How popular is Sarah Palin? So popular that she's almost as well regarded as the original baller, Dick Cheney, at the time he was rolled out as the Republican VP nominee in 2000.
There are three fresh favorability polls on Sarah Palin that were conducted in whole or on part since her speech to the Republican Convention on Wednesday. These are from Rasmussen, ABC News and Diageo/Hotline, respectively. On average between these three polls, Palin is regarded favorably by 50.3 percent of voters, and unfavorably by 33.0 percent of voters, for a net score of +17.3:Palin (2008)In the abstract, these are not bad numbers. In fact, as Scott Rasmussen points out, they compare favorably to the numbers Barack Obama and John McCain have compiled for most of the election cycle -- and Obama and McCain are relatively popular by the standards of Presidential candidates.
Poll Date Fav Unfav
========================================
Rasmussen 9/4/08 58 37 (+21)
ABC News 9/4/08 50 37 (+13)
Hotline 9/4/08 43 25 (+18)
==========================================
AVERAGE 50.3 33.0 (+17.3)
By the benchmark of other VP candidates, however, Palin's favorability ratings are relatively poor.
Here, for instance, from PollingReport.com, is a compilation of favorability ratings for Dick Cheney at the time of the Republican Convention in 2000:Cheney (2000)Cheney's favorables weren't quite as high as Palin's, but his unfavorables were only about half as much, giving him a net score of +28, easily bettering Palin's numbers. How about Al Gore's running mate in 2000, Joe Lieberman? Again, let's take a complication of polls from around the time of his respective party convention:
Poll Date Fav Unfav
========================================
NBC/WSJ 8/3/00 46 17 (+29)
Fox 8/10/00 53 17 (+36)
Gallup 8/5/00 44 22 (+22)
Time/CNN 8/??/00 43 18 (+25)
=======================================
AVERAGE 46.5 18.5 (+28.0)Lieberman (2000)As with Cheney, Lieberman's favorability scores weren't quite as high as Palin's, but almost nobody disliked Joe Lieberman (my, how times have changed), giving him a substantially better net score.
Poll Date Fav Unfav
========================================
Gallup 8/19/00 55 13 (+42)
Fox 8/10/00 48 10 (+38)
NBC/WSJ 8/??/00 40 11 (+29)
CNN 8/10/00 37 14 (+23)
=========================================
AVERAGE 45.0 12.0 (+33.0)
As we move forward to 2004, Dick Cheney's ratings had tanked -- he polled at about a 40/45 in most surveys four years ago -- but John Edwards' numbers were relatively strong compared to Palin's:Edwards (2004)
Lest Democrats get too giddy about this, Joe Biden's ratings aren't any better than Palin's -- and worse than those of other recent VP nominees:
Poll Date Fav Unfav
========================================
Gallup 8/1/04 59 27 (+22)
CBS 8/1/04 35 18 (+17)
Pew 8/8/04 58 24 (+34)
Newsweek 7/30/04 52 28 (+24)
Time 8/5/04 48 20 (+28)
Annenberg 8/5/04 44 27 (+17)
Fox 8/4/04 51 28 (+23)
=========================================
AVERAGE 49.6 24.6 (+25.0)Biden (2008)
Why have these past VP candidates gotten such strong favorability scores? It stems from the do-no-harm rule. The conventional wisdom is that a VP pick is more likely to be a reason to vote against a candidate than a reason to vote for him, making it unusual to select one who will trigger the strong reactions that Palin or Biden do.
Poll Date Fav Unfav
========================================
Rasmussen 8/23/08 48 34 (+14)
ABC News 9/4/08 54 30 (+24)
Hotline 9/4/08 42 29 (+13)
==========================================
AVERAGE 48.0 31.0 (+17.0)
Palin is probably an exception to that rule in both directions. I think she will turn out votes for John McCain. The impressive number is not so much her favorable ratings but the proportion of those that are strong favorables: 40 percent of Rasmussen's respondents, and 33 percent of ABC's, said they had a strongly favorable view of Palin. This is unusual for a VP nominee.
But, Palin will also lose votes for McCain -- and it's not clear that the losses won't outweigh the gains. Remember, favorability ratings should play into the strengths of a politician like Sarah Palin, who is charming and telegenic. But liking someone is not the same thing as wanting to vote for them; I have a very favorable view of my friend Eric, but wouldn't want his fingers anywhere near the nuclear trigger. And on preparedness measures, Palin polls unusually poorly: by a 42-50 margin (-8), voters in the ABC poll did not think she has the right experience to serve effectively as President; Biden's rating is 66-21 (+43).
9.05.2008
Palin, Biden Less Popular than Cheney
@ 5:47 PM
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354 comments
Ah! My mother writes-
Palin lies about earmarks
a new democrat
Brad,
Why do you condemn Fox for putting on a bio of Palin? Aren't you interested in learning more about her? Are you not mature enuf to filter out the spin?
8 and 8 on Sat and Sun on Fox.
I for one would like to learn more about her -- good and bad.
I'd like to learn more about Obama. Let's start with his Birth Certificate and his Indonesian Passport that he used to visit Pakistan in the 80s. In all the excitement over Palin, i forgot about those gems.
"She forcloses MT, and likely secures CO and NV."
The first is true, the last two not so much.
"Where the magic can happen is in WA or WI or MN."
No, it's not.
I can't imagine a more gigantic waste of money than trying to play in Washington state. They went for Dukakis, for God's sake.
Off topic, but few seem to worry about that when posting.
About 45 minutes ago I checked intrade. The betting there had Obama carrying all the Kerry staes plus IA, NM, CO, NV & OH. That's 298 EVs.
Subterranean said...
Baz744 mused:
"...Palin has 'sociopath' written all over her."
+1. I'm happy to say I distrusted her completely within the first 30 seconds of her voice molesting my ears.
