Perhaps the CBS poll that shows Barack Obama with a 14-point lead among likely voters (12 points when third-party candidates are included) is a modest outlier. But if so, John McCain has more and more outliers that he has to explain away these days. There are now no fewer than seven current national polls that show Obama with a double-digit advantage: Newsweek (+11), ABC/Post (+10), Democracy Corps (+10), Research 2000 (+10), Battleground (+13), Gallup (+10 using their Likely Voter II model) and now this CBS News poll.
These are balanced by other results that show the race a hair tighter. Our model now projects that, were an election held today, Obama would win by 8.1 points. It also expects that the race is more likely than not to tighten some.
Nevertheless, we are a full month beyond the Lehman Brothers collapse in mid-September. Obama has enjoyed quite a remarkable run, turning a 2-point deficit into an 8-point advantage. What's especially remarkable about it is that Obama's lead has continued to increase with an eerily consistency. The collapse itself precipitated an almost immediate 3 or 4 point gain in Obama's poll numbers, moving him from a point or so down to a point or so ahead. But since then, Obama has won news cycle after news cycle, adding another two points or so to his national lead every week.
It's fairly unusual for a candidate to have such a sustained run of momentum so deep into the campaign cycle. And it does appear to be real momentum, with some real feedback loops: the worse McCain's poll numbers become, the more desperate his campaign looks, and the more desperate his campaign looks, the worse his poll numbers become.
McCain now has to go on a run of his own, a large enough run to wipe at least 8 points off of Obama's lead, and perhaps more like 9 or 10 to cover his inferior position in the Electoral College and the votes that Obama is banking in early and absentee balloting. It is imperative that McCain does not just draw tomorrow night's debate, does not just win a victory on points, but emerges with a resounding victory, the sort that leaves the spin room gasping for air. Failing that, we are getting into dead girl, live boy territory.
Let's look at the polls:
The state polls don't present a much brighter picture for McCain. In particular, the Quinnipiac set of polling, showing large leads for Obama in Colorado, Michigan, Minnesota and Wisconsin, is bad news for him. Note that Quinnipiac conducted two separate sets of polling both before and after last week's debate, with the debate only seeming to consolidate Obama's advantage.
Pennsylvania, meanwhile, where SurveyUSA has Obama sustaining a 15-point lead, may be joining Michigan as a state which is completely out of reach to McCain. Ohio is still within reach -- and the fact that it's lagging a couple of points behind Obama's national numbers is reason for McCain not to give the state especial concern -- but clearly now seems to lean toward Obama. The Suffolk result in Colorado is a little better for McCain than the Quinnipiac numbers, at least, and PPP has Obama moving slightly off his peak in North Carolina, although that may only be because McCain has finally started to invest resources there that he'd rather be spending everywhere else. The Tarheel State, in other words, has served its purpose for Obama, whether or not he ultimately wins it.
10.14.2008
Today's Polls, 10/14
by Nate Silver @ 8:22 PM...see also colorado, delaware, michigan, minnesota, missouri, momentum, national polls, north carolina, ohio, pennsylvania, south carolina, today's polls, wisconsin
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331 comments
Don't forget to donate to Defenders of Wildlife to help the commercials oin battle ground states and hip people to the Enemy of Nature~Palin
~Special council for The Trees
Well, McCain still has South Carolina
I Love this website, Nate the guru is the best. (he's a hottie!!)
Obama 2008
Time for the rats to flee the ship. Republicans will try to protect a few incumbents from the coming landslide, otherwise it's every (rich white old protestant) man for himself!
McCain's best chance at hurting Obama would be to endorse him.
There's my "Today's Polls" fix for the day. I'll start sweating and shaking again by about noon tomorrow.
FOURTH!
can we close the door on a mcsame win yet?
Donate to the extent you can, work even harder. I will be at the polls and watching vote counts all night as an attorney. This election CAN be historic, but only if WE make it historic.
I don't see the LA Times / Bloomberg poll that has McCain down by 9 points now over 4 last month.
Nate, what's your take on the Survey USA polls that break out the people surveyed who've already voted, and show Obama with huge leads in that group? Are those results credible? Do they lead to any conclusions? Are you going to factor them into your model?
Inquiring minds want to know!
You know, if Obama has a >95% chance of winning, doesn't that mean that a McCain win is now outside the margin of error?
November 4th needs to be here like NOW!
OBTW, how much does it cost the McCain campaign to hit on his ad?
Does it rack up a charge each time I hit it?
Math error in scenarios:
mccain loses OH wins election -- 9 of 8022
mccain loses OH/FL wins election -- 0 of 8014
by subtraction, mccain wins 9 out of 8 times!
The error is in the denominator 8014. McCain loses OH/FL roughly 7500 times, not 8014 times (87% Obama FL win percentage, less the 1129 times Obama wins FL but loses OH =~ 7500 times Obama wins FL and OH).
cheers. sorry to be nit-picky on math love the site, keep up the good work.
I am not really happy with these numbers. Obama should be ahead by at least 12 points nationally to secure his candidacy. I'll wait for the numbers until Sunday. If McCain is trailing by 6+ points in 4 battlegrounds, then Obama would have a good chance of winning, otherwise, Palin VP (ARGH!).
The market will eventually tank AGAIN in the next few weeks to high 7000's. If it occurs before the election day, Obama would have a better chance of pocketing from the situation.
pwned.
NO ON PROP 8!!!
OMG - you really said " dead girl, live boy territory!"
and people wonder why i am addicted to this site!
IMO MT is way to red on the 528 map since RP will be on the ballot there and is pretty popular in MT.
Ahead by 5 or more is a victory in the EC.
One thing that I have been curious about is the effect of early voting in states like Ohio on the Nov. 4 exit polls. If the election is closer than now projected Obama supporters will look to the exit polls for verification of the result. Yet early Obama voters won't be represented in those election day numbers.
On the one hand, I'd like for this election to just go ahead and be over already, but on the other... you guys have been awesome, your comments and clicks on my blog!!! (and if you don't like, don't click).
Sarah Cruella Subtly Slams Obama and the rest of us.
Damn, I wish the Canadian polls looked that good.
Typo #2
Paragraph 3
"eerily consistency"
Don't.
Count.
Your chickens.
Ain't over til it's over, gang. Three weeks is an eternity in politics.
Complacency is the Enemy! Make sure you and at least 5 peopele you know go to the polls and vote on Nov 4th. Make it a party event and have a social event after voting. A suggestion is to offer a free drink to everyone who shows up with an "I voted" sticker. Let's give President Obama a real mandate by having the highest voter turnout ever, and turn as many red states blue as possible.
