tables if necessary). We literally could have 50 people voting simultaneously at any given polling place.

Even so, the suspicion of the process has hit home with minority voters who don't even trust the mail to deliver their ballots. The uniform statement was "I'm going down there and handing it to them!!"

In the meantime, the suburb I live in has been notoriously Rep (even though it's at least 40% Dem). The Reps always had their yard signs out en masse. This year is very funny because few houses have them but those that do have multiples. It cracks me up--so few takers that McCain's staff hand out stacks to anyone who asks?? so few takers that they want it to look like more supporters by spanning their curbs with them? Or are they mere emphatic in their support?? Just things I laugh at as I drive around . . .

Eric said...

Have you Brits seen the movie "Love Actually"? hilarious. Hugh Grant plays a Tony Blair type and Billy Bob Thornton plays up the worst characteristics of both clinton and Bush Jr.. Absolutely hilarious. If you take the worst qualities of clinton and Bush Jr. , you get one pathetic soul.

mc9cain said...

I'm more nervous about the debate than the election. This will be the third straight debate I will be too nervous to watch. Reading live blogging is about all I can handle.

Alyssa said...

Wow Ralph Stanley and maybe bigots staying home must be doing wonders in WV.
I'm not so sure it'll go blue in the end but I'd like to see more frequent polling there.

On the flip side, I'm hearing so many stories now about other bigots voting for a "Muslim ni**er" b/c of the economy. I don't even know what to think about it anymore. Happy? Disgusted?

PJ McIlvaine said...

Breaking out of the Washington Post, McCain got free cell phone towers at his ranch from Verizon???WTF???

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/washingtonpostinvestigations/2008/10/exclusive_verizon_gave_cell_to.html?hpid=topnews

Justin said...

@Eric...

I love that movie...especially when "Blair" sticks it to the womainzing "Bush" plus it in general is a cute, funny movie....ever notice how that lady who gets cheated on by her hubby looks like Hill Clinton?

ndav357 said...

Justin - you can donate to any Senate race. Harder call where your money does the most good - RNC is sitting on a pile of money that needs to be countered, but, your donation could actually help more in the Senate races. Your call, go with what your heart tells you.

Eric said...

newsfromOH said...


you are one of the more important citizens out there. do your job well, I'm cheering for you. you know the bumper stickers "support the troops". I just want those troops to come home safe. I want a bumper sticker that says "support the Dem lawyers in Ohio"

ndav357 said...

Justin - you can donate to any Senate race. Harder call where your money does the most good - RNC is sitting on a pile of money that needs to be countered, but, your donation could actually help more in the Senate races. Your call, go with what your heart tells you.

Justin said...

ndav357...

No, my heart is torn..I need someone to tell me, lol.

Eric said...

Justin said...
@Eric...

I love that movie...especially when "Blair" sticks it to the womainzing "Bush" plus it in general is a cute, funny movie....ever notice how that lady who gets cheated on by her hubby looks like Hill Clinton?


Emma Thompson?

Justin said...

to add...if I could afford it...which i maybe could...I could maybe give 25 to Obama and another 25 to a senate... but that I'd just be torn on throwing that out the window and putting 50 towards either one

One$Earned said...

@mc9cain

deep breaths, it will be a spirited conversation between a Dem who is ahead in the polls and a Rep who is behind.

Many of the talking points will be restated again and there may be a surprise.

You gotta watch....so you can weigh in after the debate.

newsfromOH said...

joey,

As an Ohioan, I agree with your preference for shoring up VA and FL over OH. Bill Clinton will be in Cleveland tomorrow. Gov. Strickland can stump in So. Ohio. Surrogates are fine. Hell, if Dennis Kucinich would hold a rally in Parma, he could get his rabid base to turn deepest blue in a millisecond . . .

The people who aren't reached simply can't be reached. They're the rationally impaired folks that you've seen on youtube . . .

Justin said...

@Eric..
Yes that would be right...Emma Thompson...made me said when she finds out she got a shitty CD and not the necklace...therefor knowing she was being cheated on...BTW, totally sorry if you've never seen the movie...guess I just f-ed it for you...but seriously no, it still a really good movie...it follows several different peoples story lines through the holidays so I guess I didn't ruin it quite yet...GO PUT IT ON YOUR NETFLIX ALREADY...

mc9cain said...