---
Add me to that list. I was immediately put off by her. My reaction to her was just like my initial reaction to W in 1999. Actually, I think I have an even worse negative reaction to Palin. She really makes me feel physically ill.
I disagree with people who say "she seems nice but..." I think she seems like anything but nice. She seems like the DEVIL to me. She really does. Just one of the worst people in the world.
How many here can even tell me who were the candidates and their VP picks?
I was 2 at the time, but
Eisenhower/Nixon vs. Stevenson/?
Looking it up, Adlai's running mate was Senator John Sparkman. But it's hardly relevant -- no doubt the name would be at least recognizable if they had won.
But the main question,
That and similar questions aren't all that relevant when there are many unusual features of the election, and the number of national elections just isn't that big a dataset. Empirical analysis requires looking at all the data, and past outcomes are only a small part of it.
A "Hotline/FD Tracking" poll has Obama up by 6.
1) Who are these guys?
2) Does the world REALLY need another tracking poll that's ultimately irrelevant in our election system?
Diogo said...
100000 communities under 10000 is meaningless.
I bet if you add together all of the people that live in towns with 8500 people or less, which is the size of the town she was the Mayor of at it's peak, it's probably less than 2% of the population.
Sam watts, you troll
the correct figure for urban population is 80%.
Judas-
We don't know how accurate in-trade is since they don't have a track record of predicting general election results. Plus aren't most traders overseas? That'd favor Democrats. Ex., Gore actually being up in the in-trade Veepstakes.
Steve Roth;
The "risky" meme is not taking hold b/c McCain made a brilliant choice not a risky one.
Stevenson ran with Kefauver, IIRC.
Petekent strikes again
sarcasm in the fall air-
my least favorite troll
Virginia Conservative: Dukakis told me to tell you you're a....
.... ....wanker.
quantman:
Your assesment is depressing. i like your outcome, but see the motivation and the prospects thereafter to be much more uplfiting.
Once America is through the Palin we are a sea of possiblities, aren't we.
I'd like to learn more about Obama.
But only as a means of sinking his candidacy, not to find out what his policies actually are or what he would actually achieve.
Let's start with his Birth Certificate and his Indonesian Passport that he used to visit Pakistan in the 80s.
Hey, have at it, asshole.
bob wrote:
That's what drives us nuts - watching you guys point the gun at your foot and play Russian roulette with the country over and over just to get a reaction out of us.
That is what drives me nuts, too.
Standard Palin drivel:
"Palin will win over men, women, children, dogs, and the dead. Anyone who has ever seen a hockey game or passed someone on the street that has seen a hockey game will now vote McCain. Anyone who has a mother, living or dead, will now vote McCain. Palin's name begins with a "P", so everyone whose name begins with a "P" will now vote for McCain, because that's just what people in that situation. Pro-choice women will vote for McCain now because there is a woman on the ticket, and pro-life women will now vote McCain because they wouldn't before. In know some people. Trust me. I guarantee it."
To me, it's Palin who has become the Messiah to the Republicans. She can do anything, and if you don't praise Her Sacred Name, then the plague of the Almighty will fall upon you. Woe! Woe unto those who fail to bow at the feet of the Holy Hockey Mom!
So, yes, I'm extremely frightened of Palin and her incredible ability to drive McCain's numbers up a single point in six days. I admit it.
"Virginia Conservative: Dukakis told me to tell you you're a....
.... ....wanker."
I've been called worse things by better people.
Marc is objecting to any atempt to "humanize" Palin. Imagine someone trying to make her seem human, she is obviously an alien.
Diogo,
Give it up. I live in DFW and what somebody said earlier is so totally true - a serious percentage of the people who live within big city limits are still country.
Somebody tried to counter that by talking about suburbs 35 miles from Philly being still urban, and it's surely true that most of the northeast is kind of one big city.
But away from there, it's just a few places..
Like it or not, people with a functioning "country" gene seem to really like Palin.'
And of course the issue is that such people aren't all that stupid, and they think they have a pretty good grasp of what's in their own best interest.
So go right ahead with the "If only you were smart enough to realize what's in your own best interest" meme, and see how far that gets you with human beings, male and female, who have feelings and who are proud - and who will consider you a perfect XXXXX for saying things like that
Stevenson ran with Kefauver, IIRC.
No, Kefauver ran against him in the primary but wasn't his VP.
filistro wrote:
So "necromancy" would refer to conversations with McCain?
...yes, or Bob Weir.
Wikipedia says your wrong.
Well, for 1956 anyway. In '52 it was John Sparkman (whoever the hell he was).
Marc is objecting to any atempt to "humanize" Palin. Imagine someone trying to make her seem human, she is obviously an alien.
Republicans are such hypocritical assholes. Palin doesn't need to be "humanized" as she is virtually universally seen that way, while there has been a massive attempt by the right -- including by assholes like Pete Kent -- to paint Obama as "foreign".
I'll pass it on to Dukakis.
Wikipedia says your wrong.
Well, for 1956 anyway. In '52 it was John Sparkman (whoever the hell he was).
Excuse me? The question was about 1952, and I already answered that it was Sparkman. Sheesh, what a fucking dickhead.
will walker's haikus
fill humanity with joy
though mccain is gay
"Excuse me? The question was about 1952, and I already answered that it was Sparkman. Sheesh, what a fucking dickhead."
I didn't realize which race was specified. Sorry.
Eve:
Having a media interview is akin to giving testimony in court. You had better be prepared for it. These people play for the gotcha moment and even if the majority of them weren't radical left wing ideologies, their natural competitive nature makes them desirous of destroying any politician in their path.
Its how the great ones make their scalps. Journalists I am speaking of.
Palin has skinned a moose or two. She is competitive enough to want to skin a journalist as well.
She needs to and wants to be ready for her media debut.
You should expect nothing less of her.
Do you think she is a fool?
P.S. Learn to spell "you're", moron.