Cheers to all.
Please but 11/4 on the Super Tracker so we have a sense of how long there is to go...
dario,
Not if the undecided and error margin is large. Obama has to press more on issues, better communicate his position.
Remember, America is a "Red" nation. Obama needs more than tough talk to win.
I think I just had a pollgasm. Thanks Nate, my man!
53.4% landslide chance.
Wow.
And dead girl live boy is a great little proverb.
Word on the internets is that McCain is pulling out of WI (quietly, so as not to repeat the Michigan debacle). I can't imagine PA is far behind. It's time for McCain to forget about offense, hunker-down in the Bush states (minus Iowa), and pray for the live boy/dead girl.
Survey USA was dead on the $$$ in the primaries~I'd like to think of it as the Bell Weather poll.(haha) I have 10 folks in My family whom have ALREADY voted (for Obama) here in Cuyahoga County~including My formerly racist grandpa~age 87
~Special council for the Trees...
At this point, the only thing I'm really worried about is the whole ACORN voter registration mess. It's not that I think people will vote against Obama for it, though... it's that I worry the right-wing message will be "the Dems stole the election, it's invalid, McCain would have won if the polls weren't rigged". And that would be a terrible thing, because the distrust - and lack of realization that the landslide was legitimate - would keep Obama from being able to effectively reach across the aisle and get consensus on stuff (the political policy that got the guy noticed in 2004 to begin with).
Is there any way to clean the voter lists up before election day, so that we don't have to deal with this crap once the dust has settled?
Thanks Nate!
What am I going to obsess about when this is over? I'm going to be like a boozehound with an empty bottle.
Please, no transition team stories. Bad, bad karma.
"America is a Red Nation".
That´s a mith, american people isn´t all the middle America.
Generalization not help the analysis.
aria-
why do you buy this insane sceanario you posit?
Burt- I, personally, hate that breakout (though it is yummy addicting). There is an ethical reason why exit polling is not disclosed until the polls close (ie the early release of exit polling can make the candidate who is downs supporters more likely to vote and the one who is up more complacent). I think that the early close on the east coast has effected turnout drastically on the West Coast and especially Hawaii even though the exit polling is seperate. The early voting number break out in my mind are the equivalent of an exit poll and thus should be withheld from the public til the actual votes are in.
"Failing that, we are getting into dead girl, live boy territory."
HA HA, after Mark Foley, can we retire this expression? Or maybe he proves it continues to apply!
It's time for them to experience the same dread and despair we've felt for seven of the last ten elections.
While I dream of an Obama landslide, I'd also be very happy with McCain spending lots of time and money in places like MO, IN, and NC and winning them.
On the other hand, he's welcome to spend more time in IA, PA, WI, ME and MN!
53.4% chance of an Obama landslide? Ouch! Y'know, the polls have turned so incredibly blue over the past few weeks that now I've stopped worrying about how close the polls are, and have *started* worrying about whether the polls actually reflect reality. It just seems...*too* good to be true.
Or, more likely, I just worry too much.
(For fun: John McCain Political Rally Bingo Card: Link! Enjoy!)
I don't think that this race is going to tighten the way many of you think it will(and if it does obama will still win by a healthy margin, I feel).
The reasons are many. The public is learning more about Obama, and liking what they, see during this financial crisis. McCain has been horrible during this stretch, and Obama's team has jumped on it (and him); calling him erratic and lurching. It's working.
The Palin effect. In practically all polls, her negatives are now higher than her positives. They hate her! But worse, voter's are lethally afraid of her being in charge incase McCain croaks.
Of course there's blame for the economy on the Republicans. Who could forget that.
Also, Obama has a supressed cellphone, African American/Latino turn out, Reverse Bradley (rednecks who are afraid to tell their friends and family, but will vote for Obama) and Good white person, who would like to see a black in the White House vote effect.
I think all these factors, have made a double digit Obama lead plausible, and not something to be suspect.
I think one possible explanation for the positive feedback loop-style gains that Obama has been making is that many undecided voters seem to need to feel like they're not alone in picking him. So when his numbers go up, more undecideds feel enter the comfort zone and say they'll vote for him, then his numbers go up again, and so on...
fred,
Would you please elaborate what part of my posit you disagree with?
McCain is hopeless.
@ Nick...
Good point about undecided voters and your take on it.
My children and I are definitely planning a very special party for November 4th. In addition to celebrating the election of Barack Obama as President of the United States, which will be unbelievably fantastic, we will be celebrating my 70th Birthday. I have been an Obama supporter for almost a year now...one more old white woman for Obama! I may write a book...My Life...from the Great Depression to the Great Obama Election.
aria-
That somehow Obama is behind and you do not believe the polls now.
IDB-TIPP takes only 825 people.
Rasmussen and Gallup takes more than 2500 people.
With more people survey, more credible is the poll.
Nick said...
I think one possible explanation for the positive feedback loop-style gains that Obama has been making is that many undecided voters seem to need to feel like they're not alone in picking him. So when his numbers go up, more undecideds feel enter the comfort zone and say they'll vote for him, then his numbers go up again, and so on...
I concur. Americans like a winner and once they sense Obama's likelier than not to win, they will break for him, which is what we're seeing. How long can it continue, hopefully until Nov. 4!
Obama Tenuously Clings to Razor-thin 14 Point Lead.
McCain Surges ahead to -14 POINT LEAD!!!!!!!
The new CBS poll is great news..............FOR JOHN MCCAIN!
The National Enquirer is apparently trying the live boy part of the equation, saying Obama knew some perv when he (Obama) was 10, and the man served as a mentor. No nefarious conduct against Obama mentioned, and the story even says Obama had no way of knowing.
They can't even do dead girl/live boy against him right. This is gonna be a landslide in the EC.
"Failing that, we are getting into dead girl, live boy territory."
A "live boy" might not be as devastating as it seems. Regardless a citizens revolt via a imminent "Republican bloodbath” at the polls is on track and unstoppable at this phase.
OBAMA 2008
fred,
I didn't assert that Obama is "behind." I merely express my opinion in not being fully comfortable with current numbers and the a minuscule momentum that McCain apparently has picked up in the last few days -- even if it's marginal. I want to sleep soundly for the next 3 weeks rather than imagining Palin dusting and basking around the White House.
And if McCain's numbers slide much lower, considering the margin of error, he might not even exist.
Rich
"McCain Surges ahead to -14 POINT LEAD!!!!!!!"
hahaha. Sad part is, that's probably how they'll have poor old Tucker Bounds spin it tonight and tomorrow.
aria siad: "minuscule momentum that McCain apparently has picked up in the last few days"
I can´t see that momentum at the moment.