Thanks one$earned. I might get the nerve to do that if it goes well for the first 1/2 hour.

Does anyone know if the audience is allowed to make noise at this debate? That's the only way I can see McCain doing well. He came up with a few good lines against Romney that worked and the crowd liked them. But if the audience is told to STFU, then he doesn't have the advantage.

Eric said...

Justin said...
to add...if I could afford it...which i maybe could...I could maybe give 25 to Obama and another 25 to a senate... but that I'd just be torn on throwing that out the window and putting 50 towards either one

McCain's camp is going to spend about $100MM the last two weeks strategically in the Battleground. They're sitting on their money. If you have a Senate race you're really focused on, then split your donation. Otherwise, send it to Obama.

Alyssa said...

@ Justin
After hearing about what a loathsome creature Chamblass Saxwhatshisname is, I donated to the GA senate race. I live in NY.

Justin said...

Wait...grr...was it a necklace or bracelet...I can't remember...
guess what's getting added to Netflix que right now........

ryan said...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ynews/20081015/pl_ynews/ynews_pl87

Hey Nate,

This yahoo story clumsily twists some of your words to make it seem like Obama really isn't that far ahead. God I have shitty reporters...It's difficult to even understand what their supposed logic should mean in the context.

Bex of Ambridge said...

I'm sorry but Hillary Clinton is no Emma Thompson. I was a big Hillary supporter but Emma Thompson would kick her ass!

newsfromOH said...

Eric,

Thanks--it's obviously really important to me that this goes well. Believe it or not, I've ordinarily been strenuously apolitical. Bush 04 changed all of that. I just want my country back now!

Alyssa said...

First live blog thread up

Charles Crook said...

Amazing:

The Sacramento County Republican Party compared Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., to terrorist leader Osama bin Laden, urging voters to "Waterboard Barack Obama."


http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/10/stay-classy-sac.html

Justin said...

Hmm...I really haven't been keeping on top of senate races so I don't know all the dirty things out there really....You see in my state we have Robertson and...ugh...hang on let me vomit before I say his name...okay Sam Brownback. Both of which always get re-elected...them and the NRA sockpuppet Todd Tihart...
anywho, I don't really know what senate races have a very good chance, or a 40/60ish chance of going D so any further feedback I could get on which race will be more beneficial I would greatly appreciate it
I know my fellow Dems out there would like to say they all are 50/50 out there...but I just don't quite buy all that....yet

nkpolitics1279 said...

Obama is going to carry all of the Gore/Kerry States including IA,NH,and NM. 264ev. plus

CO,VA,OH,NV,= 311ev.

FL and MO are leaning Obama

AR,IN,NC,and WV are tossups.

NC_voter said...

justin:

Obama's going to need that money when the RNC unleashes their coffers in a 72 hour push/smear campaign.

How about this.

You donate the $25 to Obama, and i'll donate $25 to Hagen. Right now.

mc9cain said...

ryan,
I think they had to fill some copy space and they had some big US maps for a lot of it. The headline is about a landslide being a sure thing. Of course it isn't. That's what the article started with as the question and ended with the answer of no. No one IS predicting a landslide (who knows anything). Most (including Nate) are saying that a possibility exists for it. Period.

One$Earned said...

<< just donated $100.00 to Obama for American Campaign.

The well is now dry...lol. $400.00 over the course of the campaign.

One less Christmas gift this year.

Alyssa said...

Justin

Use Nate's Senate race scorecard (right side) as a good place to start.

chrish60 said...

Need to know if I should donate money to Obama's website, or to a senate race that is tight (if the latter, am I allowed to if I do not reside in that state? And also, If I can....I was thinking of donating for Hagan...that way we can have no Doles and no Bush's in American politics anymore!)


One thought --

http://www.actblue.com/page/meta-analysis-08

Sam Wang's statistical analysis of where senate donations can be most effective.

BrEnTpDeLiA said...