Take a Valium, jqb. You've never made a typo? Read my above post.
haiku:
PeteKent babbles thus -
big gains for Mac on Friday
but not in the polls
From palinfacts.com
*Sarah Palin begins every day with a moment of silence for the political enemies buried in her yard.
*Sarah Palin always beats the point spread.
*Sarah Palin once bit the head off a live Osprey snatched from the air as it tried to fly off with a fish she caught.
*Sarah Palin uses French Canadians as bait to catch giant king salmon.
*When Sarah Palin booked a flight to Europe, the French immediately surrendered.
*Sarah Palin plays Whack-a-Mole with her forehead, and always gets a perfect score.
*Sarah Palin knows who was on the grassy knoll.
*Sarah Palin’s finishing move in the VP debate will be pulling Biden’s still beating heart from his chest & taking a bite.
(Come to think of it... she DOES sound a lot like Cheney, no? :-)
I'd like to learn more about Obama. Let's start with his Birth Certificate and his Indonesian Passport that he used to visit Pakistan in the 80s.
Wow, why would it even be of interest that a boy with a step-father from Indonesia had an Indonesian passport? And yeah he had a 3 week stay in Pakistan in 1981, his campaign confirms that. Since kids having dual citizenship is pretty common for anyone who's lived abroad with a foreign national parent and its all totally legal and expectable what exactly is the 'shocker' here?
I didn't realize which race was specified.
Then what the fuck question do you think was asked?
I don't get it, Pete. Shouldn't Palin already be prepared to confront the media?
I skimmed through the posts to quickly. Mortal sin, I know.
Nicholas:
You must hang around with the wrong crowd!
I don't think Bush was anything like the people. He did have a regular guy's sensibilities. tho Nothing wrong with that.
But Palin knows what it is like, what we go though.
That has to count for soemthing to have somwone like her in the highest councils of governement.
I would be pleased to have her as my advocate.
Take a Valium, jqb. You've never made a typo? Read my above post.
How about you reading mine, moron? Like the one where I answered the question of who ran against whom in 1952 by answering all 4. Fucking dumbass.
jqb you sound a little hyper.
I skimmed through the posts to quickly. Mortal sin, I know.
You skim through all facts too fast -- that's why you're a stupid fucking "conservative".
PeteKent wrote:
Do you think she is a fool?
I'm beginning to think you are.
You practically worship her, you speak for her, you promise things in Her Name, you flip out when anyone insinuates that perhaps She cannot walk on water, and you have claimed that She represents all women.
Perhaps "fool" is not the correct term; mentally ill is.
Dominoid: "To my partial eyes I see a real benefit on the Dem side for these campaign events and as a result a +1 or 2 polling advantage as a result."
Well, looking at the YouGov poll (the only source that I am aware of that explicitly breaks out undecideds), who is still mainly on the fence is moderate middle-aged low-income women. I doubt that they will be affected that much by campaign events. It will probably come down to the debates, and election-related media reporting. Quantman, probably also filistro, will most likely have better insight into which media reach out to these women than I have. Nevertheless, my gut feeling is that it won't be the NYT, nor CNN. US Weekly and the National Enquirer, OTOH, might reach into that group, and that could not bode to well for McCain/Palin ...
Frank from Germany
Alright, now I know I can just scroll filter you.
jqb you sound a little hyper.
There are no sounds here, moron. I merely despise the radical so-called "conservative"s who have fucked my country.
Alright, now I know I can just scroll filter you.
Of course, that's how you remain a shithead "conservative", by filtering out anything that challenges who and what you are.
joe @ 6:27. Thanks for writing that. That was exactly my reaction. Not because I support Obama but because my brother worked as a community organizer/translator gaining people access to health care in Minnessota. He has more responsability than any of those people laughing ever had because he held the lives of these people in his hands.
And I would hope to see that part in an ad--Republicans laughing at community organizers while they celebrate lobbyists. Yes--that is reform and ethical behavior from the maverick. That is the 'new' brad of the Republican party. same stuff, even worse, different bottle.
Well, I think in alaska they call it "riding the snow machine", but I suppose "pleasing the advocate" might be an alternative.
Seriously, do you really think Obama doesn't know what you go through, growing up with a single mom in Kansas? Biden, growing up lower middle class in Scranton? Michelle, raised solidly middle class in Chicago?
Let's just use Michelle, for some girl-on-girl action. What is it in your life that you think Palin could relate to that Michelle Obama couldn't? Did you used to skin moose as a child or something?
"Seriously, do you really think Obama doesn't know what you go through, growing up with a single mom in Kansas?"
He never lived in Kansas.
You practically worship her
Only because she's part of his team's squad. He would treat a toadstool with the same reverence if it were the Republican VP candidate.
Crazy fuck - imagine not voting for someone because they didn't live in Kansas.
I think the media would and the public would be better served going over the records of the Chicago Annenberg Council, or what ever that non-profit that Obama ran for his buddy Bill Ayers. It was Obama's lone bit of excutive experience and yet he downplays plays it.
CAC is not part of the Obama offical biogrpahy eventho 100 of millions of dollars of its money went through his hands and he was associated with it for years.
Don't think that the McBrilliant campaign is not investigating it. They took in $47 million at the McRich campaign in August, a record month. Surely there are few bucks in the budget for opposition research.
So the truth will out. But why isn't the media covering the story? Or are they already doing it.
Haiku No.5:
Nate Silver and Sean
Made 538.com:
A home for wankers.
Brad,
Forest Gump was very upifitng!
Let me guess, your favorite movie was Mahogany ?
He lives in Kansas City?.
Obama and Biden votes in the Congress for the secession of Hawaii!.
That´s true, i doesn´t drink wine.
Check in Google.
bob wrote:
Since kids having dual citizenship is pretty common for anyone who's lived abroad with a foreign national parent and its all totally legal and expectable what exactly is the 'shocker' here?
See, bob, that's the thing...