ACORN is a non issue if it's a landslide. Some homeless guys in Las Vegas who were registered 15 times (and probably didn't vote at all) couldn't get BO to 375 EVs.
aria, i understand you.
I think the only factor who can help McCain is the racist vote.
With other candidate, the dems are leaning now by 15 points.
What percentage of people are left that actually like the entire McCain/Palin ticket? I am not talking about those who are voting against Obama or those who like Palin's evangelical views or like McCain's fiscal conservatism but still like the entire ticket. 10%?
Also Ipsos/McClatchy has their national out today -- a 9 point lead, up from 7 a week ago. 2-way is 51-42. With 3rd party 48-39.
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/homepage/story/53914.html
the Vicious S&M closet queen Drudge
is screaming about the racist Zogby poll that is ALREADY leaked showing Obama down and with a 3 pt lead...
bwahhahahahhaha
that nasty queen drudge is so deperate
Eight years is an effin' eternity. The exuberance about the polling isn't a sign of complacency. In fact, its the opposite. So stop your nettlesome worrying, worryworts.
I cannot reveal my sources but I heard that ACORN warned the authorities about oddities in their registrations, even turned in suspect batches of registration forms seperately, but they were repeatedly ignored. The truth will all be public soon and the raid will be revealed as a right wing publicity stunt.
My understanding is that ACORN by law HAS to turn in all voter registration forms, but they do review them for inconsistincies, and they do give authorities a warning if they have some screwy stuff.
"McCain Surges ahead to -14 POINT LEAD!!!!!!!"
McCain has Math right where he wants it!
well, for some odd reason, can't seem to cut and paste - but to answer Burt's question about the SurveyUSA poll that breaks out 'already voted' people - my guess would be that it has a small sample size so a high level of error. As the sample size gets greater, the #s will be more accurate, but for now, I wouldn't count on them *too* much.
Should Chuck Todd be taking CO out of the 'toss-up' column, based upon the same criteria that moved PA into the Obama column?
Is he being squeezed by his bosses to avoid a situation where over 270EVs are marked up as 'firm Obama' or 'lean Obama', rather than acting as if the toss-up states are decisive?
One essential overlooked component in Obama's bounce post Lehman, is the emergence of the "lying" meme about McCain/Palin. It was right around this time that Palin's Bridge to Nowhere lie was being fully exposed. Also these were the days of McCain's "sex to kindergarteners" and other unfair attacks being discussed in the MSM. The economic picture pushed things along, but I think the self-induced unraveling of the "Maverick" brand was well under way before the crisis, even if polls did not quite capture it...
FYI regarding "Failing that, we are getting into dead girl, live boy territory.", see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edwin_Edwards
---
Before election day, Edwards had joked with reporters: "The only way I can lose this election is if I'm caught in bed with either a dead girl or a live boy".
---
murrman,
He has gained some marginal points in OH and VA. I don't like this and if you excuse me, I'll go pull my hairs out.
TWENTY ONE DAYS...THREE WEEKS....TWO PAY CHECKS FOR ME....TWO HOME GAMES FOR THE GREEN BAY PACKERS.....ONE SUNDAY TO SET THE CLOCKS BACK.... That's all the time left before the election.
Interesting to see the regression number for Texas descending a bit.
The Obama´s bounce was after the first debate, not after Lehman bankrupt.
aria, if McCain lose VA or OH, he will lose the election.
McSame needs a game changer. He's looking to create one in the next debate:
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/10/mccain-obama-pr.html
Speaking to a St. Louis radio station on Tuesday, John McCain said that Barack Obama's recent suggestion that McCain does not have guts to raise the Bill Ayers issue to his face "probably ensured" that the former Weather Underground leader will come up in Wednesday's final presidential debate.
"You have another debate coming up. The final debate. Many of your supporters are eager for you to confront Senator Obama on the Bill Ayers relationship in particular. Hillary Clinton even brought this up during the primary. Sen. Obama says you should have the guts to do it in person. So will you?" McCain was asked by KMOX's Mark Reardon.
"Oh yeah," said McCain. "You know, I was astonished to hear him say that he was surprised for me to have the guts to do that. Because the fact is that the question did not come up in that fashion so--you know--I think he's probably ensured that it will come up this time."
LA - I should hope it would be devastating if we read 'girl' and 'boy' as referring to minors...in which case you'd hope a live girl would be equally devastating. If it's talking about young adults then, yeah, I'd hope it wasn't so.
I'm afraid of these huge poll differentials. I'm afraid that many people won't go vote thinking that their vote isn't needed for Obama to win. Gotta get the word out every vote is needed.
I am so nervous. On November 6th, I'll take a day off, if Obama wins I'll be going to Political Junkies' Rehab. Anyone care to join me.
@ Dario, no kidding.
OHIO is the true swing state here. That's the only state that I focus on and watch with trepidation and concern.
Ohio has voted correctly in the last five presidential elections along with KY, TN & LA.
If McCain talk about Ayers in the debate he lost the last independents and undecideds.
No Dead girl, but Drudge tried the "white girl" angle yesterday. He has such breathtaking journalistic standards.
Yes - ACORN is a non-issue. The Republicans will try to push it, but it's one crime to fill out bogus voter registrations, it's a completely different matter for bogus voters to actually go vote. The first one, while still a crime, has no affect on the outcome of the election. The second one, *if* it actually happened, would.
TPM has been reporting on the ACORN story for quite some time. In many states they *have* to turn in all the forms that their workers turn in, and they were flagging ones they thought might be suspect. Voter fraud happens at the polls, not during registration. There may be a very small number of people out there who actually do go and vote twice under two different names, but I'm guessing that number is dwarfed by the number of people who are unable to vote because of various schemes to disenfranchise them.
Wake me up with Mickey Mouse actually goes to the polls.
I'm wondering just how much of Obama's surge can be attributed to his ground game. If, as it seems, Obama is starting to shift to GOTV, that the door knocking started in earnest in early September, what we may be seeing here is - to some extent - based on that personal contact starting to happen.
People, the numbers of the polls are different but they have one point in common: Obama leads in all.
In 2004 Kerry leads some polls but Bush leads the majority of polls.
If McCain loses all the polls he can´t win.
Todd,
Exactly!
It is one kind of scandal to register Mickey Mouse. It is quite a different scandal if Mickey Mouse shows up to cast a vote.
