So much for slow news days.
John Lewis's comments about the McCain campaign "playing with fire" are likely to dominate the news cycle for the next 24-48 hours, including the morning panel shows.
The conventional wisdom holds that, whenever the discussion turns to race, this tends to be detrimental to Obama, who for the most part has been scrupulously trying to avoid invoking racial themes into the campaign, at least through official channels. The previous time an issue like this came up, it coincided with a period in which Obama's lead in the polls was eroding.
This situation is liable to be a bit different, however.
Part of this is because Lewis is no ordinary surrogate. In fact, so far as I can tell, he is not really a surrogate at all, holding no official position with the Obama campaign. Moreover, Lewis is no Jesse Jackson, someone whom many Americans instinctively recoil from. On the contrary, Lewis is someone who McCain praised as one of the three wisest people in his life at Rick Warren's Saddleback Forum.
But also, take a look at the trailing paragraph in McCain's strongly-worded statement to the press today:“I call on Senator Obama to immediately and personally repudiate these outrageous and divisive comments that are so clearly designed to shut down debate 24 days before the election. Our country must return to the important debate about the path forward for America.”
McCain is calling on Obama to repudiate Lewis's comments -- which of course is exactly what Obama should (and probably will) do. By calling on Obama to repudiate Lewis, however, McCain allows Obama to be the adult in the room. We have a pretty good idea of what Obama is liable to say:"John Lewis is someone whom Senator McCain and I both admire greatly. But rhetoric like this is inappropriate and uncalled for, and I repudiate and reject his remarks. As Senator McCain says, this campaign should be about which candidate can best lead America forward in these difficult times, and there is simply no need to inject the racial politics of the past into a discussion about what is best for our country today. We look forward to a vigorous and civil discussion about these issues with Senator McCain over the final three weeks of the campaign."
Where is John McCain left once Obama does this? Obama gets to have a minor Sista Souljah moment, and also gets to concede McCain's argument that the campaign should be about the issues. So what happens the next time that the McCain campaign invokes Bill Ayers -- or Jeremiah Wright? McCain is not living up to his campaign's own standards -- which Obama has "generously" agreed to.
UPDATE: In the time that I was preparing this post, Obama spokesman Bill Burton put out a statement to Ben Smith at Politico:Senator Obama does not believe that John McCain or his policy criticism is in any way comparable to George Wallace or his segregationist policies.
I do not quite agree with Smith's characterization that "Obama backs Lewis statement", as there is a bit more nuance in here. But clearly Burton was ceding less ground than I would have expected/recommended. Keep in mind, however, that the Obama campaign very frequently pulls a good cop/bad cop routine between its press shop and the candidate himself. So I would not be surprised if Obama finds an opportunity to field a question about Lewis at a forthcoming presser, and is somewhat more magnanimous in his remarks.
But John Lewis was right to condemn some of the hateful rhetoric that John McCain himself personally rebuked just last night, as well as the baseless and profoundly irresponsible charges from his own running mate that the Democratic nominee for President of the United States ‘pals around with terrorists.’
As Barack Obama has said himself, the last thing we need from either party is the kind of angry, divisive rhetoric that tears us apart at a time of crisis when we desperately need to come together. That is the kind of campaign Senator Obama will continue to run in the weeks ahead.
UPDATE #2: I don't know where people got the idea that *I* am disagreeing with Lewis. I am not -- I think Lewis is mostly right, although I think the invocation of George Wallace is a bit much. The whole point of the "trap", however, is that by ostensibly rejecting and repudiating Lewis -- by holding him to a higher standard -- Obama can in fact reject and repudiate the tactics of the McCain campaign, which is not living up to that standard.
10.11.2008
Did McCain Just Walk Into a Trap?
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5:05 PM
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Answer: Yes.
As a former resident of the great John Lewis's district, this is especially offensive to me. McCain has gone so far over the Rubicon, he's a lost cause forever.
Thanks for letting me vent!
forgive McCain. He has gone senile
That hypothetical response sounded like it came straight from Obama's mouth.
All we have to do is hold on for another tight 3+ weeks.
The Great White Hope
John McCain will hit his stride this week. Four weeks before Election Day he finds himself sitting atop a mountain of white discontent. He has by default become the repository of all anti-black racial angst in this country. Anyone who knows John McCain knows that this is not his natural constituency. Truly, he is the maverick of the Republican Party. Whatever Bush was, he wasn’t. It is for this reason that he became the darling of the Press. That and his congenial and open manner, given to authentic straight talk that needled the right and pleased the left. The man is many things, but racist is not one of them. In this regard he is like Clinton, steamrolled wrongly on the race issue for the sake of Obama’s electability. Tag teamed on it by the opposition campaign and the media.
John McCain faces an enormous challenge. For the sake of his history and our own, it will be important, if not essential, for him to defuse any latent racial animus. He must do this swiftly and definitively. Obama’s election must be cloaked in legitimacy as must a McCain victory. We cannot afford to have this election tainted by tinges of rasicm and there being a large segment of society feeling rejected and disaffected. We could be b adly split and wounded as a nation as a result.
McCain with his sense of duty and an ingrained love of country along with the wisdom of his years understands this. He knows the nation must be healed. He would rather lose the election, I think, than win in an inappropriate way.
McCain lurched in the right direction Friday when he defended Obama, correcting a woman’s mis-assertion that Obama was “an Arab”. “No. . . . decent family man . . . no.” And earlier shouted down those who were booing Obama, admonishing them that he and they had to be respectful and run a respectful campaign. He assured his listeners that Obama was not “scary.” It was a better endorsement than Bill Clinton gave him.
McCain could not have been more forthright in denying and defending. He understands the stakes.
While cautioning and calming his crowds, McCain and the RNC are broadcasting a series of broadsides regarding Obama’s tainted associations. This is a legitimate area of inquiry as there seems to be a certain lack of completeness in the biography of the presumptive next POTUS. And the media seems astonishingly incurious. Yet it appears that the public has at least a passing interest in the topic, despite attempts by the Obama campaign and its media allies to shout down the line of inquiry. Certainly we can fill in a bit of the bio in between the longer riffs on the economy. Perhaps the time it takes to debunk the racist fear-mongering.
In a tone deaf move, the Obama campaign has let venerable African- American Congressman John Lewis accuse the McCain campaign of stoking racism and accusing them of all sorts of other bad stuff. He was quoted as saying that McCain was sowing the seeds of hatred, comparing him to George Wallace and drawing a link to violence against black folk, like the bombing of the church in Birmingham during the sixties that took the lives of four young black girls. The McCain campaign reacted with appropriate outrage and scorn. McCain himself demanded his own apologies, including one from Obama himself.
The Obama campaign’s response was predictable: Characterizing the Congressman’s remarks as somewhat extreme, but suggesting that perhaps McCain was in fact to blame.
Game on.
John McCain it seems must calm the fear within the electorate, taking action where Obama is passive. Obama cannot do it. But McCain can. The question is: Can McCain transcend the race issue that is increasingly being injected into the campaign and do so in such a manifestly honorable way that he becomes an acceptable alternative to an unknown Obama? Can he win?
With the markets facing their worst shellacking since the Great Depression and this week ranking right up there with the worst of the sudden tumbles of the early 30s, we may be at an economic tipping point. Imagine the terror that each side feels when contemplating victory by the other. I’d split the true believer unmovable partisans equally, no advantage either side.
Is the Conservative or Liberal Agenda more apt for the time? Or do we want something in between?
Jump ball for the folks in the middle.
My money is on McCain. I think he has the stones and the heart to heal this nation. Obama is too cool and detached to truly embrace us. He can preach to us, but he cannot heal us. John McCain stumbled around that stage on Tuesday and I could think of nothing but his suffering in captivity. He was a big lumbering bear, but at least he got off his ass and danced for us. Obama hung back, slumped on his stool, a look of bemused indulgence on his face. He stood slump shouldered and loose before us, not at all stiff or stumbling like with McCain. He competed for us. He will fight for us.
Ask yourself: In whose embrace would you rather be when the world is tumbling down around you? I think each will answer according to his or her heart and their vote will follow.
With such a basic and intrinsic decision to be made, it is apparent why the race is so fluid. Nothing has been fixed, least of all an Obama lead one month before the vote.
Better to be ahead in 25 days!
Pete Kent
PS: “TrooperGate” Lays an Egg -- I hear it’s going straight to video as a narrative.
And we have a statement from Obama's people. No dice on repudiation:
"Senator Obama does not believe that John McCain or his policy criticism is in any way comparable to George Wallace or his segregationist policies.
But John Lewis was right to condemn some of the hateful rhetoric that John McCain himself personally rebuked just last night, as well as the baseless and profoundly irresponsible charges from his own running mate that the Democratic nominee for President of the United States ‘pals around with terrorists.’
As Barack Obama has said himself, the last thing we need from either party is the kind of angry, divisive rhetoric that tears us apart at a time of crisis when we desperately need to come together. That is the kind of campaign Senator Obama will continue to run in the weeks ahead."
this is one time I disagree with Nate. I actually would like Obama not to reject the comments. McCain is a disgrace and Lewis is right. Now he gets to whip himself into an outrage> After he stood by when his supporters called Obama a terrorist? please.
So John Lewis single-handedly redirected the quality of discourse in this campaign? That's pretty awesome.
I disagree with Nate. I concur with Lewis's comments. The reaction of Palin's crowds proves that what Lewis said is correct.
Of course, whether Obama should repudiate is a different matter. Maybe Lewis was intentionally doing this? In that sense, Nate's right, the street smart Lewis DID set a trap for McCain, thereby giving Obama the Sister Souljah moment. Damn, I take back what I started this with, shoudla known Nate was right.
TYPO ". . . for the most part has scrupulously trying to avoid . . ."
Missing a word: should be ". . . has been . . ."
I doubt you'll read this before fixing the problem, but for the record, you probably want "a href", not "a herf" for that link to huffpo ;-)
Obama has already responded:
Senator Obama does not believe that John McCain or his policy criticism is in any way comparable to George Wallace or his segregationist policies.
But John Lewis was right to condemn some of the hateful rhetoric that John McCain himself personally rebuked just last night, as well as the baseless and profoundly irresponsible charges from his own running mate that the Democratic nominee for President of the United States ‘pals around with terrorists.’
