10.24.2008

How The West Wasn't Won

In an article at The New Republic, I explore why John McCain has been so vulnerable in his home region, the Interior West.

Why is McCain performing so poorly in his own backyard? In part, he is fighting a Sisyphean battle against the demographic changes in the region. The Census Bureau measures how many people migrate into each state each year. In 2006, half of the top ten fastest-growing states were in the West, ranging from Nevada (3.5 percent) to Colorado (1.9 percent). These new residents generally fall into one of two categories: college-educated white folks from the coasts looking for cheaper housing, better schools, or a higher quality of life--or, Latinos. Both groups are quite friendly to Democrats.

Still, McCain's politics may also be partly to blame. For one thing, McCain is perceived largely as an insider--the Senator from Washington (D.C.) rather than the Senator from Arizona. The West--particularly the Mountain West--does not like Washington establishment candidates. Consider, for instance, that Bill Clinton--running as an outsider in 1992--won Montana, and came within single digits of George Bush in states like Wyoming and Alaska. By 1996, however, when his incumbency had transformed him into an insider by default, Clinton lost Montana, and was crushed in Wyoming and Alaska by 13 and 18 points, respectively.

382 comments

Wayward Son said...

I would also think they dislike negative campaigning more than other areas.

Strangeite said...

Excellent Work, as always.

Joshua said...

I think it's more McCain not being McCain. Who knows what you are going to get?

shadowguidex said...

I think Obama will have a startlingly decent result in Arizona also. My friend down there has hinted that McCain isn't the hot shit he thinks he is down there.

Josh said...

With Opie Andy, & The Fonz on Obama's side I'm feeling pretty confident.

Charles Crook said...

The mugger victim in PA is now saying she was sexually assaulted as well.

Daver said...

It's the perfect storm for Obama.
That wall of blue will engulf the GOP. PS - As a former Hoosier, I am thrilled with the chance IN is going Dem.

shadowguidex said...

What kind of loser beats herself up and scratches a backwards B on her own face?

arnieh said...

Well, I'm sure Joe the Plumber is holding Idaho for him. ;>)

shadowguidex said...

"The mugger victim in PA is now saying she was sexually assaulted as well."

I smell a fibber. I have a well developed Bullshit detector, and it's sounding loud and clear right now.

BZ said...

Clinton's win in MT, and relative success in WY and AK, in 1992 is more attributable to Perot's stronger showing in 1992 than to differences in perception of Clinton. Clinton actually got a higher percentage of the vote in each of those three states in 1996 than in 1992, but lost by more because Perot was siphoning off fewer votes from the Republicans.

Tom said...

Over at RCP they're including Strategic Vision polls now at the state level. They're even putting an (R) next to them. So why can't they use R2K's daily tracker for Kos if they're gonna use other partisan polls?

Adam said...

Could the results of those races in 1992 not have been caused by Ross Perot attracting anti-establishment voters in those states??

Matthew said...

Perot had a huge amount to do with Clinton winning Montana and getting close elsewhere in the west. He got upwards of 20% of the popular vote in all the states west of Minnesota with the exceptions of New Mexico and Hawaii. The west may like their political outsiders, true, but Perot was even more of one than Clinton.

Linus said...

I don't think people in this part of the world are any less susceptible to negative campaigning to anybody else -- why would we be? I think a large part of it, aside from the demographic shifts that are taking place all over the West, is that the Republican Party is rapidly losing its libertarian streak, instead becoming a party of low taxes, big government, and social interventionism. Other than low taxes, none of that plays well outside California.

In short, the West wasn't won. It was given away.

Andrew said...

Election Night Shock: Obama takes AZ

Alyssa said...

Charles Crook said...
"The mugger victim in PA is now saying she was sexually assaulted as well."


She's such an asshole. Man when people suck they go all out on suckittude

Tom said...

Georgia!!! (Insider Advantage)
O 48
M 47

tek said...

Nah we will take Az next time

Alyssa said...

tom said...
Georgia!!! (Insider Advantage)
O 48
M 47


That's so last thread ago. /snark

OTF said...

Obama is taking NV, CO, NM and if McCain wasn't from AZ theat would be in play for the Dems this year too. Demographics are moving against the GOP not only in the Southwest but also in the southeast in NC and VA.

Darío said...

Anti-establishment vote?.
What´s that?.
Ron Paul maybe is anti-establishment?

Congratulations to President-Elect McCain!!! said...

Maverick losing the West is GREAT NEWS!!! For John McCain!!!

newsinOH said...

"The mugger victim in PA is now saying she was sexually assaulted as well."

When I first read the skepticism here about this chick, I thought "oh no, they're bordering on the attack the right over everything line." Then I saw the pic . . .

Yes, the B is very questionable but I was more in doubt of the "black eye" I've been around enough black eyes in my life to know that NONE of them has even remotely resembled hers--in any way. I want an updated pic. I want to see what color it's turned today.

I'm now in the camp who believes it's very likely that this is one sick chick who needs some serious help immediately.

Hey, my word is pines--it's a real word!!

MysticLaker said...

I just sexually assulated myself as well.

shadowguidex said...

"Nah we will take Az next time"

Don't be so certain. That last time there was ANY poll in Arizona it was 9/27, and McCain only lead by 7. Check out Nate's righthand column.

Mitchell said...

Nevada update: this morning's paper reports that, in Clark (Las Vegas - 75% of the state's population) and Washoe (Reno - 15% of the state's population) counties, approximately *twice* as many Democrats as Republicans have voted in early voting, which started last Saturday.

The other fifteen counties are pretty sparsely populated, but Elko has been visited three times so far by Obama, who will be back here in Las Vegas on Saturday.

There is also a report in today's paper of Republican robocalls in Spanish, urging the recipient to "vote by phone," in an apparent effort to keep voters away from the real polling places.

Tom said...

I'm a little disappointed at the people jumping to conclusions about the assaulted woman. That shows a nasty streak, let's keep progessives associated with positive values and trust.

Voice of the Midwest said...

The most telling indicator in GA over the next week and a half is if McCain posts under 50 in two straight polls toward the end. Obama doesn't have to be winning, just solidly performing in an upward manner at 46 to 47%.

Obama doesn't have to be winning in the polls as long as he is in the margin of error and has momentum on his side.

This is where high GOTV in GA may make the difference.

I am wondering more and more about South Carolina lately...

Eric said...

I have a challenging question that I don't know the answer to. I wonder if any political gurus out there can come up with the answer? Who is the last President to have never lost an election?