This is infuriatingly poorly reported. Registration fraud IS NOT voter fraud and by itself DOES NOT impact election results
Ms Mike,
Wow, what a 70th birthday present. I'd go for all SEVENTY candles:)
Todd- as an Election officer I can tell you that the odds are high that in each precinct there is at least 1 write in ballot with Mickey Mouse spelled right and 1 with Mickey Mouse spelled wrong submitted. So the Mickey Mouse vote is probably about .01% of the coutry. As for voters and not candidates named Mickey they aren't getting past me in Virginia.
I have to say, I think Sen. McCain is doing a fine job with his campaign of showing us just what kind of president he would be. He's acted out erratic, dogmatic, deceitful, denial and stubborn clinging to a failed ideology. His fault finding and finger pointing has boomeranged and his courting of the self righteous right has destroyed his credibility as an independent thinker and actor. Perhaps such a fine performance is deserving of a presidential medal of honor from Bush. I'm sure it would mean a lot to him.
those positive feedback loop-style gains that Obama has been making have been feeding the rise & stability of the Obama leads here in FL
as more & more of the swing votes are able to convine themselves that it really is OK to support him, and as the polls suggest that their friends & neighbors agree then this momentum allows Obama to seal the deal...
but we want to bank those votes ASAP, just in case the sleaze attacks start to penetrate in the next 3 weeks...
Everybody keeps asking "where is McCain's floor?"
It seems like McCain became curious and is trying to find out!
TYPO: . . . "continued to increase with an eerily consistency."
Should be eery, not earily.
CSpan starting with CBC election coverage
380 EV's floks, 380 EV's. Maybe more but we will hit 380 with the hardest of work. WE MUST KEEP WORKING. We MUST turn that entire map blue.
MATT DRUGE is a closet case - end of story. And in reference to my previous comment I was attempting to state that even "if” A "boy" or "girl" (consenting adults) were caught in Obama's closet, it would not matter, he'd still win considering the political climate.. At least I hope Americans aren't stupid enough to put Pailn within a heartbeat away from the most powerful office on earth.
MATT DRUGE is a closet case - end of story. And in reference to my previous comment I was attempting to state that even "if” A "boy" or "girl" (consenting adults) were caught in Obama's closet, it would not matter, he'd still win considering the political climate.. At least I hope Americans aren't stupid enough to put Pailn within a heartbeat away from the most powerful office on earth.
Asian markets are all down in early trading. DOW likely to fall tomorrow before debate
When a former publisher of National Review Online, Wick Allison , and now, Christopher Buckley , son of William F. Buckley are behind Obama, and with past remarks from Conservative icons such as George Will speak out against McCain, you can bet there is a shift in the conservative movement.
I find it great these gentlemen speak out and ignore party lines for what is truly important for America.
What a great day in politics and a great time for this Nation and how fortunate we are to have a true pragmatic thinker such as Obama is here to lead us out of this mess we're in now.
the only way Obama can lose if they find him in the hay with a dead Drudge or a live horse.
(or maybe the other way around.)
Go ahead. Make my day Sarah Palin.
I have an interesting prediction game folks. Try to predict the state where Obama will overperform most, relative to the polls right before the election. Underperform?
It's actually really tough to do.
eric,
Obama will overperform in GA.
Underperform in HA.
I think he will lose GA but narrowly. And Win HA, but the election will be called before the polls close depressing turnout
I meant HI
Andy's right about the error. E(lose OH+FL) is a subset of E(lose OH). By pigeonhole principle, at least one of those 9 victories would *have* to be without FL, since only at most 8 can be with FL. So those numbers can't be right. Please tell me that's a copy-and-paste error or something, because otherwise your simulation has a bug in it.
Drudge as a self hating homophobe? It would explain alot...
yitz and Andy,
There is a small bug. It has come up before.
"and the votes that Obama is banking in early and absentee balloting."
Is there any way to quantify this? I've read that up to 1/3 of votes will be cast early this year. Do we have any idea how many votes have been cast so far, how many are being cast every day, week, etc? Thanks, and keep up the great work!
Drudge is not really in the closet and among his many faults homophobia is hardly prominent if true at all.
He's in it for the money and attention. I doubt he has much ideology.
4% wow
Remember McCain's water grab in Colorado?
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/10/14/122731/75/350/630208
BTW, have the "librul media" even mentioned McCain's ties to ACORN, or his Saddam Hussein lobbyist?
"I have an interesting prediction game folks. Try to predict the state where Obama will overperform most, relative to the polls right before the election. Underperform?"
It sort of depends on what you mean by "the polls". If you just say, relative to the last raw poll numbers before the election, then I'd go with a state like (as of now) South Dakota where the only two polls since early July show McCain up 16 and 17, but Nate says that these "trend-adjust" to a McCain lead of only 7.1 pts and the '538 regression' has McCain leading by only 5.3 points.
If, on the other hand, your baseline is over- or under-perform Nate's projection, then I think that'd be much tougher to predict, since I tend to think that Nate's got a really good handle on this stuff (as I'm sure most of you agree).
While they may I don't nescessarly think the polls will tighten. Obama has been exceeding poll expectations for so long now that would it not shock you if his polls numbers kept going up every week till november 4th?
Also I can guarntee that Obama will win all of the quick polls the networks and etc do after the debate tomorrow. Obama will gain more Independents tomorrow than Mccain does and Obama will gain more undecideds than Mccain does.
sfergus483
drudge IS a closet case self hatefull S&M queen
bet on it take it to the bank
It also seems VERY unlikely that McCain Loses OH and wins FL only 8 times. The loses OH and FL number (8014) must be the problem.
The narrative in the MSM is now that Obama has a large and growing lead, an dtheta the conservatives are showing signs of desperation.
Any bets on how long before the MSM starts talking about an Obama landslide?
Hey, Karl Rove. You don't know squat about math you amoral criminal.
Nate is the one with THE math.
:)
Matt W,
Georgia is a good guess. I understand about 40% of the early voting has been AA. If AA turnout is exceptionally high, that will help him. Bob Barr will likely help Obama there. Also, white Atlanta and burbs are probably a little less racially driven than some other parts of the deep south. Nate's guess of McCain +5 is probably about right. Hawaii is probably a good guess too to underperform.
How about states he'll win or lose unexpectedly. Any guess? IE Win Missouri, but lose Colorado. Something strange like that. Or win Montana, but lose Nevada.
Sloth: Part of Obama's success is due to his ground game, part due to Bush's horrific record, & part due to McCain's own erratic actions.
But an important part of his success is that Obama has been working hard to build useful alliances. You can see it in his ground game, which dovetails with Dean's "50 state strategy". But you can also see it in how he has taken advantage of the netroots. One difference I have noticed between 2008 & 2004 was that people on the Democratic fora were constantly writing "This bad thing is happening -- why doesn't Kerry & his people do something about it." Now the message is "This bad thing is happening -- this is what we need to do."
