9:07 MDT: [Nate] I think making Michelle the featured speaker tonight was a matter of defense rather than offense -- clearly an effort to normalize the Obamas. But as Sean says -- it really wasn't that hard, was it? And maybe that's the point.
We'll see you folks tomorrow night, when the most important speech of the campaign will occur.
9:02 MDT: Show, don't tell. That last exchange with the kids may have been a setup but it was unfakeable. There is no greater common denominator than a genuine expression of love in a family. Everyone relates to that. That isn't a person telling a touching story about how they were raised, that was love in real time.
8:56 MDT: [Nate] Last five minutes of her speech definitely had Favreau's fingerprints on it. But I think it slightly exceeded expectations -- mine anyway.
8:47 MDT: Michelle Obama has given many speeches on the campaign trail this election season, this is the big stage to reassure those who have been slow to warm to Obama that this is the fully American couple. There has been an ongoing effort with warm supermarket-aisle mags (not the Weekly World News) to present the Obamas as the quintessential American family. This is a good speech, particularly notable for the buzz moment of mentioning Hillary Clinton, but will it penetrate? Ironically, Hillary Clinton supporters should appreciate the story of this woman, as she is a brilliant, co-equal partner in the Obama marriage, fully independent and strong. "That is why I love this country" is the sound bite of the night.
8:20 MDT: [Nate] And ... it's probably good that Claire McCaskill was not the VP nominee.
8:15 MDT: Waiting for the other big moment of the night, the Michelle Obama speech. Happened to share a ride from the airport last night with Rep. Brad Miller (D-NC), who reports Obama now has 50 field offices in North Carolina. For those of you who may remember Miller's 2006 race featured a truly deranged opponent named Vernon Robinson, dubbed "the black Jesse Helms." Robinson raised over $2 million to run overtly racist, homophobic ads that included a claim that the married Miller was a gay lover of the married Markos Moulitsas. Showing grace and good humor, Miller posted a diary at DailyKos later titled "Markos and I Are Just Good Friends." Miller won 64-36. His opponent this year only has $15,000, so Miller should coast.
7:42 MDT: This is Nate jumping in for a quick comment. Call me a grouch, and this is probably my background in sports journalism kicking in, but I find the cheering in the room kind of annoying (here in the Blogger Tent, not the Pepsi Center).
7:33 MDT: "I pledge to you that I will be there next January on the floor of the United States Senate."
7:28 MDT: There had been a buzz of social conversation inside the Big Tent prior to the Kennedy Moment, but when Caroline Kennedy began speaking, the crowd mostly quieted and began gluing into the the screens strewn around the room. In spite of the younger skew of the blogger crowd, there was a clear sense of respect paid and historical understanding for the long shadow Ted Kennedy casts over his party. When Kennedy says during the video montage "it's time for Barack Obama," the room bursts into applause. Wild applause at the introduction.
7:19 MDT: Caroline Kennedy is speaking, introducing what promisesto be the emotional fulcrum of the evening, Ted Kennedy's appearance at the DNC...
7:18 MDT:. Live from Denver, it's Monday at the Democratic National Convention! It's been a busy, up-energy day here, the streets teeming with delegates, merchandisers, bloggers, media cognoscenti, a handful of Hillary Clinton marchers and a visible presence of SWAT/Denver police. There's a good vibe in the blogger area, but that could just be the beer. Anyway... on to the liveblog.
8.25.2008
Monday Night Liveblog: Live From Denver
@ 9:18 PM
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
262 comments
David Gergen argued that the Dems wasted the first hour or two of the convention by having nothing made for television ready to go. I wonder to what extent the time delay will be a problem for people here in the east who don't stay up late. Of course, many of the key states this time around are either in Central or Mountain time, so it might be slightly less critical.
I'm sorry, but it just has to be said: Caroline Kennedy is a painfully dull speaker. The introduction of Teddy Kennedy should have been a passionate, electric moment but it came across like a deeply overworked diner waitress reciting the night's specials.
Yeah, Caroline wasn't so dramatic, but I'm not sure that she really needs to be. I think that Teddy will be plenty engaging. She, after all, is just introducing the video, which then builds up to Sen. Kennedy himself. I get your point though.
Jesse Jackson, Jr. was pretty dang electrifying, too.
Teddy still knows how to speak with emphasis. And turn some nice phrases.