Here's my list so far:

Obama lost his first Congressional race to Bobby Rush (2000)

McCain lost Presidential primary run (2000)

Bush Jr. lost his first Congressional race 1980s

Clinton lost a Governor's race 1980s

GHW Bush lost to Clinton in 1992

Reagan lost Presidential primary run in 1976

Carter lost to Reagan in 1980

Ford lost to Carter in 1976

Nixon lost to Kennedy in 1960


I assume Eisenhower never ran for anything before he won the Presidency in 1952, so the answer is Eisenhower?

Christopher said...

If she was lying about the whole ordeal, I think she may deserve some jail time. Sad stuff.

Charles Crook said...

Hanging chads in Georgia:

http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/metro/gwinnett/stories/2008/10/23/absentee_ballot_flaw.html?cxntlid=homepage_tab_newstab


"The elections office will now have to transfer the votes from those 10,000 ballots onto new ballots so an optical scanning machine can read them..."

rikie1 said...

The Pittsburg 'victim': look in a mirror and scratch a 'B' on your face . . . of gosh, you get a backwards B. Smells like another McCain be very very scared ad.

cane said...

Heather Nordquist said...
"@realjoe

The Spanish settled the Southwest before your family hit Ellis Island. Wait, maybe that makes me more American than you?

Come mierda!"

Heather, Real Joe can be come mierda occasionally, but he is arguably the most thoughtful republican in this board. True, he is hyperbolic and ironic (and very funny), but that plays both ways. Now, when it comes to immigration, he has some cognitive blindness. He still has to answer what is his solution for the problem (in particular if he wants a healthy economy). He should go and watch "A day without a Mexican".
And Joe, you have to understand that being exposed to unfair "discussion" and racist attitudes on this issue, our balls typically
"EXPLODE"
with comments like yours.

shadowguidex said...

Remember the shock when Gore lost his home state of Tennessee, which was rarely polled because it was supposedly his home turf. He lost it. McCain could easily lose Arizona in this political climate.

MysticLaker said...

@tom...

I feel bad for her. I really do. She needs help, but it's not for being assulated. Even foxnews calls it a "bizzere" story.

Alyssa said...

Is that GA lookin oh-so-slightly less red I see?

Eastern Seaboard!

Screw SC

Frank said...

It is time for the Whig party to be reincarnated. The evangelicals running the Republican party cannot bring themselves to truly include the social moderates that are fiscal conservatives or true libertarian-style conservatives (or to include them in the discussions of party platform.)

They are racing with a horse that is becoming smaller and smaller. Demographic changes are going to force this to change at some point.

Eric said...

Look at early vote tallies in Nevada. If those numbers continue, that's our tipping point right there. My definition of a t ipping point for now is the first state we can call that will get either candidate to 269 (Obama) or 270 (McCain). Nevada gets Obama to 269. The numbers are heavily in his favor in early voting there. 2004, Bush Jr. won by 20,000 votes and I think he won early voting. 50,000+ net gain for Dem registration since 2004 and early voting is an onslaught so far in clark and washoe.

Charles Crook said...

"Who is the last President to have never lost an election?"

Eisenhower?

RWD said...

"I'm a little disappointed at the people jumping to conclusions about the assaulted woman."

Even Bill O'Reilly was skeptical of the story last night. No one should jump to the conclusion that the story is true, either.

Voice of the Midwest said...

"I'm a little disappointed at the people jumping to conclusions about the assaulted woman." (Tom)

I concur.

Let the police and this young lady flesh out the situation before jumping to conclusions.

Alyssa said...

tom said...
"I'm a little disappointed at the people jumping to conclusions about the assaulted woman. That shows a nasty streak, let's keep progessives associated with positive values and trust."

No it doesn't. It shows she's an awful liar.
Go and read or re-read the story and look closely at her picture. If you can't tell it's bullshit then I don't know what to tell you.

shadowguidex said...

"Who is the last President to have never lost an election?"

Lyndon Johnson never lost.

mc9cain said...

Some of you guys seem confused as to where RCP gets their average. The home page is NOT what they are using to get the average. Polls listed there are all polls that they consider non-partisan.

Below is the link which shows the greyed in ones that are used for the national average. For the State RCP averages you have to click on the state on the left side and then look at the greyed in polls to see which they are considering for state averages.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/us/general_election_mccain_vs_obama-225.html

Voice of the Midwest said...

I think the Pittsburgh Police may know the answer and are giving the young lady time to consider her story.

My biggest question is this: considering the issues, why is a young woman ardently supporting John McCain?

In this day, considering the GOP, you have to do some mighty ideological jujitsu to be a woman or minority that supports the Republican Party.

Just thinking out loud...

LAT said...

sorry I do not want to pile on Real Joe because he is the one republican who is not a troll and he does have very good links. But he has been very insulting on the issue of immigration quite a few times. So I do not feel the need to give him a free pass on this.

Sean said...

Did LBJ ever lose?

Moonbeam said...

newsinOH said...
"Yes, the B is very questionable but I was more in doubt of the "black eye" I've been around enough black eyes in my life to know that NONE of them has even remotely resembled hers--in any way. I want an updated pic. I want to see what color it's turned today."

Yep, that chick's "black eye" is really pathetic. I think I actually might have that same "smokey grey" eye shadow shade...

Alyssa said...

"Let the police and this young lady flesh out the situation before jumping to conclusions."


This is the problem. She wouldn't let them.

Seretse said...

Most sensible folk didn't jump to conclusions. They looked at the reporting and assessed that it was bullshit.

Refused medical treatment, carefully inscribed inverted B on the right side of her face, black eye without swelling or bloodshot eyes et. cetera.

I should have "jumped to a conclusion" on her BS but I gave her the benefit of the doubt.

RWD said...

"My biggest question is this: considering the issues, why is a young woman ardently supporting John McCain?"

She's from Texas, isn't she? She's probably pretty conservative, and a Palin fan.

Kiera said...

Dwight David Eisenhower lost the election for class presidency of the sixth grade at Lakota school, Abeline, KS in 1901. The election's game changing moment came when his oppponent, J. Critchfield Muggelsworth, launched a vicious smear campaign accusing Ike of "palling around with kids who drink chocolate milk".

pafl said...

Johnson lost his first run for the U.S. Senate.

brentdragoo said...

Yep, LBJ lost a senate race in...1940? Read Robert A. Caro's biographies of LBJ if you haven't. I couldn't recommend them any higher.

Kid G said...

Blogger Voice of the Midwest said...

"I'm a little disappointed at the people jumping to conclusions about the assaulted woman." (Tom)

I concur.

Let the police and this young lady flesh out the situation before jumping to conclusions.


I'm just confused if the black eye isn't a black eye, why the police wouldn't have just wiped the makeup off and revealed her pretty undamaged face.