Obama can be the subject of innuendo, even though there is nothing really wrong or illegal about what is implied. It simply "raises questions" that "Obama should answer". The people who employ these innuendos stop just a hair short of accusing him of doing anything wrong, and pretend that they are merely curious about him. It's completely dishonest.
But if you do it to Palin, there will be a tremendous backlash - how dare you even insinuate - where's the new politics, etc.
I guess being a "maverick" doesn't exclude you from using the same tactics as your Party did in the last two elections.
McCain wasn't even born in the U.S, so the issue of a birth certificate from Obama is DOA.
Speaking of biogrpahy, Why did it take until Sarah Palin's advent on the national scene for there to be a discussion of what a "community organizer" is.
Did the media drop the ball?
I don't think so. The question remains unanswered, so there is still chance to do some digging.
judas_priest said "15 minutes out from a city you're out not logner urbanized? The last time I was there, (14 years ago) if you took US 611 north from Philadelphia you didn't see the end of suburbia for about 35 miles and I am sure it sprawls even further today. And given the traffic, that drive was over an hour unless you did it between midnight and 6 am."
Judas,
Now, you can take US 611 all the way from Philadelphia to Doylestown, and you never leave suburbia. Unreal.
Obama/Biden for Secession of Hawaii?.
http://forums.hannity.com/showthread.php?t=837251
That's a stretch!
Why did it take until Sarah Palin's advent on the national scene for there to be a discussion of what a "community organizer" is.
What a fucking moron.
The question remains unanswered
What a fucking moron.
beowulf:
Comparing Sarah Palin to HRC? I called that damned with faint praise!
Frank says... who is still mainly on the fence is moderate middle-aged low-income women....
Frank, (love your posts, BTW) I've tried hard to find out where these women get their info and make their electoral decisions... even done a couple of studies on my own.
I think it's mostly from family and friends, word- of-mouth. As far as media they are greatly infleunced by "personality" but not the way one would think. For instance they don't look at all for people they perceive to be "just like them." Instead they like leaders who inspire a sense of awe and confidence, people to "look up to."
Once they give allegiance they reamain very loyal. These are the people who still love Princess Di, who adored Jackie O and revere Nancy Reagan.
I suspect in this election they would identify most strongly with the presidential wives... Cindy McCain or Michele Obama. But their voting decision will be based ultimately on who they get the best "feeling" about during the debates... the one they most feel they can trust as a leader.
I suppose it is faint praise...but really meant to be a statement of "beware what you wish for"...Republicans salivated for Hillary because they knew her ceiling was probably 47 or 48% due to the polarization around her...Palin has, with her diatribe of a speech and her astonishing policy positions, made herself identical. I love that Republicans love her...just like Republicans hoped beyond hope that dems would love Hillary enough to nominate her.
I can not wait for the MSM to actually interview Governor Palin. I made a list of questions to ask on my blog:
http://reformprosperitypeace.blogspot.com/
What questions would you folks want asked?
Petekent wrote:
Why did it take until Sarah Palin's advent on the national scene for there to be a discussion of what a "community organizer" is.
Because no candidate has ever gone on national television before and publicly ridiculed someone for being a "community organiser" and implied there was something devious about it.
Likewise, no candidate has ever implied before that hunting moose makes you qualified to take over the Presidency, either.
No candidate has ever invoked their job as Commander-in-Chief of a state's National Guard as "military experience" before this election, either.
My questions for Palin:
1.) Who are you voting for in your state's senatorial race?
2.) John McCain, your running mate, has called people who hold your views "agents of intolerance." How do you feel about that?
Virginia Conservative said...
"Seriously, do you really think Obama doesn't know what you go through, growing up with a single mom in Kansas?"
He never lived in Kansas.
Huh. You're absolutely right. Why did I think...well, never mind that.
I'll restate my main case, though: what is it about Sarah Palin that makes you think she can relate to you, but not Michelle Obama?
Dario, so some fool starts a thread on Hannity's forum and it MUST be true. I know your probably just trying to have fun, but if you're not. Try reading all the posts to find out it was a joke.
In fact I just made one that says Dario is a flamer. Must be true it is on the Hannity forums website - http://forums.hannity.com/showthread.php?p=34988201
jqb:
Cool off. All that hostility is bad for you, and we need every Obama voter we can get.
"I'll restate my main case, though: what is it about Sarah Palin that makes you think she can relate to you, but not Michelle Obama?"
Michelle Obama went to Harvard.
I went to a state public school. So did most people in America.
That's one example.
As a republican, I'll tell you why I really like Palin. She has added intense excitement to the Rebublican base. Note huge increases in contributions and volunteers. CNN just showed an interview with 8 Evangelicals in Florida. 1 was voting for McCain, but now 8 are volunteering, contributing and voting for McCain/Palin. This is about GOTV.
She may also energize democrats. To me that is also good. We all should be involved. Palin is going to focus on the base freeing McCain to do what he does best: appeal to independents and moderates. This was never about Hillary pro choice women.
SouthernOntarian makes my point about Palin's broad (ahem!) appeal.
I can't relate to Sarah Palin...she went to 6 colleges, I only went to one. We can play this game about anything, it is meaningless.
Yeah it's pretty silly but most voters fall easily for biography. Rick Davis was just speaking the truth when he said this would be decided on personality. It is ALWAYS decided on personality.
Todd Dugdale said "No candidate has ever invoked their job as Commander-in-Chief of a state's National Guard as 'military experience' before this election, either."
Todd,
I cannot find a definitive quote, but IIRC, Bill Clinton made that claim in 1992 about himself and the Arkansas National Guard.
If my memory is not playing tricks, the Republicans lambasted him for that claim.
Strange how, 16 years later, it is okey-dokey with Republicans for Sarah Palin to make the same claim.
PeteKunt-
You know, somebody actually reads your silly drivel and asks a question about it, holds you to something you said, then you dismiss it as irrelevant. You come across as a scared and weak little boy.