As Barack Obama has said himself, the last thing we need from either party is the kind of angry, divisive rhetoric that tears us apart at a time of crisis when we desperately need to come together. That is the kind of campaign Senator Obama will continue to run in the weeks ahead.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1008/Obama_backs_Lewis_statement.html?showall
decent family man is many things, but at least a passing interest in between?
Jump ball for the sake of Obama’s electability.
Tag teamed on Obama to race, this swiftly and uncalled for, and accusing them of all stiff or her heart to heal this nation.
Obama campaign has by default become the stones and calming his own apologies, including one from On the topic, despite attempts by default become the trailing paragraph in which Obama's lead one month before the election.
Our country must return to be made, it is apparent why the adult in McCain's strongly-worded statement to repudiate Lewis's comments about the vote.
Better to be made, it coincided with McCain.
He assured his ass and there is John McCain victory.
We look forward to a basic and they had to defuse any latent racial politics of other bad stuff.
He understands the final three wisest people in the topic, despite attempts by default become the maverick of the past into the campaign and its media seems astonishingly incurious.
Yet it But McCain allows Obama hung back, slumped on Obama to immediately and its media allies to be detrimental to be a basic and the media.
John McCain it by the biography of other bad stuff.
He will fight for the folks in the right up there seems to repudiate Lewis, however, McCain faces an unknown Obama?
Can McCain transcend the McCain campaign and its media allies to be detrimental to be respectful campaign.
He competed for the time?
Or do we want something in the topic, despite attempts by tinges of the past into a discussion about these issues with the wisdom of his remarks.
As Senator McCain over the campaign.
Where is no Jesse Jackson, someone who McCan praised as must a vigorous and detached to heal this week.
John McCain knows the nation must be about which Obama's lead in the path forward for America.” McCain will hit his campaign's own it will be important, if not “scary.” It is for the folks in fact to be detrimental to a vigorous and divisive comments -- which candidate can tell, he becomes an ingrained love of what Obama himself.
ANOTHER TYPO "On the contrary, Lewis is someone who McCan praised. . . ."
McCain, not McCan.
also--who the F*&^% is McCain to call Obama on anything? He demands that Obama reject this? He is such a child after all the hate he has promoted now he stands there like a moralist wagging his finger? Utterly disgusting.
Pete Kent, it is truly hilarious that you believe Gov. Palin's unlawful abuse of power doesn't have legs as a narrative. It is a defining moment for her and I guarantee it will be a fixture in the media from now until election day. And when the GOP loses, the talking heads will continue to reference Palin's abuse of power as one of many reasons why McCain went down so hard in the final round. Your prediction that the story will go "straight to video" is delusional. http://www.popduds.com
Nate -- You're a great sdtatistician, a fair analyst and a lousy politician. (Oh, yeah. You're a pretty good talking head, too.)
I think you are absolutely wrong on Obama repudiating John Lewis, and I see he has not done so. Lewis was right and there is no need for Obama to "triangulate." Obama will stay on course, on message, steady straight, calm and true. No "gotcha" moments, though his supporters want them. They are simply not necessary.
When you take the high road you can better see the wrecked cars in the canyons below.
PeteKent said: "My money is on McCain. I think he has the stones and the heart to heal this nation."
You're quite the jokester, or, if you're serious, delusional. McCain has no "stones" and has proven in this campaign he has no "heart." Many who have respected him for years have come to realize we were wrong all along. As another POW observed, "he's the same spoiled brat he's always been."
I agree 100% with LAT.
Petekent, in response to your questions: "Can McCain transcend the race issue that is increasingly being injected into the campaign and do so in such a manifestly honorable way that he becomes an acceptable alternative to an unknown Obama? Can he win?"
No and no.
I doubt Barack's statement will repudiate John. It will be more nuanced. Maybe observing that McCain himself has modified his position and that Lewis did not take that into account. But any way you look at it it is either a wash or a bit of a victory for Barack. I wonder if the little blip in the Gallup tracking poll today was a nod to McCain for shutting that lady up.
I don't know what you're thinking, Nate.
The Obama campaign did not and should not repudiate Lewis.
It is the McCain campaign, not Lewis, that is dividing this country through hateful rhetoric.
My lord PeteKent is an idiotic windbag, And a loser with a third class, third rate mind. (Maybe he can guest-host the O'Reilly show.)
I don't really see this making any difference, or even stopping the Ayers BS. The above description assumes that McSame has modesty about his lies, and he has proven several times he doesn't. The Republicans have been squealing and whining about "getting back to the issue" ever time someone mentions Sarah Palin, but are more than willing to talk about Obama's life.
McSame will try to press how he is "about the issues" then go on hatemongering with Ayers talk, and he'll sleep well tonight.
Anyone else bothered by the "acceptable" racism against Arabs and Muslims?
McCain countered the "he's an Arab" with "No, no, no, he's a decent family man." Why the hell is that okay?
By the way, I hate that "he's a decent family man" comment. Not because Obama isn't a decent family man but because using that phrase to repudiate a woman calling Obama "an arab" is explicitly connecting being "arab" with not being a "family man". There are plenty of arabs who are decent, hard working and love their families.
Even when McCain's trying to not race bait, he's a race baiting douchebag.
As far as I can tell, the reason that McCain did this (assuming Nate is right about the next 48 hours getting sucked up by it e.g. everything from now until the debate lead-up stories) is because it gets everyone on the race issue again (since we're all tabloid fans at heart) and OFF of the Palin troopergate report. Seems pretty bright from Schmidt if you ask me.
Am I alone in thinking that Obama doesn't necessarily need to repudiate the statements that John Lewis made?
As if the Obama campaign would dare McCain to turn this issue against Obama, by making his own lynch mob rallies an argument that his surrogates repeat daily on TV?
I think the more this narrative gets drawn out, the more Obama has to gain. And he could do exactly that by keeping the ball in play, even if it risks a little controversy.
Then again there is no "little" controversy about this, and Obama doesn't need to take a big risk to let McCain bury himself with this.
Frankly, I see no reason to repudiate Lewis's comments. Everyday the news is dominated by the McCain rally wackjobs the Republican "coalition" gets closer to total collapse. For each person yelling out "bomb Obama" and the like, the reasonable non-racists within the party see an Obama presidency not only as inevitable, but also more acceptable than their own candidate. If the repubs think they can win elections with only the lunatic fringe as supporters, then they are going to have a long time in the wilderness, and Rove's vision of one party democracy will be a reality, only with the wrong party in power.
I think Obama lets this discussion continue. This stuff is merely frightening to Democrats, but it is destroying the Republicans. I say let them go down in flames!
"John McCain will hit his stride this week."
We've heard this HOW many weeks again? I lost count.
Inxblot - Your weird ramblings remind me of McCain's "My fellow prisoners . . ." comment. What bad stuff are you flashing on? Yor posts are totally incomprehensible and totally meaningless. Why don't you and PeteKent go together to one of the freeptard sites where you will be hailed as geniuses?
@STepper: that was short and right on the mark.
@Stephen Ross: I agree that Obama won't repudiate John Lewis. He will say that both he and McCain respect John Lewis. That John felt compelled to criticize the McCain campaign's inflammatory rhetoric shows again how destructive of civil society such rhetoric is.
When did this site turn into the DailyKos? You all tear apart any conservative poster on here, but ignore the idiotic posts made by liberals. I mean, i'm an Obama supporter, and it's driving me mad.
Paul said...
Anyone else bothered by the "acceptable" racism against Arabs and Muslims?
McCain countered the "he's an Arab" with "No, no, no, he's a decent family man." Why the hell is that okay?
I completely agree with you there Paul. I could give McCain the benefit of the doubt and say he was taken aback and totally blindsided by the bluntness of that crazy old lady, but his comment was completely innapropriate.
Alright, we'll all liberals here, but Obama should NOT accept Lewis' statements.
Why? If he accepts them, it will invoke a culture war, losing him white support.
Don't be foolish.
From a purely political point of view I wish the McCain campaign had been left to continue with their attack. It had little if any traction and kept them from talking about the economy. It also made the Obama campaign look angelic by comparison.
you know, we're all addicted to this site, waiting for polls or nate's comment to give us something to discourse on. we should require him to do 3 posts on sundays to make up for lack of polls.
he surely never fails to bring up something to engage our minds!
thanks, nate
:-)
You can't repudiate John Lewis. Nate, you can't do it. This is John Lewis.
He's only one of the most revered survivors of the civil rights era. This guy isn't a polarizing force. He hasn't been tainted like Rev. Jackson.
Lewis was beaten bloody by a white mob on freedom rides. That is as courageous as anything John S. McCain has ever done.
Odd typo: your link to Huffington Post is <a herf="... instead of <a href="...
"You all tear apart any conservative poster on here"
No, we tear apart Pete specifically, who does nothing but post 13-page copied and pasted drivel, that's usually racist and offensive and full of blatant lies and fallacies.
Other Republican posters, like Joe, Mule Rider, VC, FlGOP are all welcome here, as they all hold intelligent conversations (except for Joe, but he's our pet I guess).
Note the nuance in the Obama reply
Senator Obama does not believe that John McCain or his policy criticism is in any way comparable to George Wallace or his segregationist policies.
If you assume the Bradley Effect will happen (it may not, but as a worst case scenario) with a racial bias of 5%, (as dictated by Princeton) Obama still wins 274, 264.
I think they've played McCain properly here, the McCain camp can't say the attacks are against the candidate, and they can't defend the nut nuts in the crowds.
Burton has got it nicely balanced
liberal hippies
let Lewis speak his mind
Obama should stay out of it
McCain should not respond to Lewis
McCain did not vote for the civil rights act
this will open old wounds
adam, you are behind the times - joe finally jumped ship this am, and we welcomed him w/ life lines, warm blankets and hot chocolate laced w/ rum
inxblot said...
When did this site turn into the DailyKos? You all tear apart any conservative poster on here, but ignore the idiotic posts made by liberals. I mean, i'm an Obama supporter, and it's driving me mad.
Au contraire, inxblot. If you are an Obama supporter we're giving you equal treatment.
Your post was gibberish. What? It was a poem? It made no sense, but this quoted post of yours proves that if you take the time you can write cogently. What's your problem?
As for McCain's "racism" torwards Arabs -- maybe. But apparently the woman who called Obama an "Arab" also included another adjective, which the mikes didn't pick up. Someone posted somewhere else the bigoted woman said "Arab terrorist." If so, while McCain was still off the mark, he was trying to humanize Obama and I guess being a "family man" (something McCain is not), would serve that purpose.