One thing that hasn't been said yet: the McCain campaign once again took a very impulsive approach to this attack, assuming the woman was telling the truth 100%, while any reasonable person would immediately be suspicious of her veracity. This is SOOO similar to the response to the financial crisis, and scares me further about what a (im)possible McCain administration would do in response to an international crisis, real or fake.

Seretse said...

Perhaps the 200 Lb 6'4 Black gentleman had lent himself to political expression via Cyrillic cursive and license hence the artful inverted B.

albionmoonlight said...

I wonder if any of Obama's snowballing momentum comes from people who really don't want another close election. I, for one, am tired of going to bed on election night waiting for the lawyers to weigh in on who will win.

shadowguidex said...

Arizona has a ton of Retirees and Latinos. The retirees, mark my words, are heavily concerned about the economy. There is a definite chance for a shocking Obama upset there. No polls since 9/27 which was only a McCain 7 point lead. Oh yeah, it could easily happen.

Bryan said...

Could McCain's support of the immigration bill be hurting him in the West?

Eric said...

shadowguidex said...
"Who is the last President to have never lost an election?"

Lyndon Johnson never lost.

Yeah I skipped right over LBJ huh. I've been to his library in Austin a couple times too. Go to a Preisdential library if you get a chance. They're really cool. Yeah he lost a Senate run in 1940. Did he run for the Dem nom in '60 or was he just plucked straight from the Senate? I can't remember

hurn0003 said...

In my criminal law class at law school, my professor, Allen Dershowitz, claimed that rape was both the most under-reported and over-reported crime in the US. He argued that there were more instances where rapes occurred and were never reported and cases where it never occurred and was falsely reported than any other crime.

I would tend to concur with him, and would suggest that we keep our noses out of it until a jury or the police have decided on the merits of the case. Those that commit such crimes should be severely punished, but an accusation shouldn't be enough to smear a person's name. And those that falsely report it should receive mental help or punishment, depending on the case. But you shouldn't criticize the accuser w/out all the facts, as this discourages victims from coming forward.

To sum it up, keep your big fat noses out of it (that is directed at both the press and observers).

shadowguidex said...

Did JFK lose? He was more recent than Eisenhower also.

Voice of the Midwest said...

"Some of you guys seem confused as to where RCP gets their average. The home page is NOT what they are using to get the average. Polls listed there are all polls that they consider non-partisan."

That is RCPs declaration. What is at question is when certain poll suddenly disappears. One day a certain source is sacred, the next day the same source is disregarded.

The inconsistency is questioned.

To Nate's credit, the only thing he questions is methodology. If a bleeding thumb outlier exists, it is worthy in questioning the credibility of the polling source.

RCP has a need to keep the horse race alive because they are in this gig for money, ad money. Nate is in it for the science and the ability to see Mika Brzenzski in the flesh.

Eric said...

You know you have a problem when an Eisenhower, Buckley, Reagan, and Goldwater all endorse the Deomocrat.

Voice of the Midwest said...

"Did JFK lose? He was more recent than Eisenhower also."

1956 to Estes Kefauver of Tennessee on the convention floor. It taught him that he needed get a better understanding of the southern elements of his party. Thus, we had LBJ on the ticket in 1960.

newsinOH said...

"I should have "jumped to a conclusion" on her BS but I gave her the benefit of the doubt."

As did I. I merely want to see how her "wounds" are progressing over time. Show me a pic with some discoloration migrating down her cheek (since it turned so dark so fast, this shouldn't be a problem to demonstrate) and I will continue to reassess.

However, looking at screen shots of her twitter page and how she commented on the events and now her supposed amplification of the story . . . it's just not passing the smell test. We can't be asked to check our minds at the door.

Eric said...

Eisenhower
Buckley
Reagan
Goldwater

endorse Obama!


This would be equivalent to:

Kennedy
Clinton
Cuomo
Carter

We all endorse the Pub!

eve said...

Did JFK ever lose an election? I don't think he did.

tek said...

Shadow we have to leave something to McCain. We will leave him AZ, but we are taking Alaska. It is part of our Strategery

Hal Adams said...

I also wondered about the mugging victim in PA. If I was a fucked-up Obama supporter doing this for allegedly political reasons, and I decided to inscribe BHO's initial on my victim, I think it would be easier (and faster) to scratch "O" than "B". The picture really showed that whoever put the backwards "B" on that woman's cheek spent a lot of time and care doing it.

Has a CSI team examined her?

newsinOH said...

I had to post again just because my word is "elect" as in elect Barack Obama!!

Real Joe said...

any new polls ?

dwbh said...

@Frank:

It is time for the Whig party to be reincarnated.

Awesome.

eve said...

Oops. I should have read ALL the comments before asking about JFK.

Matt said...

Economist/YouGov national...

O: 49
M: 41

Eric said...

Voice of the Midwest said...
"Did JFK lose? He was more recent than Eisenhower also."

1956 to Estes Kefauver of Tennessee on the convention floor. It taught him that he needed get a better understanding of the southern elements of his party. Thus, we had LBJ on the ticket in 1960.


Yeah, if he fought harder for it on the convention floor he might have been able to take it. The vote was very, very close. 1956, better to fight another day, since Ike was going to win regardless.

Seretse said...

Well by virtue of the fact that they've chosen to give an assault victim a polygraph test less than two days after the event suggests that we're not out of place in suspecting BS.

It offends me that she had to create the image of her attacker as a "Black male, 200 lbs, 6'4 in dark jeans and a dark tanktop."

As a fairly large black male myself, I can tell you that most of us hate the fucking cold. And that we wouldn't be wondering around the streets of Pittsburgh wearing a tanktop when it's 50 degrees out.

Real Joe said...

bryan said...
Could McCain's support of the immigration bill be hurting him in the West?


Obama supported the same bill

Voice of the Midwest said...

"Lyndon Johnson never lost."

Lyndon Johnson lost a Senate race in 1940 by a few votes that just happened to come in the next Wednesday.

He won the race for Senate 4 or 6 years later by finding votes in Galveston in a precinct that didn't exist on a map.

Thus the nickname Landslide Lyndon.

Simeon said...

LBJ lost his first senate race, and he also lost the nomination in 1960 when he formed a coalition with Humphrey and Adlai Stevenson to try to stop JFK.

JFK finished second in 1956 in the convention voting for VP... not sure if that counts as a loss, since he wasn't really running - Stevenson had not chosen a running mate and just left it open for the convention to decide.

newsinOH said...

On the lack of coherence in the GOP at the moment, Hoover's great granddaughter was on TV this AM blaming FDR for the mess we're in today . . . just plain weird.

Matt said...

Democracy Corps/GQR national

O: 52
M: 43

Eric said...