There is a revolution in motion this year, IMHO.
Geoff
Dear Aria,
really not sure what polls you are looking at, but Obama has a 9 point lead in aggregate nationally, and is blowing Mccain out in state polls, by far the best he has polled all year, so McCain is far from moving a point or two up in the polls.
I never thought I would see 6 polls on one day showing Obama with a double digit lead nationally, and every poll but Zogby showing him over 50%. You want a Reagan 84 or Nixon 72 or Johnson 64 lead? Ain't gonna happen, but Obama is on course to be the first Dem since Lyndon Johnson to get a convincing popular vote majority. Probably 53-45 2 or better
As that good liberal Bobby McFerrin would say, don't worry, be happy.
I see this as very much like a heavyweight match, where the unskilled slugger McCain has been throwing haymakers all fight, been decked again and again by the superior boxer Obama, and is now hanging in a clinch in the 14th round, hoping he can headbutt Obama or land one lucky punch.
Barring that (and believe me, G Gordon Liddy's best friend will try), it is done. More likely that Obama will finish him off at the debate will a skillful and unruffled combination. You can bet money they have a preset piece ready if McCain trys to show his irascible Ayers side.
Glaring silence from the once ubiquitous P Kent, V Con and D Crow...hmmm, miss those breathless portents of doom from P K, esp, when every twitch and turn in the daily polls was a first sign of Obama's decline.
Does anybody have a picture of Sean? Because right now I'm working off of the assumption that he looks roughly identical to Seth Rogan, which I think is inherently flawed. So a picture would be appreciated, if it exists.
Nate,
You've gotta frontpage this. Unbelievable.
http://www.americablog.com/2008/10/david-gregory-meet-pollstercom-and.html
Your McCain Media at work.
How about this? Assuming Obama wins,
most likely GOP candidate for 2012 in order?
Romney or Jindal?
most likely 2016 Dem?
Schweitzer or Kaine?
Could the "eerily consistent" increase be due to Obama's steady and prolonged ground game advantage? Thanks, all ye courageous canvassers!
What's the breaking news about Ohio having to verify new voters?
Yea...we know many Republicans that said that if McCain brings up Acorn or any other mud that he automatically looses the debate due to desperation...pretty rough coming from your own party.
Eric,
I do not think there will be any huge surprises, but I do think he is going to be behind all night in MO and barely sneak out a win when the KC returns finally all come in. Just like the Senate race in MO in 2006.
All I care about is: West Virginia.
How goes in the Hillbilly State?
Please, please, please I beg of everybody:
Do not get complacent.
Here in SW Michigan, we've lost Obama volunteers since McCain pulled out... that worries me immensely.
Remember, remember, whatever day in November it was that Gore barely lost, people.
Also remember there are plenty of US and State House/Senate races too close to call.
And as someone who was taught statistics by an ex-Marine (and taught them well, I might add) - love, love, love the site.
Christopher said...
"...it's that I worry the right-wing message will be "the Dems stole the election, it's invalid, McCain would have won if the polls weren't rigged".
Is there any way to clean the voter lists up before election day, so that we don't have to deal with this crap once the dust has settled?"
The voter lists are not the problem. When Obama wins the wingnuts will claim he didn't really win. No matter what and no matter how big the margin.
That will not stop Obama from working with Congress. Everything won't always go smoothly. It is Washington and we do face big, big problems. But Obama, Pelosi, and Reid will get things done and they will work with Republicans to do so.
I expect a six-eight point final Popular Vote margin. Allotting approximately 2% to the various minor party candidates, that puts Obama at somewhere from 52-46 to 53-45 in the final popular vote. I'd be surprised if Obama gets less than 51.5% nationally, but also a bit surprised if he gets more than 53.4%. That 51.5-53.4 range all rounds off to either 52% or 53%.
At this point a victory by McCain would be a shock.
One more difference between Obama and McCain:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/10/14/eveningnews/main4522423.shtml
Breaking News regarding Voting in OHIO on MSNBC.com
On Nate's map West Virginia is now a lake.
Thanks for the NC shout-out..we're trying our hardest to turn this place blue. We might just get there with GOTV coming up in a few weeks.
Like you said, Nate, whether we go blue or not, we have definitely helped bolster his numbers for the time being.
I can't believe people are still talking about Romney in 2012.
To put it crudely, one of the reasons Obama is winning this election is because minority voters support him because he's from a minority himself, and white women voters support him because he's that handsome black guy they always wanted to go on a date with. However, he's still neck-and-neck with McCain with white men. White men haven't got a big reason to support him apart from hating Bush and the GOP.
Just got home from working the polls in a special election here in Cleveland. Heavily minority neighborhood. Resounding number of them have already or plan to very soon vote early directly at the Board of Elections to make sure their votes are counted.
On another note, sorry if this has been repeated, but if you haven't yet donated to the Obama Matching Donation, please do. It's incredibly cool!!! They use your donation to match the donation of someone new, with the goal to get 100,000 new donors in October.
The especially cool part is that you can send a message with your donation with the choice of hearing back from the new donor. My donation was split and brought at least 5 new donors to the team--and I received very, very cool things back from all of them.
Just makes you even more enthusiastic about this campaign, even if you don't think that's even possible.
The only problem for Obama in West Virginia is the democratic vote.
WV is one of the states with large ID party advantage for the dems in the country.
Clinton won WV in 1996 for 51-36.
Obama can win easily WV if the 86% of the dems vote for him.
Of course, the most important problem for Obama in WV is the racist democrat vote.
Stop worrying Jen. Obama has michigan in the bag.
@michael,
Reminds me of the Larry Holmes/Randall "Tex" Cobb fight.
Holmes keep looking at the ref, wanting him to stop the fight, afraid that he might really hurt Cobb.
Too bad that a TKO couldn't be called right now.
Jennifer,
Calm down. eep your head down and your eye on the prize, but momentum is gathering not slacking!
Reasons Obama will maintain advantage and not suffer frontrunner effect:
1. Historic election and people want to vote
2. Enthusiasm gap growing
3. People jump off sinking ships and hop on bandwagons
4. Most people are scared that the polls lie (specifically the much debuned bradley effect)
5. Dems want to run up the score
6. Early voting
7. Other reasons?
Dario;
Why do so many of your posts contain the word "racist"?
"How about this? Assuming Obama wins,
most likely GOP candidate for 2012 in order?
Romney or Jindal?"