I just wanted to say to GaMeS:
Your argument about voter fraud and racial profiling was so wonderfully laid out, so comprehensively explained I jsut thought you should get some props. Seriously. The fear of Arab Terrorism and "voter" fraud (actually voter registration fraud but lets not get picky) are so illusory that it boggles the mind. If your constantly afraid of boogeymen how can you make a calm and rational argument or decision. Please think through your positions. MY dad has voted Republican in every election in which he has voted. Nixon. TWICE. Bush? TWICE. He's voting for Obama. WHy? Because all though he is conservative he hjas taken this opportunity to actually question h is ideology and beliefs in the light of ew circumstances. Republicanism is now all about doubling down. Crazy

eve said...

I'm like you mc9cain -- easier not to watch and "view" it second hand through the blogs and comments.

Jake formerly of the LP said...

"Fannie and Freddie" reference. DRINK!

nkpolitics1279 said...

2008 Presidential Results.
DC- 94-6 (Obama-D)3
HI- 65-33 (Obama-D)7
VT- 64-34 (Obama-D)10
MD- 64-34 (Obama-D)20
NY- 63-36 (Obama-D)51
MA- 62-37 (Obama-D)63
DE- 60-38 (Obama-D)66
RI- 59-37 (Obama-D)70
CT- 58-39 (Obama-D)77
IL- 58-40 (Obama-D)98
CA- 57-41 (Obama-D)153
IA- 57-41 (Obama-D)160
WA- 56-42 (Obama-D)171
ME- 56-42 (Obama-D)175
OR- 56-43 (Obama-D)182
NJ- 55-42 (Obama-D)197
WI- 55-43 (Obama-D)207
PA- 55-43 (Obama-D)228
MI- 54-44 (Obama-D)245
MN- 54-44 (Obama-D)255
NH- 53-44 (Obama-D)259
VA- 53-46 (Obama-D)272(Obama wins)
CO- 52-46 (Obama-D)
NM- 52-46 (Obama-D)
FL- 52-47 (Obama-D)
OH- 51-47 (Obama-D)
NV- 51-48 (Obama-D)
MO- 50-49 (Obama-D)200
NC- 50-49 (Obama-D)189
WV- 49-49 (TIE)174
IN- 48-50 (McCain-R)169
AR- 48-50 (McCain-R)158
ND- 47-51 (McCain-R)152
GA- 47-52 (McCain-R)149
MT- 46-52 (McCain-R)134
LA- 46-52 (McCain-R)131
SD- 45-53 (McCain-R)122
MS- 45-53 (McCain-R)119
SC- 43-55 (McCain-R)113
TX- 43-55 (McCain-R)105
AZ- 43-56 (McCain-R)71
KY- 43-56 (McCain-R)61
TN- 42-56 (McCain-R)53
KS- 42-56 (McCain-R)42
AK- 41-57 (McCain-R)36
NE- 40-57 (McCain-R)33
AL- 40-59 (McCain-R)28
UT- 38-60 (McCain-R)19
OK- 37-62 (McCain-R)14
ID- 36-62 (McCain-R)7
WY- 34-65 (McCain-R)3

Eko said...

So, (I don't know if you get to read this far) you have mentioned a few times that you see the model indicating that Obama is starting to make gains among x group, etc. Is this anything quantifiable that you would be able to post and update regularly? Like, the most statistically significant factors and which candidate they are going for by how much? I don't know the best way to format it, but I think it might be an interesting thing to look at.

SJB22 said...

I live in Missouri and I can tell you that for the past two weeks, I have not seen a McCain ad. I have just started seeing the 'No Obama, NRA' ad--but that was only 2 days ago; and it was countered by the MODNC's print ad about Obama and the 2nd Amend. Tonight after the debate, which I channel surfed all over, I saw at least 6 Obama ads--the POSITIVE ones which reinforce his message on the economy, healthcare and CHANGE.

asehgal said...

How do you go from "Polling Average" to "Trend-Adjusted" in the state numbers. Seems to be adding points to Obama and drawing down McCain everywhere I spot-checked. Look particularly odd in WV where the polls show McCain +1.9 but you have Obama 52% to win.

Karthik said...

How/when did AR get so close?

egapre said...

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