It's almost like Obama ran against impossible odds vs Bobby Rush to get a loss under his belt in 2000. He's got brilliant instincts and his hero is Abraham Lincoln who lost a bunch. Might have thought, if I've got to taste defeat to move forward, let's just get it out of the way.

InkStain said...

We've seen this story way too many times to be fooled.

The first, clear hint was when she refused medical treatment.

The second was the clean, shallow cuts on the B.

Now the police imply that the ATM video doesn't match her story.


These sorts of hoaxes aren't uncommon (though tying them to politics is a new twist), and the results are always the same.

I don't mind being amused by the fact that the woman's twitter account implied she might be a pre-law student. Good luck being admitted to the bar with this on your record...

Kid G said...

@seretse:

Your comment reminded me of reading Encyclopedia Brown. Thanks for bringing back those memories!

Eric said...

newsinOH said...
On the lack of coherence in the GOP at the moment, Hoover's great granddaughter was on TV this AM blaming FDR for the mess we're in today . . . just plain weird.

Hoover's great granddaughter's opinion is less relevant than yours or mine. next.

Nam Vet Joe From Jersey said...

LMAO Seretse

hurn0003 said...

Seriously, this discussion of the victim needs to stop. It shouldn't get so much attention from either the press or from people in this forum.

IT IS NOT A POLITICAL STORY. Whether some psycho does or does not exist or some girl is telling the truth does not reflect on either candidates or the vast majority of their supporters.

SO SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT IT.

Voice of the Midwest said...

"Stevenson had not chosen a running mate and just left it open for the convention to decide."

This is EXACTLY what I thought McCain should have done. It would have been truly maverick and I believe it would have ironed out any suspicions the anti-McCain folks within the GOP would have had about the ticket.

It would have drawn viewers and peaked the interest of the media more than choosing a complete moron who couldn't find her ass with a flashlight and a map in a room full of mirrors.

crwtrobot said...

Mitchell said...
Nevada update: this morning's paper reports that, in Clark (Las Vegas - 75% of the state's population) and Washoe (Reno - 15% of the state's population) counties, approximately *twice* as many Democrats as Republicans have voted in early voting, which started last Saturday.

The other fifteen counties are pretty sparsely populated, but Elko has been visited three times so far by Obama, who will be back here in Las Vegas on Saturday.

There is also a report in today's paper of Republican robocalls in Spanish, urging the recipient to "vote by phone," in an apparent effort to keep voters away from the real polling places.


I live in Vegas an the majority of my extended family lives in Reno.

The early voting has been crazy-go-nuts busy.

And the ground game from the Obama camp in both areas has been something to behold.

I think 4 different volunteers came to my house on the day early voting started.

Which was good news.

For John McCain. Obviously.

pafl said...

so, Eisenhower it is?

newsinOH said...

@seretse

"As a fairly large black male myself, I can tell you that most of us hate the fucking cold. And that we wouldn't be wondering around the streets of Pittsburgh wearing a tanktop when it's 50 degrees out."

LMAO--I hadn't even noticed the tank top remark.

BTW, she's from College Station, TX, not exactly the cutting edge of diverse communities

Charles Crook said...

"so, Eisenhower it is?"

Well, he was 2 for 2.

InkStain said...

"Seriously, this discussion of the victim needs to stop. It shouldn't get so much attention from either the press or from people in this forum. "

Your opinion of what we should and should not be interested in is duly noted.

hurn0003 said...

InkStain said...

"Your opinion of what we should and should not be interested in is duly noted."

This is a political forum. This is not a political topic.

Voice of the Midwest said...

Losing and learning is a valuable tool for candidates who want to be on the national stage. It teaches them strategy for future campaigns and actually can improve how they govern.

Except if you are a paranoid nut like Dick Nixon.

BeanoCook said...

Nate, your understanding of the US is rather limited. Perot is the only reason Clinton seemed to do well in the west. Also, college educated people tend to vote Republican. It is grad degree holding and people with less than HS educations that skew Dem.

McCain is not doing well in the West because he is a liberal. And nowhere near representative of the western ideal of indivudial liberty.

InkStain said...

Internet sleuthing is fun.

Here is a a link to a facebook group supporting the candidacy for a student government position of an Ashley Todd in College Station, Texas.

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?sid=27b5211d69c9ef5eced12c31cedbc1ef&refurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2Fs.php%3Fq%3Dashley%2Btodd%2Bcollege%2Bstation%2Btexas%26n%3D-1%26k%3D400000000010%26sf%3Dr%26init%3Dq%26sid%3D27b5211d69c9ef5eced12c31cedbc1ef&gid=2260910734

You will note the following:

""TOUGH GUY"
Tough Guy shirts are gray tank tops with "Ashley for president" on front and "or else" on back. 17 right now, if i get enough feedback more can be done. Tip/paycheck willing."

Tank tops, a recurring theme in her life. Someone has a fetish?

shadowguidex said...

"As a fairly large black male myself, I can tell you that most of us hate the fucking cold. And that we wouldn't be wondering around the streets of Pittsburgh wearing a tanktop when it's 50 degrees out."


hahahah. Too perfect. The black woman I work with in the office is always complaining about it being too cold in the building and shes wearing sweaters and shit, meanwhile I'm sweating and wearing shorts and a T-shirt. AA aren't wired for the cold, no doubt about it. Although, I gotta say as a Wisconsin resident, the Green Bay players seem to do well in it.

marco said...

I live in AZ and am still waiting for a NEW poll...we haven't had a poll from any reputable source in almost a month! Being a strong O supporter I can tell that Phoenix, Tucson and most likely Flagstaff (which is home to Northern Arizona University) are Obama strongholds here. Of course Phoenix still has its conservative base (McCain's rich friends in Scottsdale and Paradise Valley), but the state has been trending Democrat for a while. Despite the 2 Republican Senators we have a liberal female governor (Napolitano) and half of the 8 House seats, and 2 of the 4 Rep seats are clearly in play. I know it's hard to expect an Obama win here, but with the current trends and a high percentage of independent voters I wouldn't be surprised if the state turns light blue at the end.

newsinOH said...

Now THIS should play well as an ad:

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/10/24/1589028.aspx

Eric said...

Voice of the Midwest said...
"Stevenson had not chosen a running mate and just left it open for the convention to decide."

This is EXACTLY what I thought McCain should have done. It would have been truly maverick and I believe it would have ironed out any suspicions the anti-McCain folks within the GOP would have had about the ticket.

It would have drawn viewers and peaked the interest of the media more than choosing a complete moron who couldn't find her ass with a flashlight and a map in a room full of mirrors.