But you're right. I was asking about something you said in regards to predicting today's polling (you guaranteed a blowout today) but you decide to dismiss your own opinion.
For once in all of your poorly organized and embarrassing postings you leave here, you finally got something right: Indeed, you are irrelevant.
Dario didn't deserve that. Poor Dario.
Because no candidate has ever gone on national television before and publicly ridiculed someone for being a "community organiser" and implied there was something devious about it.
You've missed the target. The reason that it took Sarah Palin's advent for that to happen is that they had to address her inexperience as mayor, and they did so with a double whammy by comparing that to "community organizer", which of course they had to belittle to make the comparison go her way.
For some fact-based insight into how the marketing of Palin operates (and how it depends on the feckless media), read http://dailyhowler.com/dh090508.shtml (highly recommended to todd dugdale too)
In conclusion:
Favorability is inversely proportional to familiarity.
Stevenson ran with Keefauver and Ike of course ran with Nixon.
Hows that, John?
jqb wrote:
You've missed the target.
Fair enough.
I'd like to hear more about your friend Eric. It seems like it's not too early to start talking Veepstakes for 2012, and he would be an interesting "dark horse" candidate.
Rick Davis was just speaking the truth when he said this would be decided on personality.
That's not what he said, that's just more of your uncomprehending skimming. What he said was "This campaign is not about the issues". "This campaign" refers to the McCain campaign. And indeed he was speaking the truth.
Yes, hes running his campaign on personality because that's the best route to victory. It always is. Nobody really wins on issues at the end of the day.
Stevenson ran with Keefauver and Ike of course ran with Nixon.
Hows that, John?
PK skims even worse than VC.
Eric:
No one cares about your guesses.
I guess diffently, so there.
Try and use paragraph structure in your posts. It makes them more readable.
On the comparison of Mayor to Community Organizer, this was not a knock on all community organizers. The very first attack by the Obama campaign was "She has little experience; She is just the mayor of a small town in Alaska". So, why are we not arguing that MSM and Obama's campaign dissed ALL small town mayors?
We do not argue that because it makes no more sense than to say she dissed all community organizers.
The Economist that bastion of communism has this to say about McCain and Palin----
http://www.economist.com/world/unitedstates/displaystory.cfm?story_id=12066224
very much worth a read.
Yes, hes running his campaign on personality because that's the best route to victory.
It's the only possible route for Republicans in this cycle, idiot.
It always is. Nobody really wins on issues at the end of the day.
It's the economy, you STUPID fucking moron.
jqb,
Sarah palin has a very common Scandanavian-influenced accent. it is common throught out MN and WI among other swing states, don;t you know?
Your list of what she is is a microcosm of America and its aspirations, including even being a bit of a female barricuda.
, this was not a knock on all community organizers
floridagop is another stupid fucking lying Republican asshole. Giuliani, with his air quotes, was belittling the concept.
Thanks fro the defense assmole.
My analysis of the states Eric is better characterized as optomistic, I take exeption to "silly": too dismissive.
FloridaGOP - tone is important when it comes to statements like that...why did it dis all community organizers? Probably because it followed Rudy's 15 second belly laugh (leading the crowd) when he said "community organizer"...and then Palin repeating the line with a mocking contemptuous tone. They both were mocking the entire idea of community organizing.
Your list of what she is is a microcosm of America and its aspirations
You really are a fucking moron.
jqb;
please do not confuse the rabble here as "the populace".
Oh yeah, it could also be her saying "being a mayor is like being a community organizer, only you have actual responsibilities"...that was not just an attack on Obama...but *all* community organizers.
See ya, Joe! Don't let the door hit you on the ass on your way out the door, bud!
jqb,
No I am not lying. You can look up the quote by the Obama Campaign on Friday Aug 29th at around 2PM . It disses Palin on her experience.
I did not say anything about Rudy, You did. Sarah Palin in her acceptance speech was dissing Obama not all community organizers,
please do not confuse the rabble here as "the populace".
Fuck, how many hours behind are you? The point was about "blogs", not "here". But then, it seems everything you say is wrong, stupid, and/or dishonest. So that's my standing answer to all your further comments.
late, and maybe others have already answered it, but I'm at work and reading in between tasks when I can. I just can't let this one slide by and keep reading.
Shap @5:43
How can you support these limo-driving, latte sipping, country-club liberals, the Obamas? They want nothing more than to bring Hollywood elitism to power, and instill us with their San Francisco values.
are you serious?
you need to read this article:
McCain's plugged into Hollywood
Sarah Palin will win the presidency for the Republicans. She has already withstood everything the libs have thrown at her, including terrorizing her infant son who has down's syndrome.
I'm curious how "libs" have terrorized her son, more so than his being dragged onstage in front of the bright lights and loud crowd by his mom.
When she comes to power, the words 'Under God' will remain in the Pledge, as the forefathers had intended!
You moron, the Pledge was invented in the 1890s. 'Under God' was added in during the early 1950s. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pledge_of_Allegiance#Addition_of_the_words_.22under_God.22
Now, maybe that was the time period of *your* forefathers but *my* mother and father were already married by then.
Sarah Palin is going to become what Hillary wishes she was, but never will be. Sarah Palin is an American Hero.
Hillary wishes to be The Person Who Brings Universal Health Care to the people of the United States. You really think Sarah Palin will do that?
Will walker:
Thank you for the most interesting tutorial today.
Can anyone even remember anything Obama said at the Greek Temple?
I could barely reocllect the speech until I saw a clip or tow, but ehre was not one memorable line.
"Fight, fight fight for your country!"
"Lipstick!"
So you both agree that the Obama campaign was dissing ALL small town mayor in the US? If you agree, then in YOUR definition Sarah was intentionally going after ALL community organizers!!! I do not think that politicians like Obama or Palin intentionally diss voters, but you might convince me otherwise.