Given the current state of the economy, the economy in 2012 is quite likely to be better than the current economy, which should mean that Obama will be a heavy favorite for re-election (see, for example, Clinton and Reagan). Such an environment is likely to scare away the best and brightest from the Republican side (this is part of how we get landslides like Reagan '84 or Nixon '72).
Because of this, I would expect Jindal to pass on running in 2012. Romney, on the other hand, is old enough that he probably can't afford to wait until 2016, so I would expect him to run.
Believe it or not, I actually think that, as of right now, Sarah Palin is the Republican frontrunner for 2012. She still has a base of hardcore true-believer supporters and, given Obama's likely popularity, she could have a relatively clear path to the nomination. Barring some weird turn of events that seriously damages Obama's popularity but does so too late to draw the big Republican guns into the primaries, though, I think Palin would most likely be a sacrificial moose against Obama's re-election campaign.
But, of course, we really are getting WAY too far ahead of ourselves with all of this speculation.
I don't see any other network talking about any Ohio court decision. I thought the sec'y of state had won in an appeals court. Is the MSNBC page showing old content?
Hi, everyone! I'm a new poster and first I want to say how much I enjoy this site and all the comments.
This may be a silly concern, and I'm hoping you all can assuage it: do you think Obama could be so far ahead now that people are assuming his victory is a done deal? To the extent that they may not show up to vote? If so, I'd be happy to see McCain creep up just a LITTLE, enough to give Democrats a fighting spirit on election day.
Charles, in November 5 you can understand the reason.
about a 2 years ago I was thinking rock bottom for this country was going to be a 2009-2012 Republican President reversing Roe v Wade through court appointments. At that point the country would wake up as to the disaster that is Neo-Conservatism. I'm pleasantly optimistic that the real rock bottom was electing GW Bush, woh made many strategic blunders, the primary one being choosing a preemptive war in Iraq in 2002/2003. It took that War playing out and his full Presidency for us to finally wake up, but thank God, I think we have. I have watched the Neo-Con movement grow for most of my life from 1980-Present. My concern was I didn't know how this country would wake up. I'm so glad it seems to be happening. Is Barack Obama more Luke Skywalker or the Second Coming?
Sarah Palin could destroy her chances at a future presidential bid if she explodes at McCain and his campaign after they suffer a bad defeat. I get the feeling with Palin that she's always just on the edge of anger, but she's currently holding it in while the campaign continues.
But the Bradley effect is +15%.
So this is GREAT NEWS FOR MCCAIN!!!!!
I've been supporting Obama for over a year now. But I have to say I won't feel confident until I stay up on November 4. How many of us really know if respondents being polled are telling the truth? How many are just saying they'd vote for Obama because they're being asked the question and the momentum is going his way? What will they really do when they enter the voting booth? I'm hoping only a small percentage end up not doing what they say they will do.
RealClearBias Watch:
Still no Ipsos/McClatchy O+9 poll on RCP.
Laura,
(See my comment a few before yours!)
There is something called a frontrunner effect where if one candidate has a lead of 10% or more they underperform by 2-3%. I do not think that is likely this year for the reasons I listed in my previous comment.
Referred to the site a month or so ago and cannot pinpoint why I am addicted. Do I like reading comments all day long and clicking on links, the On The Road Series, the Poll updates which I can't get enough of. I seriously am on on fricking day, and somehow I missed the discussion where IN is leaning blue? Darn it! still working on how to change my log in name =)
~Yari
More info on the breaking Ohio voter news....
http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20081014/NEWS0106/310150008
Andrew said...
RealClearBias Watch:
Still no Ipsos/McClatchy O+9 poll on RCP.
It's not a particularly problematic bias since his poll of poll numbers is close to 9%.
A federal appeals court on Tuesday ordered Ohio's top elections official to set up a system by the end of the week to verify new voters' eligibility and make it available to Ohio's 88 county election boards.
http://www.ohio.com/news/ap?articleID=925979&c=y
Also, Obama 80%+ on intrade right now, McCain at 20.2
eric,
I am sorry but I have to really disagree. I am very pro-choice, but "rock-bottom" for our country may include a reversal of Roe, but IS NOT defined by a reversal of Roe. There are serious economic, and foreign policy (war) issues that should be considered much more central to our political system than abortion.
"Jennifer said: Please, please, please I beg of everybody: Do not get complacent"
Although I agree with MattW too, it is not the time to get complacent. I convinced my 74 year old mom to start volunteering yesterday despite obama's "lead" in maine. We have to keep up the pressure until the bloody end.
Sad to say, but I think there are a lot of voters who like to vote for the winner. Especially for the people who haven't made up their minds yet. After all, with the current two candidates, how could you not make up your mind. They are completely different in so many ways.
So my cynical view is that as we reach the goal line, O is getting more momentum from the people who are incapable of making a decision and they sway towards the likely winner. In this case, it is my candidate so I am cool with that. But it still reflects a sad state of affairs for the country as a whole.
I would also appreciate an explanation of how Indiana goes blue. None of the polls indicate this is happening so I do not understand how it can be projected. As a Hoosier I would love it. Glad someone else asked first because it has been bothering me for days.
"To put it crudely, one of the reasons Obama is winning this election is because minority voters support him because he's from a minority himself, and white women voters support him because he's that handsome black guy they always wanted to go on a date with."
If by crudely, you mean "foolishly", I agree.
The GOP will try to suppress voting in the battleground states by claiming fraudulant registration by ACORN. I really hope that the Obama Campaign is on top of this.
http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/AB/20081014/NEWS0106/310150008/
Republican judges APPROVE voter suppression in Ohio.
KEEP UP THE GROUND GAME!
Never be complacent! Complacency is a cancer to any democracy.
In the case of the current election. Fight like mad to run up the score in every state. Both EC and Pop vote totals will contribute to "mandate". Obama needs a strong mandate to fix the mess we are in.
All you in Red states, fight and struggle to make them less red. That is important too!
The vote was along party lines, repub judges are ALL FOR voter suppression.
Glad to see the MSM is FINALLY picking up Caribou Barbie's ties to AIP.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/10/14/151519/61/145/630389
Hey, Karl Rove. You don't know squat about math you amoral criminal.
Nate is the one with THE math.
:)
That was great.... I almost drove off of the side of the I-270 spur when I heard that one.
"Republican judges APPROVE voter suppression in Ohio".
And they talk about the ACORN "fraud". If that isn´t fraud, what is?
imadis said...
OBTW, how much does it cost the McCain campaign to hit on his ad?
Does it rack up a charge each time I hit it?