Yep, I think Romney, Ridge or a qualified woman would have given him a real shot. Of course I can't think of a pro-life woman that would have made a good candidate for VP off the top of my head. They're all pro-choice that I can think of. Olympia Snowe maybe? The GOP demanding the candidate be pro-life makes it realy challenging.

Dr. Matt said...

A VP at Faux is claiming the entire election is hinging on the fabricated "crime" in Pittsburgh:

http://foxforum.blogs.foxnews.com/2008/10/23/jmoody_1023/

pafl said...

For the record, FDR's only loss was as the Democratic VP in 1920

Kid G said...

hurn0003:

Well, I think it's a little political because it plays into McCain's supporters' current narrative of painting Obama as an arab, muslim terrorist with shady ties who would want to foster attacks on innocent white Christians. Also, the fact that it just happened to take place in McCain's last best hope of western PA. Maybe I am naive, but if this attack was real, I would expect a backlash from certain fence sitters who are looking for an excuse to vote against Obama.

hermance said...

I agree with tom and voice of the midwest: let's cut it out with claiming we know what is true with the woman who says she's been attacked. Nothing new has been added to this conversation, and since none of us were there, people are just reporting the same conjectures and hypotheses.

I also can't believe that someone on here used Bill O'Reilly as their defense. Sure, if Bill O'Reilly thinks it, it must be true. Huh?

If it is so evident to you that the woman lied, then let's assume it also will be to the police who are investigating. If it isn't, then perhaps then we can get upset. Until then, let's move on to more intelligent and interesting stuff. If you just want to say bad stuff about her, I'm sure there's plenty of space over at DailyKos or HuffPo to do just that.

The feminist in me says that rather than vilify her, we should let this situation play out on its own terms. If she has misled people, then she is very troubled, and that's nothing to revel in.

InkStain said...

Oops, that link doesn't work, my bad.

Simply to go facebook and search "Ashley Todd College Station" and the group will come up.

James said...

I think we should leave the Pittsburg girl alone. We don't know what happened (or didn't) but the police will probably get to the bottom of it.

If she wasn't attacked then she is more than a bit odd and needs to get some help. If she was then she's had a nasty ordeal and shouldn't have her name dragged through the mud.

But none of it has anything to do with the election. Even if there was a mugger and he was an Obama supporter, what are we meant to conclude? Surely Obama supporters aren't so naive that they believe all Obama supporters are universally nice people? Villains get to vote too (if they're not in jail) - some of them will back McCain, some Obama and maybe some even Nader. So what? You might expect candidates to vet their staff sufficiently, but they can never run checks on their voters...

samule said...

as an nswer to a question in the last post's comment section:

kellysirkus said...

any chance of a Goldwater Bounce in AZ.?

Don't think so, Goldwater jr. (the son) already replied to the niece/granddaughter/whatever refuting her endorsement in the name of the Goldwater family

Generally speaking I think people should stop worrying about all those bonus states. If everybody does their work to make sure the polls are right all the above mentioned states will just become blue automatically! We need to make 101 % sure Obama wins, all the rest is freakin' bonus

PA John said...

"This is a political forum. This is not a political topic."

It's somewhat relevant; mainly because part of the discussions on this site have been about calling out Drudge on creating bogus news and blatant race bating - and the story of the incident is mostly his creation.

But... it's not all that worthy of in depth discussion.

hurn0003 said...

Charles Crook said...

""so, Eisenhower it is?"

Well, he was 2 for 2."


You have all forgotten about the race he lost 1896, the infamous 2nd grade milk monitor race at Abilene Elementary School.

Dr. Matt said...

James said...
I think we should leave the Pittsburg girl alone. We don't know what happened (or didn't) but the police will probably get to the bottom of it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I agree except the reich-wing GOPigs are already linking this "crime" to the left, democrats, liberals and President-elect Obama.

H*ll, a VP at Faux.com is claiming the entire election is hinging on the fabricated "crime" in Pittsburgh.

http://foxforum.blogs.foxnews.com/2008/10/23/jmoody_1023/

Eric said...

Charles Crook said...
"so, Eisenhower it is?"

Well, he was 2 for 2.

Yes. Of course, it doesn't hurt to be the War Hero of the Greatest Generation and get into politics real late in life when the country is ripe for a change from the party they're tired of and your party's bench is empty. I don't know enough about the Presidents early careers before Ike to know how much further we have to go back for the next one. Did Truman or FDR ever lose?

phil said...

IIRC, Clinton's performance in the interior west was flat between 1992 and 1996. Perot's weaker 1996 performance made the difference.

Simeon said...

I'm so tired of this BS about Clinton only winning because of Perot. Exit polling done at the time showed that Perot voters were split almost exactly between Bush and Clinton as their second choice.

===

ASSOCIATED PRESS (11/4/92): Exit polls suggest Ross Perot hurt George Bush and Bill Clinton about equally.

The Voter Research and Surveys poll, a joint project of the four major television networks, found 38 percent of Perot voters would have voted for Clinton and 37 percent would have voted for Bush if Perot had not been on the ballot. Fifteen percent said they would not have voted, and 6 percent listed other candidates.

===

DIONNE (11/8/92): Ross Perot's presence on the 1992 presidential ballot did not change the outcome of the election, according to an analysis of the second choices of Perot supporters.

The analysis, based on exit polls conducted by Voter Research & Surveys (VRS) for the major news organizations, indicated that in Perot's absence, only Ohio would have have shifted from the Clinton column to the Bush column. This would still have left Clinton with a healthy 349-to-189 majority in the electoral college.

And even in Ohio, the hypothetical Bush "margin" without Perot in the race was so small that given the normal margin of error in polls, the state still might have stuck with Clinton absent the Texas billionaire.

RWD said...

"Despite the 2 Republican Senators we have a liberal female governor (Napolitano) and half of the 8 House seats"

That's true in KS too (well, except for the 8 house seats, KS only has 4), but no-one expects it to turn blue.

InkStain said...

"But... it's not all that worthy of in depth discussion."

It *is* political news because it was seized upon by the McCain campaign and its surrogates.

It's yet *another* datapoint of them flailing wildly, attaching themselves to anything that seems positive for them without doing the slightest scrap of research or vetting.

Real Joe said...



Obama Leads McCain by 11 in Battleground States

Barack Obama is leading John McCain 52 percent to 41 percent with 2 percent for Ralph Nader and 1 percent for Libertarian Bob Barr in a poll of 15 battleground states conducted Oct. 19-21 for National Public Radio. The margin of error is 3.2 points.

Obama leads by 12 points among independents.

"The race has broken open," said Democratic pollster Stan Greenberg who conducted the survey with Republican Glen Bolger. "Some big things have happened that have closed off the campaign that McCain could have run. He's lost independents, now losing them by 12 points. He was the one Republican this year who could have won Independents, and now he's losing them by double digits."