Diogo:
I was being pedantic, and my overall belief is that you are correct.
And when I am talking about "urban Americans", I don't mean people living in the 10 biggest metropolitan regions. I lived in Montana, and Montana is an urban state.
I think the numbers of Americans who live on farms is what...2 or 3%? Even in a place like Montana, people living in a town where farming is the main economic engine is fairly small. So while the entire "small town" thing might make good press, these people's issues are actually the same as someone living in San Francisco: health care, getting an education for them and their children, keeping their job.
How many actual differences in economics and lifestyle are there between someone living in San Francisco and "rural" Missouri?
No I am not lying.
Not only are you a liar, but you're a cretin ... I quoted your lie, and it wasn't anything about the Obama campaign: " this was not a knock on all community organizers" -- that was a lie, a blatant lie. Not only was it in the context of Giuliani's previous mockery -- what, you think they were unrelated, that it was unplanned? -- but she made a point of saying that community organizers don't have any actual responsibilities. That was a lie, a dis on all community organizers, and you are fool, a cretin, an idiot, a jackass, a liar, a piece of shit ... to sum it up, you're Republican.
Lat:
I told you, Biden is a nullity.
Please don't bring him up. He is so two weeks ago!
No one cares what he does or says on the campaign trail. The only thing of interest is where he goes, so we can know where Obama feels weak.
Right now, I'd say PA.
Judas preist:
Philadelphia is the avatar of urban sprawl. People who live ther actually commute to NYC.
Try Cinti or KC.
I read what people actually say and judge them based on that...Palin did not say "being a mayor is like being Mr. Obama as a community organizer, only I had responsibilities"...that would have been an attack on him...instead she was very clear that it was all community organizers who had no "actual responsibilities." Just pure arrogance in my book.
you might convince me otherwise.
It doesn't matter what a cretin like you is convinced of. Community organizers and community organizations all across the country reacted swiftly, and Obama raked in something like $10 million that night.
Alex S:
Mormons and retirees live in NV. fertile ground for McCaib-Palin
I do not believe Obama was "dissing" all small-town mayors. He was -- rightly or wrongly -- suggesting that the position does little to build the "experience" some may deem as necessary to hold the position of president or vice-president.
For me, this is not even in the same ballpark as laughing at the very concept of a "community organizer" or suggesting that those who hold the position have no "actual responsibilities" whatsoever.
Dominoid:
If you see theClintons out on the hustle, they will be doing it for one reason: to beat Palin and preserve Hillary's legacy.
BTW, part of the discussion about the dis on community organizing delved into its crypto-racist, anti-urban aspects. There was also discussion about the fact that Obama was director of the Developing Communities Project, a project of the Catholic Church. Of course the GOP was not intentionally dissing the Catholic Church, their innuendo was much shallower than that.
VC
:
WA state has a cutural and commecial realtionship with AK unlike any othe state in the Union. For some reason I see this helping in ME as well.
Silly bet - anyone care to make a wager on whether the Enquirer story will have legs?
But back to basics, it is truly sad that a completely normal American and thus normally dysfunctional family has to be pulled into the media spot light! Isn't Brit and Paris enough for you guys??
Pictures of Bristol's underage drinking, having to marry a guy who is surely sweet, but dumb and probably bedded half his high-school (what else is there to do in Alaska during the winter?) and who sees Bristol as a meal-ticket - can we not give these poor, hormone high teenagers a break and leave them in obscurity without ruining their lives - they are doing a good job without us piling on!!
Also, who amongst us has not tried to bash an ex-in-law, especially if he is a drunk and an a*hole - why do sisters always have to marry these wrong guys - embarrassing, isn't it???
And that annoying co-worker who you could finally hit over the head after you became the boss?? With glee did we torture them or even fire them and had a good laugh!! Come on, everybody has at least fantasized about it!!
Getting your friend in city council to get a bus stop a few hundred yards from your house requiring a new bus line - who has not heard such a story before. A little pork-belly spending for the comfort of a small community has not hurt anyone, right???
Boy, if they knew about all of our skeletons in the closets - what would the national enquirer say about us!
So, please, Big Media and you bloggers leave poor Sarah alone - she has enough to do with her large and sweetly dysfunctional family. She cannot answer all of our questions all at once - a few times in a warm and cozy environment is enough. If we were to upset with questions about her knowledge gained from 4 different colleges (she was also in Hawaii, but it was to warm for her and not good hunting) she could not pump milk for little Trig.
She is a courageous woman who deserves our respect and support - really!! She will give up her biggest hobbies in the world - having babies and hunting! That is a true sign of devotion to service of country! You, go Girl!!
Petekent wrote:
Sarah Palin has a very common Scandinavian-influenced accent. it is common throughout out MN and WI among other swing states, don't you know?
As someone who has lived in Minnesota for decades (and currently does) and travelled throughout Wisconsin over the course of many years, I can tell you that you are wrong. That is the stereotype, which may have been valid 40 years ago, but is not now.
I can count on one hand the number of people in Minnesota that I have encountered who talk like that in my entire life, and they are all old people that immigrated from a Scandinavian country.
If you were to talk like that in Minnesota, people would laugh at you behind your back - we're just too polite to laugh in peoples' faces.
Jqb:
How have I ever tried to make Obama seem foreign. He is exotic, grant me that, but so is Palin.
Rudy Giuliani on Barack Obama:
he has never run city, never run a state, never run a government. He has never been responsible as a mayor for the safety and security of millions of people, and he has never run a law enforcement agency, which I have done.
Oh, wait, no ... that's what he said about John McCain:
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2008/Story?id=3851631&page=3
He is exotic, grant me that
No, you're exotic, spawn from some alien planet hostile to human life. Barack's a bud.
You ask Andrew, shouldn't she be prepared for the media already?
Are you joking? She has never had to confront such sharks as the MSM Washington Press Corps. You need coaching for that. Don;t you think they will go after her with the soul purpose of pulling an Eagleton on her? There has already been talk of that.