Obama's comment, BTW, puts things back to the McCain campaign which is desperately trying to divert the conversation from the "unethical but not illegal" Sarah Palin. (Sound familiar? A lot of Wall Streeters did things that were "unethical but not illegal," too.)
adam said...
(except for Joe, but he's our pet I guess).
pet ? WTF ?
I usually think your political analysis is excellent, but I have to disagree with you here. The fact is that what was happening at those McCain/Palin rallies was outrageous, even if not George Wallace territory (I'm neither old enough nor historian enough to make that comparison), and does deserve to be called out. (Hell, even John McCain, to his credit, did so). Let truth be your guide. Repudiating John Lewis would be everything the Obama campaign has not been: phony.
You yourself said it: John Lewis is a Civil Rights icon widely admired by most Americans, and even by John McCain himself. What could Barack Obama ever gain by distancing himself from him? Less than nothing. It would be a terrible move. If Barack Obama wants someone to be his Sista Souljah, John Lewis is not it.
I think the Obama campaign's official response was about right.
I thought the rambling inxblot post was a Sarah Palin homage that incorporated a bunch of stuff PeteKent had written.
I thought Bill Burton's response was perfect. Then again, I don't think that this story will "dominate" the news cycle -- I've barely seen it. Drudge doesn't even have it up!
I liked Obama's response and don't think he's in a position where he really needs to repudiate this to put McCain in a Catch 22-McCain was already in one. Obama's strategy from the beginning has been to let McCain dig his own grave. This response is right in line with this week's theme of daring McCain to keep this stuff up. Obama is just helping out McCain a little, giving him the chance to exchange his shovel for a backhoe.
As long as the debate is whether or not McCain's campaign is stoking anger - McCain is in a defensive position. His attacks have not led to a reexamination of Obama's relationship with Ayers, (since there is little if any video or sound), but plenty of tv soundbites of people yelling terrorist, kill him and he's an Arab.
Can't wait for the SNL sketch tonight. Should be a doozy.
You do good polling analysis, but you're dead wrong on this one, Nate. There's no need for Obama to triangulate against the base by repudiating Lewis. McCain's already failed to live up to his promise to run a 'clean campaign', with relatively little blowback, so even if Obama adopts this strategy, when McCain brings up Ayers next week I see no way the charge that McCain's doing a 180 on this statement sticks.
In fact, this will only embolden the McCain campaign to argue that Obama, even Obama, rejects Lewis' argument that McCain's whipping his supporters up into a divisive frenzy. The only people who will remember this will be the Democratic base, disgusted that Obama was so easily cowed by McCain's 'demands'. Obama looks stronger if he makes a more nuanced statement.
a little ot but does anyone think it's totally insane that on the evening of the day after the report on palin came out it's already gone? it's buried in nytimes.com, gone from the front page of yahoo, gone from msnbc, and cnn's biggest headline is "palin heightens rhetoric on abortion." i just don't get it...at first i thought that everyone was just done caring about palin but now here we have reporting on her attacks again. what an absolute f'ing disgrace (as usual).
I haven't seen a lot of commentary from Real Joe but he seems like a real stand up guy.
prairiecomm said...
adam, you are behind the times - joe finally jumped ship this am, and we welcomed him w/ life lines, warm blankets and hot chocolate laced w/ rum
now i'm an independent conservative who does not support McCain
:-)
i don't want to be on the McCain campaign(Titanic 2)
it looks like i have to live with higher taxes
:-(
Who and what is a Sista Souljah?? I've heard of her but don't understand.
Note the nuance in the Obama reply
mark - very good, I'd missed that!
I'll bet most people will have missed it, especially those talking violence.
SNL tonight. Rerun. :(
Michael Phelps hosting show. (Tina Fey in her first Sarah Palin performance, though.)
Also, illissius is 100% right that this would be a transparently phony move by the Obama camp, and that's what they haven't been this entire election season.
Repudiating Lewis would be the ultimate 'win the battle, lose the war' move. It might be a short-term tactical success, but in the long run it's a losing strategy - you should support Democratic icons, not undermine them to position yourself as more moderate. Newsflash - the center is where the Democrats are now, and they need to start acting like it.
inkblotx
When did this site turn into the DailyKos? You all tear apart any conservative poster on here, but ignore the idiotic posts made by liberals. I mean, i'm an Obama supporter, and it's driving me mad.
Actually, I couldn't figure out what your post was trying to say at all - the sentences didn't make sense, and I gave up reading. perhaps you were typing so fast you didn't realize the typos. it was odd
I DISAGREED. Nate
More than anyone, Lewis has a right to say what he said. In 1961he was beaten to a bloody pulp by a white mob as a Freedom Rider in Montgomerey. He knows what he's talking about, and he's saying to protect the lives of minorities and other oppressed people. Have to say, I'm bothered by this post more than others. Lewis spoke the truth; he should not have to retract it.
However, see my post above. Maybe Lewis is deliberately giving Obama his opportunity for a Sista Souljah moment.
Peter Kent... First of all I do not think you have a 3rd rate mind as someone just suggested. You do bring up a point. Thinking of which canidate one would feel they want to be in the embrace of. Think of it. John has shown himself to be 'flighty' for lack of a better word throughout his entire adult life. He does not and has not ever reassured me and I too am a Viet Nam vet and spent a long time in Viet Nam and also in Iraq and then onto other countries such as Afghanistan and Iraq. When I think of being reassured by someone it would not be a man such as John Mc Cain who has shown great difficulty with stability throughout his life and I have watched that life personally for a long time not just when this campaign began. I could not have voted for the John Mc Cain of 2000 or this one but try to imagine that embrace and the fact that this 72 year old man could casually ignore a proven bipartisan case of abuse of power and state that it happened because of "Obama's people". We have lived through this movie before and as an older person I cannot bear the thought that the embrace I find myself in might be a low information right wing fraud such as Sarah Palin. God Bless John Lewis for coming forward. If you think that the ties to an American TERRORIST doesn't mean wink wink something racist and bad then you are mistaken. I have lived with Arabs and regret the inference that somehow all of them are evil that our American society has learned to accept. Feel sorry for John Mc Cain but don't vote for him as President of the United States.
Also, if Obama does this, it's basically McCain saying "Jump!" and Obama asking "How high?". Not great for public image, campaign dynamics, or just about anything at all.
I just want Obama to keep talking about the Economy and McCain to keep Floundering. Let's not deviate from that course, it's working quite well!
realjoe
i don't want to be on the McCain campaign(Titanic 2)
it looks like i have to live with higher taxes
Ah, but you'll earn pennies in heaven ...
;--)
The crux of the Obama camp comment:
"Lewis was talking about hateful rhetoric, and McCain himself has shown he agrees with him, and with us."
Hateful rhetoric doesn't have to be about color to be extremely dangerous.
Comparing it to Wallace was a bad idea, but it was a parallel, not a statement that the hate was race-based (even if part of it has proven to be just that).
one$earned said...
Who and what is a Sista Souljah??
WTF ?
use english
I'm old enough to remember George Wallace's two national campaigns (68 & 72) and I think John Lewis is more right than wrong.
Republicans have won many elections using the divisive hammer of race and hate. Where many candidates in the past would have wilted under the personal, hateful, attacks from the republicans, Obama's support has grown stronger.
The republican party is out of ideas, and out of time. The "Liberal" charge no longer holds any weight. The chants of "Socialist" and "Communist" fall on deaf ears. Their economic policy has thrown this country into economic chaos and voters are tired of policies tilted towards the rich.
Governor Palin opened a new attack today on Barack Obama about abortion. Again, the country has changed. The country has moved away from the culture wars and looking for new leadership. The small minded, ignorant republican base is dying off and being replaced by younger, open minded voters looking for a less divisive, forward looking leader. Obama is their leader.
America has changed. On November 4 the US will send a message to the entire globe that the era of "Go it alone" arrogant foreign policy is over. The era of preemptive attack is over. The era of American imperialism is over. On Nov 4, America will shock the world.
Someone asked what a "sista souljah" moment was. Here it is:
"Souljah became infamous for her statements that year about the 1992Los Angeles riots. In an interview conducted May 13, 1992, she was quoted in the Washington Post as saying:
'If Black people kill Black people every day, why not have a week and kill white people?'
The quotation, which was taken out of context, was later reproduced in the media, and she was widely criticized. Presidential candidate Bill Clinton publicly criticized that statement—and Jesse Jackson for allowing her to be on his Rainbow Coalition—thus the Sister Souljah moment was created."
illissius said...
you think mccain's camp will miss the nuance that mark pointed out?
"Also, if Obama does this, it's basically McCain saying "Jump!" and Obama asking "How high?". Not great for public image, campaign dynamics, or just about anything at all."
Ceding this ground coming from someone like John Lewis so you can let John McCain moralize after what's happened so far in those creepy rallies is pretty effed up, whatever the campaign strategery dictates.
I completely disagree. McCain is pulling another "lipstick on a pig" comment by trying to make Obama look bad for something he didn't say and isn't responsible for. Americans will see through this. John Lewis is essentially correct--we've all seen the "terrorist!" shouts and the "he's an Arab" bullshit. The country isn't stupid. They know what this is all code for.
Obama should simply say that John Lewis is an esteemed politician and veteran of the civil rights movement, that he doesn't work for the Obama campaign, and that he's entitled to his opinion. Obama should then refuse to comment further and say that he would like return the discussion to the issues like the economy and the war on terror and that he hopes McCain will do the same. The end.
Repudiating the remarks just gives in to the campaign terrorists (McCain and Palin)
Pete the Parrot
please quit spamming those obnoxious & trite 'commentaries' from your neo-con alter-universe
you must be being paid by the GOPers as your screed is growing ever more noxious
DNFTT
i just don't get it
McCain has the hate vote
wtf is he doing ?
This is stupid, noone cares. Lewis is a guy who went through it all and is sensitive to what happened in the '60's. No big deal.
This will not affect the election, lets move on. McCain is trying to make race an isue and this is a good way to do it, but noone cares.
Much ado about nothing...it will be out of the news cycle my Monday. Nothing breaks through the economy story right now, even Palin breaking the law.
I hate to pile on, Nate, but I also disagree with you. McCain's own statement was pure spin -- Lewis made " a brazen and baseless attack on (his) character" ???? Lewis addressed only the words spoken and the actions taken by the McCain campaign. There is nothing inappropriate in what he said, so it would be very inappropriate to repudiate him.