Link

Yvonne said...

politicalwire.com

Strategic Vision McCain up in Florida and Ohio

Winthrop/ETV: Obama only up 1 in Virginia and NC

?? How good are those polls?

jdk said...

To make any assertion based on Bill Clinton's races without considering the Perot effect doesn't make any sense too me.

Without Perot in the race, Clinton would have lost or it would have been something more like very close a la Gore and Kerry.

hurn0003 said...

Kid G:

I will leave it at this. It is an unworthy topic for either the press or this forum to dedicate any time to. Discussion of it brings down quality of this forum more than a troll could ever hope to. (See it has me ending sentences w/ prepositions, evidence of the decline).

Heather Nordquist said...

electionprojection has a landslide projection on its premium daily update it is:

Solid Dem: CA,CT,DC,DE,HI,IL,MD,MA,MI,NJ,NY,RI,VT,WA
Strong Dem:
WI,IA,ME,MN,OR,PA
Moderate Dem:
CO,NM,NH,OH,VA
Weak Dem:
FL,IN,MO,NV,NC

pafl said...

FDR lost as the Dem VP with James Cox of Ohio running for President in 1920.

RWD said...

"I also can't believe that someone on here used Bill O'Reilly as their defense. Sure, if Bill O'Reilly thinks it, it must be true. Huh?"

No, that's not what I said. What I said is, if someone on the extreme right, who has every reason to believe this story and hype it to support his own opinion, is suspicious, that means that it is very questionable. When even BO'R's nose can smell it as BS, the BS must be very strong.

Free-Nokia-Ringtones said...

For the record, LBJ's Senate victory occurred in 1948, featuring the infamous "Precinct 13" voting box. You could also argue that LBJ's losses in the 1968 primaries forced him out of the race.

I don't think you can glean much out of 1992 due to the third party factor.

Dr. Matt said...

InkStain said...
>>>"But... it's not all that worthy of in depth discussion."<<<

It *is* political news because it was seized upon by the McCain campaign and its surrogates.

It's yet *another* datapoint of them flailing wildly, attaching themselves to anything that seems positive for them without doing the slightest scrap of research or vetting.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Well stated, inkstain.

Ashley will be proven to be a complete hoax just like Joe the plumber. I'll gladly lay a few c-notes on a bet.

Yvonne said...

Obama's reserves are dwindling, so donate some more.
(nytimes.com)

Shawn said...

Rasmussen Noon Release

North Carolina
Obama - 48
McCain - 50

Tyson said...

From an AP-Politico article on Ohio

'“This is not good news for John McCain,” Towery said. “This county is just so representative of what’s going on in Ohio.”

hurn0003 said...

Yvonne said...

"politicalwire.com

Strategic Vision McCain up in Florida and Ohio

Winthrop/ETV: Obama only up 1 in Virginia and NC

?? How good are those polls?"


Strategic Vision does not post internals. On face they appear that they likely have GOP overrepresented as they are to the right of all other recent polls in the states in which they produced polls.


Winthrop/ETV a lot of it is very old. They were in the field for 3 weeks. I would say these polls are essentially worthless.

InkStain said...

" (See it has me ending sentences w/ prepositions, evidence of the decline)."

There is absolutely nothing gramatically wrong with ending a sentence with a preposition.

Don't make me grab a bunch of copy-editing expert citations to prove it :)

Real Joe said...

weird polls from Strategic Vision

Simeon said...

The only loss I'm seeing for Truman was when he lost the 1952 NH primary and decided not to run for re-election. I don't think he had lost an election prior to that.

joek1972 said...

So, McCain has now lost independents, and Democrats have an advantage in party ID. Enthusiasm numbers are way higher for the Democrat, the Democrat has far more cash on hand and is leading by double digits in a poll of 15 battleground states. And the number of days remaining before the election is now getting into the single digits.

How is McCain supposed to win this again?

MysticLaker said...

blah..that NC poll is blah.

Heather Nordquist said...

@cane
Well done on explanation of realjoe. I have read his comments for some time and he does have some useful input. What's funny is that if anyone saw me, they'd invite me to the join his border patrol, and he'd get an earful. I detest the anti-immigration talk from the right. As a resident of NM, we are often next door neighbors to some of the most hard-working and generous people I know, the Mexican people. Some are legal, some are not, some have naturalized. Broad generalizations shouldn't be used for any group.

hurn0003 said...

InkStain said...

"There is absolutely nothing gramatically wrong with ending a sentence with a preposition.

Don't make me grab a bunch of copy-editing expert citations to prove it :)"

Now this is off topic, but much more interesting. I was always taught that you were never to end a sentence in a preposition. Is it true that I have been rewriting sentences all this time for no good reason?

newsinOH said...

Big Cleveland economic news that might even swing the remaining Mc voters: National City Bank, one of, if not THE, largest banks here has apparently been sold . . . it's financial condition has been an issue of great concern.

takestock said...

Regarding the B-girl, I'd like to know why did she decide to even go to the press and give them information on this story? And who took that photograph? If she really was sexually assaulted, I don't think she would want to make national news from it.

Real Joe said...

shawn said...
Rasmussen Noon Release

North Carolina
Obama - 48
McCain - 50


McCain Surge !!

pafl said...

Truman may have lost the 1924 Jackson County (MO) Judge race. Further research required.

Strangeite said...

Why couldn't Gov. Palin just answer this question with a simple "Yes" and why does Sen. McCain just sit there.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qty8kuS7Vo

Heather Nordquist said...

@joek1972

It's all about Pennsylvania. Sarah Palin guaranteed a win there yesterday. LOL :)

zzyzx said...

Come on NC. Don't get cold feet now!

InkStain said...

" I was always taught that you were never to end a sentence in a preposition. Is it true that I have been rewriting sentences all this time for no good reason?"

Sort of.

There are things that middle-school English teachers will teach not because they are *rules*, but because they force you to develop good writing habits. Sort of like how you can't get a ticket for not putting your hands on the 10 and 2 position of the steering wheel, but it teaches you good habits.

Ending a sentence with a preposition is usually the sign of an awkwardly constructed sentence. But occasionally the rewrite is even worse.

newsinOH said...

In case anyone cares, PNC out of Pitt bought National City in Cleveland. NatCity's HQ in Cleve was one of the area's largest employers so major job losses are expected . . .

Voice of the Midwest said...

A half an hour ago, I said we should not jump to conclusions about the young lady in Pittsburgh.

But you do not spread out time between interviews of an alleged assault victim unless you are giving them time for a mea culpa.

The police know the difference between a domestic assault being hidden by a scared wife/girlfriend and a genuine assault.