Most cost-per-click advertising systems keep track of unique visitors to one degree or another, so it probably wouldn't keep racking up multiple clicks -- at least not more than a few hours apart.
In fact, they often have anti-fraud measures that will exclude apparent attempts to manipulate the system, so multiple clicks might make it where none of them count.
Now, that said, different systems work different ways, and the ones here don't appear to be cost-per-click or cost-per-impression -- an ad in the premium spot in the left-hand column, as of right now, appears to cost a whopping $1295/week, which get you an average of around 5 million weekly impressions (about $0.26 per thousand impressions -- a pretty respectable rate). However, I'll admit that I haven't looked at it very carefully, so I might be missing an important detail.
With an ad system that runs on a flat fee, the only thing a click does is drive up the apparent traffic coming from that source. This might make them more likely to keep buying the ad space, but they're almost certain to look at unique visitors rather than simple clicks, and that means that over-clicking won't do much of anything.
Instead, if you're going to click through to an advertiser and want to make Nate look good, spend a few clicks navigating around their site: This lowers the "bounce rate" (people who enter the site and leave without clicking an internal link) and makes the clicks seem to be of higher quality.
And I'm not saying this for the sake of being manipulative: You'd be surprised what interesting stuff you might find in a few clicks, so think of it as a scavenger hunt. =)
Matt W said...
eric,
I am sorry but I have to really disagree. I am very pro-choice, but "rock-bottom" for our country may include a reversal of Roe, but IS NOT defined by a reversal of Roe. There are serious economic, and foreign policy (war) issues that should be considered much more central to our political system than abortion.
i don't disagree. i just haven't seen anything from my fellow Americans to give me faith that they would wake up. i'm like michelle obama. for the first time, i'm "really" proud of my country. You have to remember, even Clinton was vilified and incited the Gingrich Revolution. This country has been run by the Neo-Cons for 28 years. I just didn't anticipate what might wake them up. I mean for God's sake, they reelected W. Why exactly was I to have faith in them?
The Ohio judgement is simple to implement. It only requires a match to be made between the registration form and the state DMV license or social security number.
The Ohio sec'y of state said it would take 2 or 3 days to write the program. LOL.
Here's the MSNBC story - breaking news on Ohio registered voters:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27188603/
CINCINNATI - A federal appeals court has ordered Ohio's top elections official to set up a system by Friday to verify the eligibility of new voters.
The full 6th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Cincinnati on Tuesday upheld a lower court ruling that Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner must use other government records to check thousands of new voters for registration fraud.
A three-judge panel of the 6th Circuit had disagreed last week, but the full court's ruling overturns that decision.
Ohio Republicans sued Brunner, a Democrat.
Ohio GOP Chairman Bob Bennett called the ruling a victory for the integrity of the electoral process.
Brunner previously had said there was no way to implement the system with such speed.
IN going blue depends a lot on the trend adjustment. Since the recent polls suggest it is still red I am of the opinion that the trend adjustment is too strong for IN.
If you are there though, you can make it blue!
My first post...a newbie. Love this site and read it every day. Nate, these are actually very positive numbers for North Carolina. The most recent polls had shown us in a tie or just up by 1 point, so a 3-point lead is really good considering that I think McCain/Palin have moved here in the past 10 days. The ground troops are huge, so hopefully the Triangle area will carry the rest of the state. My dream is that Obama not only win, but he wins NC with with more than 50% of the white vote. Call me a crazy middle-aged white woman, but hey...everyone needs their dreams that other white folks will wake up from their 50s haze and get real.
fred said...
http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/AB/20081014/NEWS0106/310150008/
Republican judges APPROVE voter suppression in Ohio.
KEEP UP THE GROUND GAME!
Ken Blackwell is more satanic to me than Karl Rove. In my mind Blackwell is the biggest villain in politics and I'd like to see him rot in prison. I hate that guy. More than Tom Delay or Karl rove or Jeffrey Skilling. Blackwell is the worst of the worst!
"
Brunner previously had said there was no way to implement the system with such speed."
It's one line of SQL. Simply joining 3 sets of data. Pay me for 3 days of work and I'll have it done in about 10 minutes.
I'm not really worried about the Ohio voter issue. I've been working with the Board of Elections here and there are a TON of safeguards in place.
First--if a voter's registration has not be verified through driver's license, state id and/or soc. security no., their name appears in the poll book with blacked out signature lines stating "Must vote provisionally"
Second--if someone has already voted in person, again it says they must vote provisionally
Third--all poll books are updated election morning with all voters who requested absentee ballot or who voted at the board. Again, they all must vote provisionally.
The provisional ballots are sealed and separated from the other ballots which are counted immediately.
We had virtually NO voters who had not already been verified although we had a whole bunch who had already voted at the Board.
This is just an extremely desperate attempt to foul up the election.
By the way, the new scanning system worked VERY well. I expect OH results to be announced pretty early election night.
eric said...
"I mean for God's sake, they reelected W. Why exactly was I to have faith in them?"
I am encouraged this time too. I not only lost faith in americans in 2004, I practically lost faith in democracy. My faith for both is still tepid, but slowly returning. It still really bothers me though that many people think the election will be decided by what they call "low information voters". I mean WTF! I have to suffer the consequences of a bad decision made by somebody who didn't bother paying much attention! My faith in democracy is clearly still frayed.
The conventional wisdom will be that the selection of Gov. Palin ended McCain's chances in 2008. And that conventional wisdom will be right.
She has no political future in the United States of America.
Rays whomping on the Sox...
Kind of like Obama whomping on McCain.
As for Blackwell, he's gone from the Sec of State's office. Don't know where he is but I think it's in some mudhole with other evil swine that were also kicked to the curb in Ohio.
These new lawsuits are all because Blackwell's not around to do their bidding from Ohio's statehouse. . .
The truly staggering thing about this Obama surge is comparing it to 1980.
In 1980 the Reagan coalition of angry whites resentful over desegregation had been frustrated by Watergate from taking over in 1976.
That was a fundamental shift of power, similar to the Roosevelt's 1932 victory. (See Electoral Map Typology, a brilliant article by Paul Rosenberg: http://www.openleft.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=7423
But, this election doesn't represent such a natural turning point in election demographics. True, minorities are rising as a percentage of voters, and the Black/Hispanic/Asian/Other/single women/ urban/ non-church-goers coalition will eventually dominate America.
But, it hasn't happened yet. This needn't have been a hopeless election for Republicans except:
1. Bush was the worst president since Hoover, perhaps even worse than Hoover.
2. Bush's plan to dump the economic collapse on the next President backfired and exploded on his watch, destroying the Republican brand.