Lewis did seem to attack "the character of the thousands of hardworking Americans who come to our events" and rightly so. Some of those people have demonstrated a distinct lack of character.
I'm grateful for any discussion this issue gets in MSM because, honestly, I am worried for the Obama family at this point. The rational majority of Americans need to wake up and recognize what is happening, and let the nutcases know that we will not tolerate them.
Still from the updates by Nate i disagree that Obama has to disown Lewis. The 'trap' is not worth it. If there is a trap here is that the Obama camp is putting the whole tenor of McCain's campaign in the line of what is unacceptable, saying good things about McCain for stepping up the plate yesterday but standing tough about the craziness of the rallies.
Also--this McCain calling on Obama to do stuff. That is a typical Republican trap to make Obama look like a wimp. Not going to happen.
I respect Nate a lot but on this, sorry, you are calling the tactic wrong.
By just continuing the focus on the economy, Obama stays above the fray...while McCain is down in the mud playing 'politics'. Every time McCain/Palin are in the news regarding some distracting and silly topic, its yet another day that they appear completely clueless to the actual crisis facing America: the biggest economic crash of the last 70 years. So let little Johnny and Little Sarah play in their 'character' sandboxes. Grown-ups Obama/Biden have a country to save.
It's not a move to get votes. Lewis is probably sincerely worried about incitement of violence. McCain didn't do anything to rein in his followers until people complained about his inaction. Lewis speaking out keeps the pressure on McCain and Palin to stop being so irresponsible.
Let me get this right.
A guy should be fired if he does something ethically wrong but technically not illegal like tazer his kid when his kid asked for it, but when the Governor has done something unethical she get's a pass?
i really don't see why obama should completely condemn lewis's statements. i see your point about the trap, etc, but why work on a 3 step scheme to accomplish what you already have in your hand? what's the point? it seems like a rube goldberg approach, and it puts the ball in mccain's court, letting mccain take control of the narrative when that's the last thing he wants to do.
and besides, based on reaction in the polls to the negative campaigning, it appears the voters, at least at some level, agree with lewis's sentiment. they don't like the tenor of mccain's campaign.
i think this whole strategy you lay out shows one of the fundamental blunders that political analysis can fall into; playing to the pundits, and forgetting that it's the voters that matter.
Not to go back and forth with Real Joe, but I do. I simply repeated part of an earlier Post. Sista Souljah was reference and that person or term does not register with me.
If you couldn't answer the question, you could have simply not responded at all.
McSame may not be George Wallace but Palin for sure sounds like Georgie Wallace.
Three thoughts about todays news-First, the Ohio state poll probably doesn't show a shift in sentiment but merely reflects how close this race remains. Even with a huge voter turnout in the state the margin of victory will likely be less than 150,000 votes. My guess is that is result in Ohio will be a very narrow Obama win.
Secondly, I read all 263 pages of the 'trooper-gate' report. The two major conclusions that I made were things we already knew. Sarah Palin doesn't understand the responsibilities of holding a politcal office and that Todd Palin is a complete tool.
Lastly, the Lewis comments and their fallout will die down when the lousy economic news dominates the news cycles next week.
This is great for Obama, it energizes Obama's base to see McCain as a racist or race-baiter. McCAin looks really bad bringing this up as the longer the story plays that he is inciting violence in his base, then the better that is for Obama as it also turns independents and right minded true conservative against McCain.
Nate is wrong (it happens, even to geniuses) and the Obama campaign has responded perfectly, yet again.
This is just another minor sideshow.
Invoking race is bad for Obama only when we can afford the luxury. The reason the polls have turned around so much in Obama's favor is that racism is a luxury people can no longer afford. They're afraid of losing their jobs and their homes.
Majorities will continue to be solidly for Obama unless McCain came somehow disprove his "erratic" stereotype and offer some kind of convincingly comprehensive economic policy. Even then, people still might not trust a Republican to take care of them in a Depression.
In other words, this isn't going to be much of a game changer.
Anyone else bothered by the "acceptable" racism against Arabs and Muslims? McCain countered the "he's an Arab" with "No, no, no, he's a decent family man." Why the hell is that okay?
The word belonged to the woman, not to McCain. These people at his rallies are very ugly inside. She didn't mean "he is a gentleman of Arabic extraction." McCain heard what she meant and responded appropriately.
I actually don't quite know what McCain is upto here. I think criticising Lewis is a really bad move essentially because it draws attention to the debate. McCain's crowds have been out of control the last couple of days, McCain himself knows that. McCain himself has injected some level of hatred into the campaign by pointing a jutting finger at Obama and saying 'that one' in a snarky voice. This campaign is different, partly because one of the candidates is of a race that means he would not have been able to vote in many places in the union 50 years ago, and at the time of his birth his parents would not have been able to marry in many states. There is nothing wrong with admitting that. What the campaign needs, on both sides, is a level of temperance. Its my view that Obama has largely been temperate. McCain in the last week has not been, and that intemperance can cause social problems in the US that lead to disproportionate violence. Lewis spoke the truth, Ifear this might be one of those examples of truth hurting, and McCain chose to take the hurt out on a proud and dignified man.
one$earned said...
If you couldn't answer the question, you could have simply not responded at all.
i'll remember that
I agree with Nate on this one, and how the Obama campaign has handled it. It basically corners McCain and Palin into being very careful of how they talk about Obama now. In fact, she has already moved on to the abortion card. Something that will also please the conservative base, but in a much more controlled way. It's like an extreme chess match at this point!
next debate is on the 15th "economy"
Agree with Thomas Neyman.
This is a side show that shouldn't have occurred. It is what it is... and Obama should continue to stay focused on the issues and his message.
I think if John Lewis is going to invoke Wallace, which he hardly ever does, we'd be wise to take him seriously.
If anyone knows the danger of this sort of thing, it's Lewis.
I think Obama should take a stand and back Lewis' statement.
I personally think it would be a reach to peg mccain's 'decent family guy' comment as anything but an unfortunate way of responding.
Imagine his position, he is there listening to this woman spew what is obviously racist crap, this isn't something he's planned and he is just wanting her to STFU.
I'm not sure who McCain is anymore. I used to like the guy. But I really don't think he is a racist.
And I'm not saying that people of Arab descent have to just take it either. He should probably issue an apology of some sort but I really wouldn't read too much into that.
I agree wit how Obama handled this one...he did NOT repudiate Lewis.
Obama would have looked like someone who would say anything to win had he repudiated this civil rights icon.
One more poll finding (a rare bit of good news for the Repubs):
McCain 53, Obama 40 in NE-2
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/10/10/83251/646
Maybe I'm overreacting, but I would have liked to see some kind of a clearer, stronger repudiation from Obama, if for no other reason than to show some clear leadership. IMO, neither of these candidates have shown that. McCain has let his campaign run amock. And Obama, rather than make even one declarative statement that takes risk but shows leadership, is content to play the four-corners defense at a grave time in this nation's history.
Given the state of the economy and the party of the current president, that may be enough to get Obama the presidency, and maybe our country will be better for that. I just wish Obama would give me a real reason to vote for him, and not just to NOT vote for McCain.
why should Obama repudiate Lewis's comments ?
only IF Lewis was a surrogate speaking FOR Obama should he even comment
otherwise, what happenned to free speech ?
repudiating it is like Bush & Cheney taking away our hard won civil liberites
OK to disagree & maybe keep a short arm's length on the Wallace part - but embrace his right to speak his mind since no one better than Lewis knows of what he speaks truth to !!!
George Bush drove millions of sane people from the Republican Party.
Sarah Palin will drive millions of sane people from the Evangelical Movement.
People know Crazy when they see it.
Really, the Obama response is masterful: repudiating only the connection to Wallace, but more importantly bringing up the fact that McCain himself spoke out against some of this hateful rhetoric only yesterday.
The statement can more or less be understood to say "Hey, we don't think McCain is a hate-filled segregationist, but things did get a little out of hand lately, as McCain himself even noted. Anyway, the country's in crisis and talking smack about each other isn't really going to solve that, so let's get back to the issues."
Seriously -- masterful.
kellysirkus said...
George Bush drove millions of sane people from the Republican Party.
Sarah Palin will drive millions of sane people from the Evangelical Movement.
There are sane people in the Evangelical movement? Don't you find glossolalia and snake handling to be more than bizarre. Like insane?
@STepper: to me the really curious thing about the Palin findings is that the Alaska legislature apparently lacks impeachment power -- of if it does then it can't impeach for "abuse of power" (nor can U.S. Congress -- though the meaning of "high crimes and misdemeanors" needs to be put into historical context, and this kind of abuse might qualify).
And by declaring the firing "not illegal," though influenced by factors that were improper, they are basically taking the further process out of the legal realm, and even (do you agree) out of the realm of civil action.
That would leave, perhaps, "recall" as an option if that's in the AK constitution.
nate,
I think your youth is showing here and I disagree with you on this one. Bo has to and shouldn't repudiate any of this. He should just continue on as he has been throughout the campaign.
I went to a high school where blacks and whites were beaten and killed because of their race. I stood on a balcony and watched Miami burn. I was beaten for having long hair and "looking like Jesus" - an irony I never understood.
Rep. Lewis knows what this feels like and called it for what it was. He did the honorable thing!
As one man, he is doing what is in his power to stop a dangerous slide for the country he loves.
McCain should go for a walk in the desert and return when he finds his humility and honor. Palin should just go back to AK and never return.
daniel said...
One more poll finding (a rare bit of good news for the Repubs):
McCain 53, Obama 40 in NE-2
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/10/10/83251/646
YES !! :-)
As a white person who grew up in the South during Wallace's heyday, I concur with Lewis in finding the tone being stirred up by the McCain/Palin very frightening. It brings visions to my mind of racists home tuning up their rifles or getting out their baseball bats. In fact, if the Secret Service hasn't already told McCain to tone it down, they should have. If anything happens to Obama anytime soon, the McCain campaign should be held partly accountable for inciting such a racist atmosphere.
Just a couple of days ago I emailed some friends wondering if Palin was channeling Wallace... not so much about race, but the harping and rabble-rousing of the mob.
Then both Cindy and John McCain joined in... increasing the volume.
The attempt to back-step from the angry mob is simply a move on McCain's part to distance himself from its outcome, whatever (and you can be sure that his campaign has extrapolated potential outcomes) that may be.
More fakery and dishonorable actions on McCain's part, imo.