If assaulted, the backwards B would not be a superficial cut. Crimes of passion are accompanied with deep slashes - not with tattoo like accuracy.

Also, Charter Bank and the PPD would have a portion of the video of the assault all over Pittsburgh television for two reasons: to do a public APB and warn the public to be vigilent.

That hasn't happened.

I think they are giving her time to reconsider her story before they charge her with making a false claim. You NEVER create a gap between interviews unless you are certain the evidence is not there.

hurn0003 said...

InkStain said...

"Ending a sentence with a preposition is usually the sign of an awkwardly constructed sentence. But occasionally the rewrite is even worse."

There is a Churchill quote to this effect, that always made me smile.

Supposedly an editor had clumsily rearranged one of Churchill’s sentences to avoid ending it in a preposition, and the Prime Minister, very proud of his style, scribbled this note in reply: “This is the sort of English up with which I will not put."

Buckeye said...

JFK never lost an election.

Voice of the Midwest said...

"The only loss I'm seeing for Truman was when he lost the 1952 NH primary and decided not to run for re-election. I don't think he had lost an election prior to that."

Yeah, but his business losses in life as a habadasher in KC would make lesser men jump off of the highest water tower in Independence.

Loss comes in different forms to different people.

CommieChemist said...

The B-girl claims that the robber said that he would make her a "Barack supporter".

He supposedly sat on her chest and carved a the B. From that angle the B would have been backward to him.


http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/23/mccain-volunteer-says-mugged-b-carved-face/

joshua said...

woot come on NC my home state might be starting to change its mind.!

nobama 08! go mccain!.

hurn0003 said...

Buckeye said...

"JFK never lost an election."

They are counting his defeat for VP at convention as a loss.

LAT said...

news--thank you for the info on Ohio and the bank bought by PNC. Just incredible. The economic news today will be digested all weekend long. Bad bad bad all over the world.

I do not buy that Rass pol of NC. PPP which works out of NC is not seeing any tightening there. I trust them.

RWD said...

"There is absolutely nothing gramatically wrong with ending a sentence with a preposition."

And it wasn't actually a preposition, was it? Wasn't it the "to" from an incomplete infinitive? as in 'I want to'?

Matt said...

LOL @ Ras polling NC three times in a week until they get a result they like. I'll wait for PPP poll early next week. They understand the state. Ras and Survey USA do not.

Real Joe said...



republicans planning non-partisan election night events

developing...

its really sad :-(

pygmy_owl said...

The early voting thing has me puzzled. I'm not sure what it does -- whether it solidifies the polls or just reflects enthusiasm among the die hards. But here are two under-discussed points:

(1) The really strong indication in the early voters is not the partisans who have voted, but the independents. We can track how they've been voting (roughly) by judging where independents fall on the day that they've voted. If independents are breaking for Obama in the early votes, that should be reflected in the actual votes. Those with declared party affiliations are different, of course, because we don't know if we're pulling from the die-hards or from those who may only lean one direction.

2) if there's one thing that democrats have learned in the past few elections, it's to take _nothing_ for granted. I don't think republicans are in the same boat. Any moderately informed democrat has felt the pain of pulling the lever and watching the whole election unravel. So, where I think some republicans may feel like this election is in the bag for Obama, and so not vote; I suspect that most democrats, in the face of the strong polling data, will not at all feel this way; and they will work their hardest to make sure that their vote gets logged.

Just speculating, of course, but I think the logic makes sense.

Heather Nordquist said...

This is the reason the GOP loses. More hilarity from Bachmann.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/the-uptake/michele-bachmann-not-all_b_137463.html

Buckeye said...

LBJ lost the 1960 democratic primary to JFK.

Seretse said...

I didn't see a MOE on rasmussen. Does anybody have access to MOE?

Joe Prime said...

Gallup just released a poll stating that "early voters are split". They claim that of the people who have already cast their ballots. 31% for Obama and 29% for McCain. Can someone please explain how 40% of the electorate who have ALREADY voted can be undecided? Or are they implying a 40% (majority) vote for a third party candidate?

InkStain said...

The fact that a M+2 poll in NC is considered bad news for Obama shows how far out of control this election is for McCain.

pafl said...

Truman lost his bid for reelection as Jackson County Judge in 1924.

Lincoln said...

I'm sorry, but John McCain just has the worst campaign in recent history. Nothing more needs to be said.

He is completely out of money, and yet pays Palin's make-up artist(!?!?) more money than any other staffer?

Total comic absurdity.

Hank said...

> Ending a sentence with a
> preposition is usually the sign
> of an awkwardly constructed
> sentence. But occasionally the
> rewrite is even worse.

A freshman at Harvard, searching for the library without success, stops an upperclassman and asks, "Can you tell me where the library's at?" The upperclassman looks down his nose at the freshman and replies, "Heah at Hahvahd, we don't end ahr sentences with prepositions!" Whereupon the freshman replies, "Oh, I'm sorry. Can you tell me where the library's at, you asshole?"

The construction "of which", "from which", "to which", etc are often a powerful antidote to the dreaded dangling preposition. Churchillian wit nothwithstanding, it makes one's sentences sound a little upperclassman-esque, but does avoid some rather bizzare mis-parsings.

Charles Crook said...

McCain rally in Denver:

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_10805382

"Nearly 4,000 people packed into the National Western Arena today to see Republican John McCain "

Obama rally Sunday:
http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_10798320

McCain rally: gymnasium
Obama rally: outdoors

Someone in the O campaign has noticed that an outdoors campaign event looks better on TV...

Shawn said...

Alright on the mugging story - I don't mean to make lite of an apparent attack on someone - she was obviously roughed up. But someone carving a "B" on her cheek "with a knife" while that person sat on their chest is complete BS. First the "B" is a surface scratch according to the police. Furthermore the "B" is backwards, kind of like what would happen if you did it to yourself in a mirror! Looked good in the mirror didn't it?

Picture here

Real Joe said...



Anti Obama Ad

Our Country Deserves Better PAC attempts to tie Obama's beliefs those of the former Weather Underground member, pastor and disgraced mayor.
"Sorry, senator. But if this is the kind of change you want for our America, then you can keep the change."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDcQUcAjoeI

Voice of the Midwest said...

"In case anyone cares, PNC out of Pitt bought National City in Cleveland. NatCity's HQ in Cleve was one of the area's largest employers so major job losses are expected . . ."

This is chaos. This not only affects the Nat City people in Ohio, but the guy who owns the lunch counter down the block from the Nat City HQ. It also hurts the local printer who had the Nat City account in Ohio.

They will say X many jobs will be lost with this deal, but honestly it is a 2X to 3X proposition in job losses when this happens.