3. Obama ran a magnificently disciplined campaign all year.
For example, it now appears that part of his lag during the summer was due to the fact that the campaign wasn't emphasizing voter contacts in July/August. Rather, they were asking their community team leaders to organize their volunteer teams. They'd call up and ask every one of the thousands of community team leaders, "how many volunteers have you organized?" Not how many voter contacts have you made.
Amazing article on Obama's organizing efforts: The New Organizers, Part 1: What's really behind Obama's ground game
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/zack-exley/the-new-organizers-part-1_b_132782.html
just a thought, the myth of the Bradley effect may actually guarantee the tightening in the polls the model accounts for never happens, out of concern of the possibility, Obama seems to be taking no prisoners, as well he should. Most campaigns, it seems to me, seem to relax at the sign they are winning. That won't happen here.
Here's another apparent glitch:
McCain has an 8 out of 10,000 chance of a landslide himself, which would leave Obama with 163 or fewer EVs. But the distribution chart is flatlined until well past 200.....
Eric said...
"Ken Blackwell is more satanic to me than Karl Rove. In my mind Blackwell is the biggest villain in politics and I'd like to see him rot in prison. I hate that guy. More than Tom Delay or Karl rove or Jeffrey Skilling. Blackwell is the worst of the worst!"
Eric,
Did you forget about Ms. Harris from FL???
Palin could only be a 2012 nominee ( presuming an Obama victory ) if the radical wing of the Rep party survives intact, and if she retains her governorship.
When was the last time an unemployed politician gained a nomination? Usually a politician still holds office when nominated.
No one will remember Romney or Huckabee in 4 years.
Some voters may have moved to Obama because of the economy but I think there are many who are staying there because of the smear campaign against him, mainly led by Palin, that has incited hateful speech at McCain and Palin rallies.
And it doesn't help that conservatives are coming out and expressing negative views about the campaign, basically endorsing Obama's criticism that McCain has become erratic.
Regarding Ohio, here's my understanding:
#1 666,000 newly registered voters, heavily Democrat, more than 2:1
#2 Bush beat Kerry in '04 by 119,000
#3 McCain cannot win without Ohio
Bottomline: The Republicans have to fraudulently disruptthe Ohio voting process by any means they can because if they don't they know nothing else matters. They'll lose. Of every post I've ever written, I'd hope this one resonates with some MSM or Dems out there that decide to try to make this known and do something about it if at all possible. Please understand that although McCain and seemingly his whole campaign from top to bottom seem dim-witted. I mean everyone from Steve Schmidt to Tucker Bounds to Sarah Palin. There are some smart folks that work for the Pubs and figured this out. Bush won/stole? Ohio in 2004, they're not dumb. They know they've got to do it again, only this time it's much more difficult for a variety of reasons. #1 Obama's better than Kerry #2 the Secretary of State is a Dem.
They're still going to do everything they can to steal Ohio, since they know they have to.
More Right-Wing Hate
http://crooksandliars.com/john-amato/rush-limbaugh-says-blacks-are-angry-and
http://crooksandliars.com/logan-murphy/nearing-bottom-barrel-red-state-runni
"
No one will remember Romney or Huckabee in 4 years."
I wonder where Romney will get the money to remind them.
*****Paul said...
McCain's best chance at hurting Obama would be to endorse him*****
I think that is my favorite line ever on this site........today...in this thread...so far....hilarious.
The Daily Show - Troopergate
http://crooksandliars.com/silentpatriot/jon-stewart-calls-out-palins-trooper
Matt W said...
Eric said...
"Ken Blackwell is more satanic to me than Karl Rove. In my mind Blackwell is the biggest villain in politics and I'd like to see him rot in prison. I hate that guy. More than Tom Delay or Karl rove or Jeffrey Skilling. Blackwell is the worst of the worst!"
Eric,
Did you forget about Ms. Harris from FL???
Here's my perception:
Blackwell was far worse than Harris. Harris was a pawn that liked be used. Blackwell was devious and wallowed in his devious tactics for years after. He loves the fact that he believes he was the catalyst to steal the elction for Bush. When people call him on he laughs in their face. I've never seen a famous person that was not a felon that I liked less.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFC9jv9jfoA
Why Obama is winning.
Well, Karl Rove may be evil incarnate....
But I would point out that on his website he now has Obama winning with well over 300 EVs-a jump of 26 from just five days ago.
When even Rove can't spin it into a "tight race" for McCain.....
Political "REALLY hoping this time the dems. can prove me wrong" Cynic
Eric is absolutely right. The dirty tricks have already started judging by the voter purges. We need to continue working, continue pushing Obama's lead higher.
My faith that America is a democracy won't be restored until AFTER Obama is elected.
E(lose OH+FL) is a subset of E(lose OH). By pigeonhole principle, at least one of those 9 victories would *have* to be without FL, since only at most 8 can be with FL. So those numbers can't be right. Please tell me that's a copy-and-paste error or something, because otherwise your simulation has a bug in it.
In 8022 simulations out of 10000, McCain loses OH. Of those, in 9cases (0.11% of the 8022 times he lost OH), he still won the election.
In 8014 simulations out of 10000, McCain loses both OH and FL (obviously these are a subset of the 8022 where he loses OH). Of those, in 0 cases (0.00% of the time she lost both OH and FL), he still won the election.
8022-8014 = 9, so there were 9 cases where McCain lost OH but won FL, and 9 - 0 = 9, so clearly in the 9 simulations where McCain lost OH but won FL, he also won the election every time. This kind of makes sense: McCain has 20% chance to win OH but only a 13% chance to win FL, so losing OH but winning FL indicates something odd is going on in one or bpth of the sates -- it's not going to happen unless one of the other of them is bucking an overall trend.
So, this indicates a can't-lose McCain Hail-Mary strategy: insult Ohioans, then the spend rest of the election campaigning in Florida, convert to Judaism (owch!), and give up pn the offshore drilling idea. :)
My bet for a Republican 2012 candidate would be that the remaining core of the party - minus the lunatic fringe - will nominate a new minority leader in the senate or house, rather than a Rep governor, and that person would be the favored candidate. The current Rep leaders will be tossed.
Wow, >80% on intrade.
Yeah, I heard from a school teacher in Dallas whose donation was matched by mine. Very cool.
I refuse to allow myself one tiny peek at those Win Percentage numbers. lalalalala I can't hear you lalalalala
I remember all of the Democrats putting their hope in Zogby in 2000 or 2004 when all the other pollsters showed Bush ahead. Now the Republicans are praising Zogby showing a close election.
It seems that Zogby is the poll to follow when you are supporting a lost cause.
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