John McCain can TRY to claim no part of the lynch mobs he's created, but America KNOWS better. We've seen it before.
So no, it's not exactly about race -- it's just about invoking the meme of "otherness" in terms of "patriotism" and "risk" and "country first" that seems so familiar from history -- be it Wallace, Long... or Hitler.
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
And that is the game plan of John McCain. But the quote? Hermann Göring, of course.
So yes, I agree with Lewis, Nate, though I love your site and I understand that Senator Obama will be true to his nature, which is that of the pragmatic statesman. He cannot be seen as infuriated even if he were.
But I have no need to be so calm. I DO think McCain has unleashed the hounds in the form of the pitbull Palin. She channels the worst of mens' natures. We might as well break out the sharpie and scribble that black mustache on her...
oh, wait. She already HAS one. Seen the cover of Newsweek, anyone?
I'm voting for the smart, top-of-his-class, calm, collected, steady, diplomatic one.
THAT ONE.
(not you, John)
Nate,
Yours sounds better than Bill Burton's. Both are good but I can hear Sen. Obama saying your words. :)
McCain is a coward. He was afraid of choosing his friend Lieberman because he wanted the conservatives to support him.
So he instead chose the vindictive Palin, whose main skills rival those of any rabble rouser at a Kentucky KKK rally.
Josh, what did Lewis say that you consider inappropriate? Many of the comments here come down to "McCain is not Wallace," which is true, but McCain's voters may be Wallace's voters. And so Lewis is calling McCain out, reminding him that he needs to act like a leader.
Obama might be genuinely worried, too. Being the US President is a dangerous job on the best of days.
I wonder how much of this is John Lewis carrying some sort of grudge against McCain for his saddlebakc answer. I've no idea what sort of relationship Lewis and McCain have ever had, but I wouldn't imagine Lewis as a close confidant of McCain's. Maybe he has been waiting for a moment to knife McCain for that? (If thats true, then contrary to most peoples thoughts at the time, the Saddleback thing may have been the time when the election started to get away from McCain, the $5 million dollar remark, upsetting Lewis, throwing in his lot with the religious right, in a way all have left us where we are right now). McCain's response to Lewis is fascinating, precisely because its not the kind of statement you make about a close friend. It shows McCain not just as someone happy to rabble rouse, and undies a lot of the good work McCain had done by trying to calm his baying mob, but makes McCain seem like a glib pol who will say anything and do anything to get votes and it makes him seem so far away from his 2000 'straight talk express' persona, that one image of him almost HAS to be false.
I can't wait for McPalin to tell us it's not about race, it's about states' rights.
@Juris
I don't know the intricacies of Alaska law (and never will). The report was carefully constructed to protect Alaska from a wrongful discharge lawsuit but get enough votes to get it released. (As it turned out, all of the legislators voted for it. The didn't have to approve it, but people will think they did. Pretty neat.)
Palin's primary misconduct, according to the report, was in not controlling the loose cannons in her administation including that new constitutional office known as the "First Dude." So, judgment will be exacted by the people of Alaska (the "Joe and Joanne six packs," I suppose Palin would say).
I suspect that a constitutional officer in Alaska can be removed if convicted of a crime, and the report neatly threaded that needle. I doubt, based on the information in the report, that a conviction could be had.
What is really telling is that Palin doesn't understand that an office is a "puboic trust." For example, you run a transparent administration (which was her campaign theme.) Your e-mails are all subject to puboic scrutiny, and you don't secretly get a Yahoo e-mail account to avoid that scrutiny. But Palin did. And you don't take phony per diem payments for living in your house, or for transportation to and from work. And you do the patriotic thing and pay your taxes on taxable perks.
Bottom line is that Sarah Palin doesn't get it. She is a shallow, callow, hypocritical bible-thumping pit bull with lipstick. Except for the lipstick just like George Bush.
Sister Souljah???
Nate, John Lewis is no Sister Souljah.
Besides, that, Lewis agonized this spring about changing his allegiance from Clinton to Obama, at some cost to his reputation.
You're young (forgive me for mentioning it) and although I know you know John Lewis' history, you don't seem to fully appreciate what a lion he is to many of us who lived through his sacrifices. He's on my list of most respected Americans, too.
It's Obama who would have walked into a trap if he'd repudiated Lewis. (What?? He repudiated John Lewis and pals around with Bill Ayers??)
How many of you remember what the Wallace for President campaign was like? I was 16, and just active enough to have met Bobby Kennedy. I remember it well. Wallace played the same song of innuendo then, while Nixon played a more subtle version of the same tune to avoid alienating moderate Rockefeller and Romney Republicans.
Nate was -10 years old.
Obama was 7, in elementary school.
McCain was 32, in the Hanoi Hilton.
They can't get it, but John Lewis was 28, and in the cross hairs working for SNCC. I think Lewis has a better idea exactly what sort of rhetoric was used to inflame a lynch mob back in the day. He never impugned McCain's character; he warned him that he was playing with fire.
As I posted yesterday, I also think that McCain figured that out for himself on Thursday. I think that is where the video came from where I saw him react as if gut punched to a scurrilous shout from the crowd. The next day he started to tone it down, and it was the audience that acted as if it had been gut punched. I think McCain - if not the McCain campaign - had already gotten the message Lewis was sending.
If I was crafting a response, I would say that it should have obvious that Lewis was not attacking the character of the John McCain that spoke Friday, he was addressing those members of the McCain-Palin campaign who were responsible for the rhetoric and outright lies that made it necessary for McCain to step forward and defend the patriotism of Barack Obama. Those people were, indeed, playing with fire. We hope that John McCain's actions on Friday will signal a debate on the issues, like we had Tuesday.
Unfortunately, we didn't see that in West Virginia today.
@STepper: following up on my previous comment, AK legislature does have impeachment power, in Art. 2, § 20. Impeachment
"All civil officers of the State are subject to impeachment by the legislature. Impeachment shall originate in the senate and must be approved by a two-thirds vote of its members. The motion for impeachment shall list fully the basis for the proceeding. Trial on impeachment shall be conducted by the house of representatives. A supreme court justice designated by the court shall preside at the trial. Concurrence of two-thirds of the members of the house is required for a judgment of impeachment. The judgment may not extend beyond removal from office, but shall not prevent proceedings in the courts on the same or related charges."
However, I can't find the allowed grounds for impeachment and conviction -- nothing in Article 1 about removal from office. It may be hiding somewhere else.
@STepper
She is not like Bush - more like Cheney.
I dunno about the tactics of it all but it wouldn't sit well with me to "repudiate" John Lewis when I have to open the news every day to some latest horror from the GOP camp.
Besides which, magnanimity from Obama is regularly characterized as pusillanimity by the press and betrayal by the base. Is a "Sister Souljah moment" - and, christ, should that really even be considered a good thing by political idealists - really even more than a wash when laid next to that?
I think the worst thing about McCain in the last week, is either he is plain stupid, or he knows exactly what he ahs been doing, channeling the fear of Obama, caused by his name, looks and unfamiliarity, to try to gain political support. McCain may not be racist, but he hasn't been above channeling other peoples fears and attitudes to gain support. He should be ashamed, and I think the hurt of being called out on it is partly caused by him being ashamed.
The Great White Hope - John McCain will hit his stride this week.
Stride, indeed. He might hit his head on the lid to his coffin, maybe. How many nails does that thing need?
What on earth is white hope supposed to be, anyway? Hoping the endless stream of people who have pointed out your ignorance all your life were wrong after all? Hoping all the people who aren't white enough will all decide to get on a boat and sail away?
Guys,
Unless you know what went on with George Wallace, etc. don't be calling out Nate about John Lewis. John Lewis absolutely DID go overboard by comparing McCain's rhetoric to George Wallace. Does. Not.Compare Read up on that history and THEN comment.
The only open question was whether or not John Lewis did it on his own or was asked to say something. My honest guess was that he did it on his own. Either way, score the Saturday round +1 for the Obama Team.
I made this comment a few days ago. If any of you have been around incitement then you recognize it when you see it. This past week has been outright incitement. I worked as a journalist in Israel the months before the Rabin Assassination and this past week reminded me very much of that time. So Lewis is doing what he thinks is required to keep things from going over the brink. If there were more grown ups in the Republican party and the media eh would not have to do it. But someone had to. And the whole show yesterday by McCain--too little, too late. You see his whole reject and condemn comment today and you see what he really thinks.
i just hate to rock the boat.
no distractions, mccain NEEDS disatractions
mc9cain: You're right...it does.not.compare. What Palin is doing is worse because she smiles, winks and tosses her pretty hair. She doesn't come off quite as revoltingly as Wallace did, at least not to a certain faction. That's what makes her statements MORE inflammatory than Wallace. And don't presume we don't know history. Our conclusions are based on the same facts as yours.
mc9cain, here is what Lewis said about Wallace:
"he created the climate and the conditions that encouraged vicious attacks against innocent Americans"
It is totally legitimate to claim McCain is doing this.
Everyone is making way too much about this issue. First of all, this statement will only make news in GA, this is a Saturday. Second of all, I think Obama's response was right on. John Lewis is a congressman (no surrogate) and can say what he likes, and his statements echos what a lot of people are thinking. Obama can distance himself from it, but the statement will rile some folks up and get them to vote.
Third, most people don't even know who John Lewis is, he isn't that well known outside the black community, this statement won't have that much impact either way.
@Juris - She won't be impeached. But she will have little power or public support once she finishes this fiasco of a campaign. If there are no grounds for impeachment in the constitution, then following Scalia's analytic precepts, we don't look de hors the document for the "intent" of the "framers" -- and anything goes!
@Ca Hawkeye - She is not like Cheney. His IQ has to be above room termperature. Hers is about the room temperature inside an igloo. While Cheney is smart, he became paranoid when he heard that Flight 93 was on the way. And he is devious. Palin is a stoopid hick.
I am not surprised to a see an uptick in McCain's numbers. Negativity works. I am also not as offended as others by it. It is standard stuff for the trailing candidate. Their are great people and not-so-great people in both parties. Welcome to democracy!
I predict a close race. Here is why I think so. Please don't be offended by the matter-of-fact tone.
The Republicans did the race smear early, which was smart. The crazies are in their pocket and definately charged up to vote. Everyone else's disdain for McCain will have cooled by election day. In fact, McCain may be remembered as being the pacifier.
I expect the next card for the republicans to play is the pro-life/supreme court Catholic guilt. It will be a get-out-the-vote strategy. And (I hate to say it) some people will fall back into line. It will be effective.