Matthew H asks:
What is it in your life that you think Palin could relate to that Michelle Obama couldn't?
My answer: white people.
My answer: white people.
Of course that's your answer, you racist asshole.
VC is right. BO never lived in KS. Only HI, Indonesia, LA, NYC, Boston an Chicago, I think. Oh, yes and DC.
Dario is right about Obama bin Biden voting for secession.
Brilliant assmole. Very topical. i dont know about the season thing tho . . .
Quick clarification to earlier posts:
urban
suburban
rural
To those of us who live in a true rural area, we lack those fancy suburban things like a morning paper dropped off; mail delivery to our home address; rubbish pick-up; cable television; broadband internet connection; municipal water system; municipal sewer system, etc.
THAT is rural America. We do not have the same issues, nor do we vote the same.
Todd dudgale, actuLLY AT THE TIME dual citizenship was very uncommon and Mr. Soetero was of no realtion to young Obama. He travelled to pakistan as an adult, not as the war of his mother and her husband.
American Presidents should not have ambigous citizenship.
Oh...and we western white women, even old ones like me and my 83-year old mother, do have enough intelligence to vote for the substance in Senator Obama's plans, not the market hype offered by his opponent.
Beowulf;
Palin has been on the national scene for a week; I think it is premature to speak about her "ceiling".
Todd:
people have an idea about what skinning moose is all about and it makes them squeamish.
I guess you could say the same about being a community organizer, the difference is the former is only a hobby.
Oh and you are wrong about the Cpmmander in C of the natl guard - -Bill Clinton said the same thing about his expereince.
The motivation for McCain's decision to send Palin to Siberia... er... Alaska, is to keep her from doing any more harm. Some are not recognizing one important consequence of this, however: she also can't be of any use in campaigning.
So while she hides from the media, Obama will have the benefit of this.
And if McCain sends out other surrogates to try to take on a similar role, this will only lead to more questions of the sort, "Where in the World is Sarah Palin?"
PeteKent - wow! I am sincerely impressed with your grasp of facts. Yes, Obama was an adult...college student...when he traveled to Pakistan to visit his mother.
In the world of women, Obama's mother was amazing. She makes women like Senator Clinton and Governor Palin look like cheap politicians.
Thank you, PeteKent.
PeteKent - for us rural types, skinning (or plucking) wild game is a fact of life. Sadly, for some it is a mandatory part of life because food has become too expensive. Wild meat is necessary.
Oh - birth certificate - a copy is available online. Most states only release things like birth and death certificates to immediate family members. HI is one of those states.
But, Palin will also lose votes for McCain -- and it's not clear that the losses won't outweigh the gains.
Where are you getting this from? This is just unsubstantiated wishful thinking, colored with a pointless distinction about likability vs. voteworthiness and your friend Eric (who I don't know, but would rather have in charge of the nuclear trigger than Barack 'liberation theology' Obama).
Why, why, why did this site have to turn into DailyKos with data? Why did a smart member of the best baseball data company in the business have to bring his expertise to such stupid, hack purposes, constantly flexing and contorting to spin every little poll to be favorable to his Glorified United Organic Herbal Third Way Candidate? Why the constant snarky editorializing?
It's just so damn disappointing.
john peterson babbled:
"Why did a smart member of the best baseball data company in the business have to bring his expertise to such stupid, hack purposes, constantly flexing and contorting to spin every little poll to be favorable to his Glorified United Organic Herbal Third Way Candidate?"
Yes, it takes enormous expertise to spin a lead in the polls as "favorable." Nate can TRY, sure, but everybody knows that the key to winning elections is always staying below 45% in the national trackers.
Oh, and by the way, Nate isn't "snarky." Mr. Silver is debonair and disarming at once, and a formidable humanist. The planet is a little more hospitable with him aboard---so be grateful.
jakam said...
"There are just under 20,000 incorporated places (cities, towns, villages, boroughs) in the United States."
Key word - 'incorporated'
I grew up on a farm in Indiana. Within 5 miles of the house I grew up in there was one incorporated town of 5,000. UNincorporated places within 5 miles of the house I grew up in numbered 5, with populations of approx. 250 down to about 10.
I dare say that there are many more UNincorporated places in the US than there are incorporated places.
Let's put it another way:
In 2000, the est. US population was 285,230,516, of which more than 58% (166,215,889) lived in urbanized areas of 200,000 population or greater. That comprised 153 US Census Bureau defined 'urban areas'.
Urbanized Areas 50,000 - 199,999 population numbered 310, and had 29,584,626 people.
Urban Clusters 5,000 - 49,999 population numbered 1,838, with a population of 25,438,275.
Urban Clusters 2,500 - 4,999 population numbered 1,328, with a population of 4,717,270.
That means that almost 60,000,000 lived in areas of population of less than 2,500. If each of those areas with some population has 2,499 people, there would be more than 23,000 of them. But we know that there are lots of areas with populations of 1,000 or less. If they average 1,250 in population, then there are more than 47,000 areas of population of less than 2,500.
Another way to look at it is to say that although you live in, say New York City, there are five Boroughs that people might more associate with than NYC itself (Brooklyn, for example). Then within each of the Boroughs, there are smaller communities (at least 97 in Brooklyn alone). Some may more associate with their small(ish) community in Brooklyn than with the Borough of Brooklyn or New York City.
By the way, a community of more than 35,000 can be UNincorporated. An example is Glen Burnie, Maryland - about 40,000 in population. Towson, Maryland had over 50,000 in the 2000 census, and it is UNincorporated. Catonsville, Maryland in the 2000 census had almost 40,000, and it is UNincorporated.
It is NOT inconceivable that there are at least 100,000 communities (whether incorporated or not) in the United States.