The loss of DHL in Ohio is testament to that and the loss of Chrysler jobs in Indiana will hurt Kokomo and Anderson big time.

Alyssa said...

inkstain said...
"The fact that a M+2 poll in NC is considered bad news for Obama shows how far out of control this election is for McCain."


O+1 in GA as well.

Heather Nordquist said...

@pygmy_owl

The country is definitely underestimating the effect that two Bush "elections" have had on the Dem base. We would rather give ourselves a black eye and carve an "M" in the side of our face than fail to vote in this election. Nothing will be taken for granted this time.

Dr. Matt said...

takestock said...
Regarding the B-girl, I'd like to know why did she decide to even go to the press and give them information on this story? And who took that photograph? If she really was sexually assaulted, I don't think she would want to make national news from it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


It all sounds fishy. According to the AP: "...a photo of the young woman began to circulate around the internet. Clearly the woman was beaten very badly and the "B", which appears reversed in the photo, is very clear on her right cheek."

This is a coordinated hoax. Game over for the reich-wing

Blame said...

AZ could go Blue.

There is a lot of local resentment against McCain because he brings back no bacon. He has done nothing recently to help them forget that detail.

The question is: just how vicious is Obama feeling? He has the cash. He could go for it.

newsinOH said...

@pygmy_owl

Just a caveat about partisanship in OH voting results (if info of this sort is ever released): upon registration, voters are all listed as "U" or undeclared. Party affiliation only attaches when a voter votes in a primary. You had to change your party affiliation "x" number of days before a primary in the past but I believe that law was recently changed.

There were a ton of new registrations after the most recent primary: all of whom would qualify as "independent" according to Ohio's classification system.

joshua said...

matt,

what on earth are you talking about? this is the second poll from NC, not the third.

he did the same with ohio, MO last week, MO got worse when he did it ohio got better.

they do this all the time....nate already said ras is one of the best pollsters.

ppp had some problems anyways, they had obama up 7 when all the polls after that never had obama getting over 4 in NC, so yeah they have a problem with there big dem lean........

Loralee said...

I am white, college-educated Californian who needed cheaper housing.

I moved to New Mexico.

We're never as original as we think.

Alyssa said...

"Total comic absurdity."


I've been calling the entire McCain campaign this for some time now.

www.democratz.org said...

Obama has the lead in New Mexico and Colorado and California, Oregon and Washington State. Obama has Arizona surrounded. Hehe.





Please answer a poll on health care at http://poll.democratz.org

You can watch Countdown with Keith Olbermann at
http://liberal.democratz.org

Charles Crook said...

If GM buys Chrysler in the near future, today will be seen as the good old days. GM wants Chrysler's cash, not its vehicles.

joshua said...

Alyssa, it was an insider advantage, they have always had an obama bias.....no big deal ras just did a GA poll yesterday with mccain up 5.

OTF said...

Scotty Rasmussen is thrwoing the Republican base a bone on his McCain +2 numbers today. Here's how.

NC Poll Monday Obama wins Indies's 59 to 38. Obama + 21

NC Poll today McCain wins Indies +17

37point change in Indies in polls that are essentially concurrent. Scotty who are you kidding?

Heather Nordquist said...

@joeprime

Could 40% have refused to say who they voted for?

pafl said...

Wilson was 3 for 3:

Governor of New Jersey 1910
Pres 1912 & '16

Simeon said...

"Truman lost his bid for reelection as Jackson County Judge in 1924."

Thanks, pafl. I missed that one.

Going further back, I think that Calvin Coolidge never lost. And Coolidge ran for a heck of a lot of offices before the presidency. But I might be missing something small there, too.

The Crazy News Guy said...

Wonder where a huge chunk of the Palin $150,000 clothing/makeup September bill went?
Amy Strozzi, the $11,400 a week Hollywood makeup artist.

Real Joe said...

loralee said...
I am white, college-educated Californian who needed cheaper housing.

I moved to New Mexico.

We're never as original as we think.


i hear Mexico has cheaper housing

really cheap !!

LOL

Carlo Graziani said...

On prepositions, there's a Churchill-ism:

"Ending a sentence with a preposition is something up with which I will not put!"

The Crazy News Guy said...

http://hottiesinthenews.blogspot.com/2008/10/amy-strozzi-pictures-of-sarah-palin.html

presidentraygun said...

The police are so skeptical about the "B" girl's story that they gave her a lie detector test. The police are refusing to release results, which tells me.. she's lying.

If she passed with flying colors, they would be issuing and APB. The fact they aren't and talking about the inconsistancies in her story, tell me that they are giving her a chance to walk back her story.

Booze Fiend said...

No ending sentences with prepositions was simply a bit of foolishness invented by classicists in the 18th-19th Centuries to get English to sound more like Latin. As a Germanic language at the core, this was incredibly stupid.

Ending sentences and splitting infinitives are fine, as long as you convey the meaning properly. Otherwise, you're just being a prescriptivist moron.

markymark said...

On the Presidents who have lost stuff question, LBJ did lose the nomination to JFK, true, but did he run in any of the primaries? Or was he expection to get the nomination based on uncommitted delegates (there were many more than there would be now in the days before Primaries were not largely ignored!) JFK had lost a floor vote for the VP in 1956, but does that really count? Not a vote of actual voters.

Jesse Radin said...

The Goldwater bounce could be huge.

The main split between young and old is on social not fiscal issues.

A lot of people are very uncomfortable with the so called "abortion amendment" that the GOP platform has.

This will encourage kids to talk to parents and grandparents about Obama.

AZ could go Blue. MT and ND will be +3 Obama or so when he is elected.

TX will be within 5-10 but still a loss.

The GOP will be the minority for 12 years or so until they get some moderate, their version of Clinton.

Kay Bailey Hutchinson would be a good one. She was pretty pissed when Palin got picked.

Eric said...

I assume Rasmussen has the internals for their state polling available to Premium subscribers? It's always annoying when you can't find the internals from a good pollster to see what they saw.

Seretse said...

Who is to say the Rasmussen poll with Obama winning Independents is the right one?

Jesse Radin said...

Also, the girl who tried to lie and claim that Obama supporters attacked her by cutting a backwards B on her cheek.

Even Michelle Malkin called her on it and said she's lying.

The anti bradley effect as in "Holy shit i didn't know my party was so racist" gives the Democrats GA and Possibly KY.

pafl said...

Coolidge may have lost an election in 1902, give me a few minutes.
On LBJ, he lost a Senate race in 1940 so the 1960 nomination is moot.

Thomas said...

Sisyphean...Great word, Nate!

Andrew said...

Who is to say the Rasmussen poll with Obama winning Independents is the right one?

No one. The wide discrepancy raises doubts about both polls, and the pollster.