It all comes down (in my opinion) to how well Obama plays with a lead. The half hour buys on national television are encouraging. But I am not feeling all that positive for him. Kerry fizzled in 2004. Obama needs something new. I dunno what it could be . . .
I like Obama's answer, and here's why:
My instinctive thought was that Obama would take the high road and redirect the campaign to the fundemental issues. If he were to do that, the Lewis issue would quickly fade out of the news cycle.
With Obama's controversial answer, the Lewis issue evokes more intrigue and keeps it in the press for a couple extra days. Its presence in the news cycle can strongly deflect and pre-empt negative campaigning by the McCain camp over the next week.
It also paints a light brush over the developing Rezko narrative, which seems to be their next strategic step. There are 24 days left and if this story buys 2 extra days of news-cycle coverage, they are that much closer to closing on their lead.
@stepper - you are absolutely correct on the IQ issue. I equate them on the dark side issues.
Aren't we pulling the pieces a move too soon? The fallout of Lewis's comments is that in lieu of discussing Palin's ethical violations, questionable integrity, and the Troopergate report, we'll be having a vacuous debate about "the race card" and how deplorable and / or hyperbolic the comparison between McCain and Wallace is. Moreover, the McCain camp has the often persuasive (if purely fallacious) move, to wit: Lewis thinks I've sinned and that I'm Wallace. I'm not George Wallace. Therefore, I've not sinned. Unfortunate.
Its actually quite sad watching McCain's campaign degenerate in the way it has.
The McCain campaign has upped the ante, expanding the typical "Presidential" and "Attack dog" roles to something like "good cop/bad cop". She ignites radical-right-rage (and seems to wholly enjoy the role), but McCain isn't doing well enough at playing the "good cop" to reach Independents and the Undecided. EVERYone is still focused on the "bad cop". Most normal Republicans (yes there are some still!) I know who aren't voting for McCain are voting AGAINST Palin.
PeteKent
Do you miss the old Hillaryis44 site?
It misses you and you short and sweet posts not your phoney diatribes mate...
http://www.hillaryis44.org/?p=444
meeeeeow big cat!
@mark - correct, but BO can't control external events. So his path is to stay focused on the economy, etc and let the rest do what they will. Moreover, I think there is very little room for McCain to take a high road. You reep what you sow.
Frank Rich and Maureen Dowd are in the NY Times tomorrow with op-eds essentially saying McCain's rhetoric could lead to Obama's killing. This story is far from over, and the onus isn't on Obama to do anything about it.
Rep. Lewis is right. This is dangerous rhetoric and the McCain campaign has been using race by invoking "otherness" to ignite emotions of fear and disdain in their desperate attempt to reverse the polling trends.
I think people too young to remember the racial violence and political riots of the 60's don't realize that it can happen now. People in groups can easily lose their sense of individual responsibility and be pushed to extreme behavior.
Lewis' warning is appropriate.
I think it is important to keep in mind that the world is at this moment in the midst of a financial meltdown. This is what the headlines will say on Monday and the meeting this weekend did not provide enough specifics to boost confidence. This week could be more volatile and crazy in the economy than last week. This is the only external event that will drive the narrative.
Rich Merritt and Loralee,
Fair enough. My comments were not meant at all readers here but at a few posts I saw where their commentary was "I don't know about George Wallace BUT..."
Perhaps I think it might have been a day late for John Lewis when McCain did do his job on three different occasions in MN yesterday which was commendable. However, McCain does need to still reign in Ms. Ethics Violator.
@ic170
PeteKent is a PUMA?
@Sim: I agree, the McCainanites seems to have lined up a series of attacks on Obama, probably in expectation that the cumulative effect would be a knockout: risky on national security ("talks to our enemies" -- that one failed), soft on terrorism (failing), Chicago politician (Rezko fits into that and is also unlikely to work).
What the McCainanites didn't count on is that all of these personal attacks, while certainly part of their long-term plan, have only reflected back on their own misplaced priorities. "Going personal" during such a period of economic calamity just can't get traction.
Not to mention, as others have mentioned, Obama has handled all of this stuff pretty darn smartly.
@antmatic - I hope they do. It has been the 800 lb gorilla, even more than McCain's age. It is the darkest fear of many of us.
mark, I don't think the media will be able to diminish this as "the race card" given the total ugliness which has been popping up.
And livemind, maybe we need to be "distracted" once in awhile into noticing the racism that still exists here. Many moderate whites have convinced themselves that it's all ancient history, and clearly, it's not.
The interesting thing about this is how we are beginning to see that racism against blacks is taboo, but against "Arabs" is not. Maybe the public will begin to think about the contradiction there? Am I too much an idealist?
I think Obama's response is highly intelligent. Siding with Lewis over McCain's comments, pointing out that McCain himself did the same thing y/day, but emphasising that McCain is not Wallace. He needn't make another comment on the issue. McCain can either continue a squabble with a dignified leader of his community, or not talk about this comment at all again.
man can you imagine it, an intelligent President of the USA?
@loralee - maybe you are, but keep on dreamin'. We love ya for it.
this is where a true 'CHRISTIAN" would stepup & offer his pastorsal advice...
Since John McCain profferred to Rick Warren at the Saddleback roundup that one of the 3 people in the entire world that he would seek for advice was this same John Lewis [for whatever contrived reason] - it would now behoove pastor Rick to remind John McCain of WWJD
strangely, pastor Rick is silent...
likewise both Obama & Lewis should strongly remind John McCain & the entire country of Mac's own words at Saddleback
John McCain - you said you would seek advice from John Lewis. now he is offerring you his sage & measured advice - yet you not only refuse it, you throw it back in his face in a most vicious, twisted, nasty, race-baiting manner
HAVE YOU NO SHAME, JOHN Mccain ???
some man of honor & definintely no man of his word...
call him on the carpet as the ultimate hypocrite - use his own words from Saddleback !!!
@ erstwhiler, said...predict a close race. Here is why I think so. Please don't be offended by the matter-of-fact tone.
The Republicans did the race smear early, which was smart. The crazies are in their pocket and definately charged up to vote. Everyone else's disdain for McCain will have cooled by election day. In fact, McCain may be remembered as being the pacifier.
I expect the next card for the republicans to play is the pro-life/supreme court Catholic guilt. It will be a get-out-the-vote strategy. And (I hate to say it) some people will fall back into line. It will be effective.
So true! The Republicans have not folded, they are in it to win, not show. The show position is most likely.
Every play on the laminated play list is available and they will use them all to either reduce Obama's numbers.
If we really thought it was over we wouldn't be so concerned with the polls any longer. Somehow we get our fix (most of us) of polling data several times a day. Why, because we don't really know the outcome or what event, action, statement or misstep will effect the polls.
@dcm in fl - interesting tack and great commentary on Warren. Imagine that, he's a hypocrite.
"When did this site turn into the DailyKos? You all tear apart any conservative poster on here, but ignore the idiotic posts made by liberals. I mean, i'm an Obama supporter, and it's driving me mad."
What does DK have to do with your incomprehensible scribblings? It is not that people agree or disagree, it is that no one can understand it!
HAWKEYE
yeah, imagine that about the good pastor
wonder if he will appear on Larry King to defend John Lewis ^ promote his latest book...
WWJD indeed - stay silent ? I think not...
to STepper
aye seems so check the website or Google him - easy peasy!
:)
dcm in fl: awesome.
Wow. I am just amazed that people are actually falling for McCain's strategy as if he was just doing what he is doing out of desperation. Yes, he is desperate and lagging in the polls. But the stoke of genius Rove is being played here.
McCain's camp, even before this economic crisis unfolded was going to make this a cultural strategy.
McCain earlier on had repudiated the idea of injecting Jeremiah Wright, even asking the RNC to stop using footage against down ticket candidates. Then after Obama stated he could understand his pastor being an issue, McCain stated (remember?)that Wright was fair game.
It is shocking and appears desperate that two major candidates are making such claims in public, stoking anger and threats at their own rallies, getting major coverage including supporters suggestions that Obama is Arab, and a terrorist.
Now McCain say's Rev. Wright is off limits again. Say what? The Wright story seems to be more legit as Obama did have an actual proven relationship with him, right?
It seems to me they want to keep the Wright story out of the way because it brings a Christian narrative to the story.
They will be strictly playing the Muslim card in the coming 527's.
Remember the ABC interview with George S.? When Obama gaffed about his faith? I would bet anything it will be in an ad within 1 week.
Question is will Obama be able to defend it?
Then with Obama's huge prime time buy comes Keating.
Just my 2 cents
This last week has been strange. McCain and Palin have been whipping up hate and division, and then cry when called on it.
Even Obama's supporters liked McCain's defense of Obama even though that defense was racist. You want to give McCain positive credit for implying that Arab men are not decent family men? This is surreal.
The difference between Wallace and the McCain campaign is that McCain's and Palin's rhetoric has not lead to someones death....not yet. Is that a difference McCain wants to hang his hat on?
They were potentially inciting violence.
Maybe it wasn't to the level of Wallace but it was Wallace-lite and many Republican leaders publically slapped McCain about it.
McCain should be ashamed for what he has wrought on a country he supposedly loves.
He is not worthy of consideration, let alone a vote.
one$earned said
If we really thought it was over we wouldn't be so concerned with the polls any longer. Somehow we get our fix (most of us) of polling data several times a day. Why, because we don't really know the outcome or what event, action, statement or misstep will effect the polls.
----------------
Actually for me the polls are the only way to keep score- to make sure Obama is still winning. I know whats likely to happen, but still quite pull myself to believe it, expecially, oddly and paradoxically, as Obama pulls away. Like I said before, it comes from being a Red Sox Democrat. Its never over until its over. The ball can always go through Buckner's legs, Bucky Dent, Aaron Boone or whoever else, can always break your heart, and sometimes, even when Carlton Fisk pulls off a miracle its not enough. Knowing that Obama is still well up in the polls is somehow comforting.
My wife and I plus a friend attended a George Wallace rally in KCMO in 1968. WE WERE NOT I REPEAT NOT HIS SUPPORTERS. We were anti war types. Anyway it was so scary that my wife fainted. As we recently watched the news video of the McCain rallies we remarked to one another "that is just like the Wallace crowd we witnessed in 1968". Real scary......... These Mc/P rallies rate high up on the Wallace Doctrine scale.....