Mike
In the internals for the Democracy Cops:
Q 61 Too negative in his campaign (SWING STATES)
Obama - 26
McCain - 51
Sounds like it could backfire in those areas.
Eve:
No I read what you said I think clearly. But if you were slamming McCain for mistakenly saying that Palin sold the plane 'at a profit' and extrapolating that to mean that his selection of Palin was incompetent or that Palin lied to McCain about her record.. well.. that'd be just petty.
Almost as petty as not voting for someone because they accidentally said that the USA has 57 states. Or mistakenly said that Canada, your largest external source of oil, had a President instead of the Prime Minister we actually have. Or claimed that future generations would look back at a particular day in the past when the seas started to lower.
Really, if he had not said 'at profit' that statement would have been fine. He makes an off-the-cuff remark that turns out to be an overstatement.. woop dee doo. Not the first person to do that right? *ahem*
So you must not be really upset about McCain making that mistake, it must be that the plane was sold for less than it was purchased for. Because otherwise it wouldn't make sense.
dual citizenship was very uncommon and Mr. Soetero was of no realtion to young Obama.
But he was his step father and Indonesian law grants citizenship to children via remarriage. And again, dual citizenship for children with a foreign national parent is the rule, not the exception.
He travelled to pakistan as an adult,
No, he was 20 still a college student (21 usually being the cut off for adult at the time).
not as the ward of his mother and her husband.
But as you should know his Indonesian dual citizenship expires if he goes 5 years without returning to indonesia.
So he traveled legally, had dual citizenship through totally reasonable and expectable cause and effect, and the dual citizenship has lapsed.
Again, what's the issue to a reasonable mind? Knowing he had an Indonesian stepfather it would be surprising if he didn't have a period of dual citizenship.
Its the old moving gold posts - first people are trying to say that he had Kenyan citizenship until they found out that its Kenya that doesn't allow it. That doesn't work they switch to the stepfather with the same unlikelihood chance of scandal.
Can we say Desperate!!!
It is obvious McCain’s trying to gain support from (some) Hillary supporters and aiming towards WORKING MOMs WITH CHILDREN.
I'm sorry but it's back fired royally. PTA meetings and monthly council meeting isn't enough.
Actual Working Mom's do not Trust Palin and believe she is just a puppet.
YES, she is no Hillary or Oprah.
YES, she is not the INSPIRATION and CHANGE we want representing all of us.
Her resume is weak. It's high school all over again and Miss Alaska is the two face prom queen.
Let’s VOTE for a WOMAN who REALLY WANTS to MAKE A CHANGE.
Instead of voting for someone following the click.
SHAME ON YOU, McCain for choosing a DESPERATE woman (who's been losing supporters in ALASKA) for your own selfish and fraught plans.
IF YOU 18 YRS OLD OR JUST BECAME A US CITIZEN, PLEASE REGISTER TO VOTE.
WE ALL HAVE A VOICE, BY NOT VOTING YOUR VOICE WILL BE SILENT.
SouthernOntarian -
The idea that McCain 'misspoke' about Palin selling the plane for a profit is wrong. Palin has been relating the the story of how she sold the plane on Ebay and sold it for a profit starting with her first speech.
There are two purposes to this story: 1. connect with all the moms that sell things on Ebay, and 2. show her fiscal responsibility. The facts that have come our are 1. she didn't sell it on Ebay - she posted it three times buy had to sell it through an airplane broker and 2. she sold it at a loss.
Why does it make any real difference. Because it is a distortion of her record. And if someone we don't know much about lies about the little things ...
And BTW the 'bridge to nowhere' story is also a lie. Palin supported it until it became a national joke. As for being anti-pork, she hired lobbyists to bring it home to Wasilla. Palin is not Kosher.
Both Palin and McCain play pretty loose with the truth.
John Peterson -
Get a grip. Nate isn't some news group that should at least try to be non-partisan. If he favors Obama he favors Obama. He doesn't try to hide it. Your free to offer your opinion if you don't like his. If you find it all that bad go visit Fox.
As for the 'Glorified United Organic Herbal Third Way Candidate'; I'd sleep much better knowing he had the launch codes and not 'Bomb, bomb, bomb, Iran' McCain or 'God told me to do it' Palin.
Does anyone even care about the Constitution? How much of Sen. Obama's plans are Constitution? Does our government have the right or privilege to create nationwide healthcare? What about taking a certain amount of oil company profits? That money does not belong to them and the government has no right to take someone else's property and give it to someone else.
As for Gov. Palin? She is exactly what our government needs. McCain isn't it, McCain has to many friends in Washington. Palin has nothing to lose and she is not afraid to blow the whistle on her own party. As a Washingtonian and Constitutionalist I want someone to give me back control of my government. We have absolutely lost control of our government! For the first year in session our latest congress passed one law and spent millions upon millions of dollars to investigate their rival party, turning up nothing yet. That is losing control of our government.
Do I fully agree with Gov. Palin? No! Am I a republican? NO! I despise political parties! Someone made a comment about changing your opinion about someone when you know little... they need to look at that both ways. Read articles written about Gov. Palin written before her VP bid and see what the truth is. Don't trust any media, especially in election time. All media is biased. Gov. Palin is exactly what the American people need to take control of their government. Under Sen. Obama's plan we will give our government more power to do unConstitutional programs, the power to take private property away from those who earned it legally. Do I want nationwide Healthcare? That is irrelevant, it is unConstitutional and therefore it must not be tolerated.
I am going to vote for McCain just so we can have a "lame-duck" President for probably 4 years and then Gov. Palin can give us back our America.
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^^ very nice
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酒店經紀人,
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禮服酒店上班,
酒店小姐兼職,
便服酒店工作,
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制服酒店經紀,
專業酒店經紀,
合法酒店經紀,
酒店暑假打工,
酒店寒假打工,
酒店經紀人,
菲梵酒店經紀,
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禮服酒店上班,
酒店小姐兼職,
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制服酒店經紀,
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