I disagree with nate. I am glad John Lewis spoke up. THe media was trying to sweep this under the rug and act as if everything is ok. Chris Matthews on the morning with Joe had the nerve to call this "good politics." It goes to show how backwards some people are about this. McCain was being right, he would of told that nutty woman yesterday that there are good Arab American, Good African American and so forth. Saying Barack is a decent man wasn't enough. The woman has the assumption if you Arab you are evil. And, I believe the woman wanted to call him the N word because she stumbled around to call him something before she stopped at Arab.
@ DCM in FL...
....John McCain - you said you would seek advice from John Lewis. now he is offerring you his sage & measured advice - yet you not only refuse it, you throw it back in his face in a most vicious, twisted, nasty, race-baiting manner...
Point taken except John Lewis should not have used the public forum to give that advice. Politicians are political and John is a politician. Although John's Lewis' statements were for the most part warranted, the way in which it was delivered raises some concerns.
@ic170
If Pete Kent is a PUMA he is one sick f*ck. Maybe it's Hillary pounding away at the keyboard for a few minutes every day in her hotel room.
The Clintons haven't been doing very much, have they? If BO were behind I suspect we'd see a bigger pro forma effort by them on his behalf. To set Hillary up for 2012.
Sad.
Whatever Pete Kent's motives, he (she?) is a blathering gas bag. Not worth the electrons to put his (her) drivel on my screen.
Is Pete Kent the new Real Joe?
@ DCM in FL...
Yea, not sure is he ia a hypocrite or a coward. Probably both. But that would be so shocking in a mulitmillionaire religious leader.
one$earned,
you assume that Lewis and McCain really are confidantes and that Lewis really has the means or desire to offer McCain advice in private. Just because McCain said he would seek advice from Lewis does not mean they are close. I think McCain was being somewhat disengenuous infront of Rick Warren by suggesting that he and Lewis are close.
ONE$
you are wrong IMHO
did John Lewis give McCain his permission to drag him into his campaign as a 'wise' advisor at Saddleback ?
I bet not, but since McCain did use him for his own political reasons in a publicized forum like Saddleback - then Lewis has EVERY logical right to give McCain his wisdom also through the public medium & McCain is a hypocrite to treat it with such contempt & disdain
no other way to rationalize it
now IF this had been Jeese Jackson SR or Jr then it would be a different matter
but McCain established Lewis a a paragon of wise advice - so he needs to deal with it, beatch !!!
@ markymark...
Definitely comforting, I agree. As I said, I visit the site for the latest polling data, the latest comments and of course the daily posts from Nate at least a half dozen times a day.
Why else would I be online at fivethirtyeight at 6:00pm cst after being at the site at 10:30pm last night.
In fact, I end my day online here at fivethirtyeight and begin each morning at fivethirtyeight.
Keeping score is addictive.
looks like some PUMA's are coming back to stir things up...HAHAHAHAHA
its really sad for the PUMA brigade because Obama is winning lot of Hilary voters
tomorrow Bill & Hilary will campaign with Joe & Jill
Ouch !
This story's not on Drudge. I'm not exactly sure how the Republicans can drum up the outrage without simply illustrating the scary ass craziness of those rallies.
BTW what the hell is the McCain campaign thinking about subjecting Palin to Philly sports fans? Are they stupid and insane?
@Uncle Toby
Yes to both questions.
Just want to say that I've spent the last little while refreshing this thread - the comments from those of you who lived through Wallace's presidential bids are especially valued. Also Loralee & LAT.
STepper, I don't know what you have against Hillary, but equating PeteKent's delusional copypasta with her is a strange charge indeed.
MM - Real Joe is the new Real Joe, surely.
And lest we forget and give JM too much credit and understanding - he voted against the MLK holiday multiple times. In recent times, some of the greatest racism I have ever personally seen is in AZ.
I knew the race card would be played. It was unavoidable. However, I wasn’t ready for the real animus that has come to the fore. I believed it would be more subtle and covert. Whether the baiting were plants remains to be seen (we probably will never know), but the result is the same.
There has been and will be for some time to come simmering racial undertones everywhere. In AA and Latino and Native communities, there is still legitimate anger. On the other hand, there is white backlash. I know many who believe that an Obama victory will lead to socialism in this country. To them, socialism is a hairsbreadth from communism. I have to say my experience has been that people in my area fear becoming a minority.
I can’t explain all of this at once. It’s difficult and complicated except for this. A lot of whites distrust blacks and vice versa. Maybe it’s as simple as that. Is the lack of trust legitimate? No. Is it there? Yes. Is it a factor in the election? Sure. Will it make a difference? Yes. Because of his race, Obama will win by a smaller percentage than if he were white.
I fear this: an Obama loss will crush many. Not just minorities, but those, like me, who believe that he actually can do some good. Someone who is different from what we are used to. If there is the barest inkling that there was subterfuge or cheating in the election, this country may not recover for a long time. Would I stand in the street of my right-wing town and protest? That depends on how angry I am.
McCain’s and Palin’s willingness to let this go on is beyond dangerous. The match is always lit in this country. It takes only a few seconds to light the fuse.
Nate, I think you're overparsing the whole thing. Obama doesn't have to say anything, even though he just did, overgenerously, I think. McCain has quite simply, as someone else said, crossed a Rubicon with his rallies. He is the one who needs to be backpedaling, and to suggest Obama has any backpedaling to do is beyond the pale.
"Wow. I am just amazed that people are actually falling for McCain's strategy as if he was just doing what he is doing out of desperation. Yes, he is desperate and lagging in the polls. But the stoke of genius Rove is being played here."
The polls clearly show that no one is falling for McCain's strategy.
Making your opponent's character the issue when people's retirement savings are vanishing might be Rovian, but its not genius.
By the way, the reason its not working is because a majority of people actually prefer Obama's character and values to McCain's.
You see, one of the things I love about Obama is that the doesn't threw people overboard for political gain. The "Sister Soujah" moment was typical Clinton--sacrifice your ideology for short-term political gain.
Lewis was overall right. His George Wallace reference was over the top, but I'm tired of Republicans saying whatever they want and being admired for it and Democrats being afraid to say "boo" to a goose. McCain/Palin's rallies have been disgusting and hate-mongering.
Don't tell Obama to toss aside political allies so that he can win a race that he has nearly won already. Obama's statement was absolutely correct, and just like Obama, balanced and well thought out.
Nate is a great statistician, but political strategy is just not his thing.
STepper,
I think that's hilarious if PeteKent is a PUMA. But you're wrong about Hillary. She was out yesterday campaigning in Arkansas for Obama.
http://www.arkansasnews.com/archive/2008/10/02/News/348285.html
people, it is the same thing with McCain & Petraeus
Mac always speaks of the General as if he has been ordained by god & his word is scripture [analogy]
But again this week, Petraeus's words betray those that Mccain claims support his position in Afghanistan. Petraeus again is more closely aligned with Obama FWIW
wonder why Mac does not go off on Petraeus who is also one of his Sage advisors... who bit him in the butt !!!
same with his good buddy, GW Bush who keeps hobbling Mac's campaign with his endless supply of egregious ineptitudes... [channeling Agnew now]
but it is OK today for Mac to go off on the black guy with even more of his race-baiting...
WWJD - hhhmmm
To be clear, I am no fan of Rove. But, he must be respected for understanding both strategy and tactics. Character assasination is only one piece of tactics. Schmidt only knows tactics, and a limited few - no strategy. That has been clear in this campaign and will be part of the post-campaign story, when it is finally told.
Obama is forced by campaign ettique to lie and say that McCain is "an honorable man" who has "denounced" the hate mongers.
He's no such thing. He's a lying swindling desperate bastard who would walk over his mother's grave to get elected. He doesn't repudiate ONE SINGLE THING that would get him elected. Nothing!
In his heart of hearts he thinks it's just "unfair" (and unprintable) to be the first white man to lose a Presidential election to a NEGRO, but he would never go so far as to say it.
He realizes that the rabid racists and xenophobes who are the core constituency of the Republican party need to be stoked up so they'll go all out and get all their racist friends to work for an vote for McCain/Palin.
Thus, he has to walk a tightrope. He can't go TOO far himself and call Obama a "socialist coon!" or the media will destroy him. He can smile if one of his little hate-bots gets caught on video screaming "kill him" and that bit unfortunately gets played up on the national news, instead of swept under the rug as it normally would be.
But, he can't "repudiate" his core supporters who HATE Obama, not because of anything he's done (what really has he done to piss them off?), but because, in the words of one Republican to me "if Obama wins, all the Blacks and Mexicans will be on welfare."
Another day, another dance in hypocrisy. McCain "demands" Obama "repudiate" this "slur" on his honor. Of course, McCain said absolutely nothing when members of his audience screamed "traitor!"
That's perfectly ok. Unless somehow Katie Couric winds up talking about it and David Gergen is going on Sunday talk shows to denounce you. (Although Steve Schmidt has what he calls the "Gergen rule" which is to listen to whatever Gergen has to say and then do the opposite, so I suppose he'll now crank up the attacks some more).
Then, if somehow the Republican base gets exposed as a bunch of violent racist scumbags, then obviously the thing to do is to blame Obama.
Because denouncing said scumbags is "impugning my honor." As if he has any honor.
He's been a lying whore since 2003 when he decided he wanted the Republican nomination. As the Rude Pundit www.rudepundit.com will no doubt be saying tomorrow, after you've given blow jobs to every faction of the right-wing for 1500 straight days in a desperate attempt to buy their tolerance, today is no time to start saying "what kind of girl do you think I am?"
That one was decided a long time ago, John. You have no honor left. Just shut up.
Got it?
Before we make a choice we may regret for the next four years, the accusations against Barack Obama should be carefully considered, as they are here.
Again McCain is making much ado about nothing. Somethig his campaign always seems to do whenever bad news comes down the wire. This time it's the troopergate report, and now he's faking outrage in order to distract people's attention from troopergate. Lewis did nothing but call McCain's campaign out for what exactly they have been doing this past week. If the shoe fits-wear it. I have been concerned abotu theconsequences of what mcCain's campaign has been doing since I saw the video of McCain's speech in New Mexico Monday, when he asked "Who is Barrack Obama?" and someone in the audience yelled out "A terrorist!". McCain can not pretend he didn't hear it, because it was evident by the way he paused and was momentarily taken back by the comment he heard it, but yet said absolutely nothing to the idiot. I saw right then, if this keep sup, some nut is going to take their rhetoric seriously, and act out in a violent way. That exactly what happens with Pro Life groups, and we can see it happening the way they are demonizing Obama.
McCain wasn't offended when that guy yelle dout Terrosits, but apparently he was finally offended yesterday when an old lady said he was an Arab. He only then decided to try and calm the situartion down when he took a look at the polls and saw that his negatives were skyrocketing this week. If he truly meant what he said, the nwe can expect him and the RNC to pull all those ads trying to link Obama to Bill Ayers.
Fair or not, if McCain doesn't do something soon, he is going to be portrayed as a Wallace-type candidate in US history. It now looks like America is going to see it's first black president, and there's widely-circulating footage of people yelling "kill him" and "treason" and McCain not saying anything. Fair or not, he _is_ playing with fire, and I think his place in US history is in a LOT of danger
Perfectly written Nate. Shows that you arent *just* a stats guy. Smart all the way around.
Oh and hot. Have I mentioned that today?
The McCain campaign is forced to reject remarks coming from pastor Arnold Conrad’s invocation before McCain’s speech in Davenport, Iowa Sunday.
Comes after Conrad says: “I also would also pray, Lord, that your reputation is involved in all that happens between now and November, because there are millions of people around this world praying to their god–whether it’s Hindu, Buddha, Allah–that his opponent wins, for a variety of reasons.”
good thing i left
its not just Obama's race & muslims
now its also about Hindu's, Buddhist's & other believers
i will pray for the McCain campaign today
everybody please pray for them
stop this hate !
Awwww, it's so nice to see little Pete Kent poke his head into the room with a new copy-and-paste. Keep up the good work, Pete! Someday you'll work your way up to typing your own text, like a big boy!
Now, back to the matter at hand ...
(Apologies in advance if someone beat me to this -- I only skimmed past the first couple dozen comments!)
I think Obama's response actually did almost precisely what Nate wanted it to do, just in an even more subtle manner. Let's parse this:
Senator Obama does not believe that John McCain or his policy criticism is in any way comparable to George Wallace or his segregationist policies.
Right there: That's the repudiation that Nate was looking for, just by pointing out that the analogy was over the top. (McCain is most certainly not shouting "Segregation forever!" on stage.)
Even better, this repudiation targets the specific part that is objectionable: The choice of analogy, not the point that Lewis was making.
But John Lewis was right to condemn some of the hateful rhetoric that John McCain himself personally rebuked just last night...
Right there. Obama neutralizes McCain's objection statement by pointing out that McCain himself had personally repudiated the same hateful rhetoric, in person, last night.
He also deftly refocuses the topic on the rhetoric as opposed to McCain himself or the "hardworking Americans" that McCain would like to pretend that the argument is about.
... as well as the baseless and profoundly irresponsible charges from his own running mate that the Democratic nominee for President of the United States ‘pals around with terrorists.’
And then points out that her assertions are of the same kind as the hateful rhetoric that John McCain himself just repudiated last night.
In doing so, he underscores the fact that Palin is not only out of sync with her own candidate, but he simultaneously reinforces the statement made by Republican Rep. Ray LaHood yesterday that her behavior "doesn't befit the office that she's running for."
So now he's turned it around on McCain -- he's boxed in to where he either has to (1) repudiate his own running mate for the same things that he admonished that crowd for yesterday, (2)flip-flop and decide to retract that repudiation to side with Palin, or (3) try to define his way out of it.
This last option is the most dangerous for McCain -- it's a "It depends on what your definition of 'is' is" trap, and it would look very, very flimsy to try to draw the tissue-thin line between saying "he pals around with terrorists" and the fact that McCain's supporters -- surprise -- start to act scared about a "terrorist" being elected president, that somehow the second doesn't logically follow from the first.
As Barack Obama has said himself, the last thing we need from either party is the kind of angry, divisive rhetoric that tears us apart at a time of crisis when we desperately need to come together. That is the kind of campaign Senator Obama will continue to run in the weeks ahead.
As Nate predicted, Obama has his "I agree with Sen. McCain" moment here by underscoring his opposition to this divisive rhetoric, regardless of where it comes from.
He doesn't quite do what Nate said about pulling attention back to the issues per se, but by pointing out how this is "a time of crisis when we desperately need to come together," he reminds the listener the recent McCain campaign rhetoric not only distracts from finding solutions to the current crisis, it actively undermines these solutions.
So, in my opinion, Nate's prediction was spot-on ... Obama just managed to put 10 points of smooth into a 5 pound bag, and McCain has now completely painted himself into a corner.
Lets recall what John Lewis actually said:
"George Wallace never threw a bomb," Lewis noted. "He never fired a gun, but he created the climate and the conditions that encouraged vicious attacks against innocent Americans who were simply trying to exercise their constitutional rights. Because of this atmosphere of hate, four little girls were killed on Sunday morning when a church was bombed in Birmingham, Alabama."
I don't know whether Wallace's rhetoric was equal or worse than McCain's and especially Palin's.
But Palin and McCain have incited hatred and violence. They've turned their supporter rallies into wild mobs.
That's why many of us greatly fear for Obama's safety and are afraid Muslims, Arabs or blacks might be attacked.
This is not a game. This is hurting America. People are afraid!
---
As for McCain's "no maam, he's not an Arab. He's a decent family man...", well, until he apologises to Arabs and clarifies that statement I have to consider that a continuation of their racist hate-speech. After all, he's condoning anti-Arab hatespeech if he remains silent on this.
It's scandalous that the media doesn't make this AT ALL an issue.
Alas, in the America of today, hating on Muslims and Arabs just isn't castigated the way it ought to.
In any case, McCain has shown this week that he has no sense of decency or any shred of honour left. My contempt for him has no bounds.
Lets remember: He has STILL not adressed the KILL HIM! stuff out there. He just came up with a weak sauce soft rebuke in one or two of these cases. And he's in fact defending his mobs as "regular hard-working Americans".
He hasn't even tried to stop this for good. He just came up with the weakest rebuffal imaginable so as to receive less flak from the wider public.
He's STILL trying to benefit from, as the McCain campaign put it, "the ferocity and anger" of his supporters. Look at the press releases, they're basically praising the mob mentality.
No, sorry, McCain simply is utterly beyond the pale. He makes the late Haider look like a cafe-latte liberal.
Utterly reprehensible.
Hillary -- Please accept my apologies for posting that you weren't campaigning enough for BO. And for claiming you were Pete Kent.
I have much to atone for.
Damn. Yom Kippur isn't for another 364 days!
boulder-liberal Have you seen the ABC interview?
As for Nate's advice regarding castigating John Lewis, well, my regard for Obama would take a real hit were he to display such moral cowardice.
Fortunately, it's not going to happen. They'll stick to Bill Burton's nuanced position (though I think they're being way to kind to McCain - but I don't fault them for that. They don't want to escalate things. Sometimes we normal citizens can speak our minds more clearly than a campaign can.)
The point that is being missed here is that McCain is the victim of his own message.
The idea of the smear campaign was to create doubts in the minds of swing voters. Nobody was really supposed to believe that Obama was a terrorist, a Muslim, or that he hates America. It was all about instilling enough doubt in Obama to make swing voters more receptive to the "safe" McCain.
Instead, nobody bit on the hook except for the base, which would believe nearly anything the leadership told them. These smears were repeated for months, since it was inconceivable that the general public would fail to be swayed by them.
Th end result is that the base turned rabid at the prospect of an ostensibly corrupt, America-hating, Marxist, Muslim, terrorist-supporting President. They have no idea that this wasn't for "base consumption", and they've gone off the deep end.
Too many "reliable" sources on the Right have embraced these smears now for the Republicans to say that it was "all in good fun". They can't turn off the faucet of hate, and the further behind McCain gets, the more the base wants that faucet opened up all the way instead of shut off. McCain, the Great Leader, can't even call the tune at his own rallies anymore.
Counter-demonstrating at McCain or Palin rallies just got extremely dangerous.
Further, since the base lives in an artificial bubble world, they have no idea how the rest of the country is reacting to their behaviour.
It's not about race. But it is about hatred. The base really believes this stuff, which they never were supposed to do. And now McCain is at the mercy of the mob he helped create with no control over the message.
McCain and Mooseburger have been race baiting all week and their campaign rallys have been getting out of hand. The Secret Service presumably warned McCain about the dangers of this continuing. That's why he had to grab the mic from one of these insane wingnuts yesterday. Now, John Lewis is chipping in, thus keeping the controvesry in the news.
Beyond that, I don't see any masterplan to trap McCain. This is yet another distraction, created by the McCain campaign, which the MSM will be feasting on for the rest of this week. Forget the fatc that the economy is in the shitter.
Before Obama repudiates this, perhaps McCain should give a little lecture to his loyal band of sheep about their behavior.
and right on schedule - the GOPers are also going to play the WAR drum along with the race-baiting ploys...
'McCain breaks with Bush on North Korea'
@ http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/14489.html
predictable, no ???
this GOPer base hateful, fear-mongering campaign should go down in FLAMES if there is any karma in this world that Bush has not yet wasted...
I'm curious what the polls out of Idaho are looking like? I know Obama has not shot there but I'm curious...My moms talking on the phone with her friend in Idaho is voting for Obama. I told my mom it was probably 65-35 in Mccains favor but that was just an estimate on my part. I'm in Obama Country Michigan but whats funny is I live in Jackson Michigan which is the birthplace of the republican party..lol.
OBAMA '08!
The last thing Obama needs is for this election to turn into circus sideshow. Whenever that happens, the electorate's IQ drops a few points. That's bad for the Dems. As bill Clinton said, "When Americans think, Democrats WIN."
slicknickshady said...
I'm curious what the polls out of Idaho are looking like?
don't worry about Idaho
its red
Uggh not the race/culture war bullshit. This stuff will not help Obama.
There's a fucking economic meltdown in progress. Don't try and distract from that very real and prominent issue.
I'm just glad this is happening on a weekend where no one is paying attention, and that the narrative next week will be all about the ECONOMIC debate.
OMFG, McCain campaign is a trainwrecking - even the church-going types are jumping off en 'mass' as it were...
hot off the pages of USA Today online:
"Poll: Monthly churchgoers swing toward Obama"
@ http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-10-11-obama-church_N.htm?loc=interstitialskip
Just watched the Hockey Mom Nutbag drop the first puck. Many, many boos drowned out by ridiculously loud music. Plus, she brought out two of her non-pregnant daughters to lessen the blow.
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