Okay, can I complain about CNN. I just switched over to their coverage, and they have this sound meter on the left hand side of the screen that seems totally pointless. Why do we care precisely how loud it is on the floor? Isn't this the kind of silly thing that gives cable news a bad name? I find it very distracting.
Kennedy still looks to be in pretty good shape, despite his recent health problems. Whatever you think of his politics, he is a forceful and compelling speaker.
well, he sure was 100 time's better at speaking then nancy pelosie.......atleast he go aplause..........haha.
CNN has turned me off completely apart from Larry King. The rest of them are no different than tabloid journalists.
For the most part I'm watching C-Span and flipping to MSNBC to watch their interviews in between.
I'm still sitting at work so I can't watch cable coverage. Watching from MSNBC's site, which oddly enough is just a direct feed with no talking heads.
Sean/Nate - Is that a house band that's playing in between speakers or prepared music? Either way it's kinda cheesy, but I guess that doesn't offend and has the most broad appeal. I would rather have talking heads in between speeches than listen to it though. Ugh.
Moving, and approaching stirring.
The only thing I didn't like about the Kennedy tribute was the horrible cover version of "Still The One" that followed. I mean, since a member of the original band responsible for the song is at the convention as a superdelegate, they should have done better!
(Oh, I hate the CNN sound meter as well.)
To me, it didn't even matter what Ted said. The fact that he was there, and showed his passion, meant everything.
No matter what party you identify with, his historical role and moment is touching.
This convention is boring! I think I am going to go watch my town's water tower rust, which would be far more entertaining.
Come on, Pelosi? She is a joke! Even democrats hate her! I am surprised she has an approval rating north of 10%.
Ted Kennedy once again pushing something that would have killed him a few months back. Universal healthcare would not have saved Ted Kennedy because his operation would not be performed under universal healthcare, he needed superior current American healthcare to survive.
Can't wait to hear more America-hating, excuse making, whining, and pointing out/exploiting American's "flaws".
Forget CNN, watch MSNBC.
If you don't like it, then don't watch it Tyrone. The only person whining is you.
I agree. CNN and particularly MSNBC should be ashamed of themselves this evening. The first two hours of events they blubbered on about PUMAS instead of actually covering the events on the ground.
MSNBC even broadcast Hardball and Road to the Whitehouse (usually one of my favorite shows) in front of a PUMA protest (3 dozen mainly Republican PUMAS, scattered among a huge volume of Obama supporters.
Pathetic.
Caroline Kennedy is the highlight so far. She was impressive.
C-Span has no ads and no "anchors".
"MSNBC even broadcast Hardball and Road to the Whitehouse (usually one of my favorite shows) in front of a PUMA protest (3 dozen mainly Republican PUMAS, scattered among a huge volume of Obama supporters."
I live across the street, and I was walking by the taping of Hardball a few hours ago. Three dozen is a very generous count for the 'Hillary' supporters. It was mostly middle-aged to older women, and a few tall, overweight men. They were much louder than their numbers - I'd say Obama people outnumbered the McCain/Hillary supporters at least 5:1.
Jim Leach is a hoot.
Ben, what did you expect them to do? Pick up and move the platform once the PUMAs set up shop?
Since Rachel Maddow is having her own show on MSNBC- she should have Patrick J. Buchanan as her Conservative Guest Host .
At the beginning of the segment they should play the All in the Family theme song.
Tyrone:
Please provide some backup to your assertion that universal health care worsens coverage.
The current system worsens coverage because it makes doctors a)specialize because they get better pay (better virtual worth units that determine pay within hospital/HMO structure), then b) try to do things outside their specialization because they won't get paid if they see a patient and give a referral to another specialist.
The result: Worse overall care.
Did you know that the US Army provides medical coverage to Veterans and dependents of soldiers? My parents (formerly in private practice) provide care for our soldiers and their families, and they, along with all the health care providers in the nation-wide system that cares for our fighting forces, do not slack off or stop fighting to save lives because they are paid by the government. They do not hire incompetents because they are cheaper; they fight tooth and nail to get any hiring done at all due to red tape and human resources being paranoid and distrustful. They've been forced to use horrible database software (meant to replace patient files) that reduce their level of care, wastes hours, and makes patients angry, and they do it because they can't treat their patients otherwise.
Implying that what my parents do, what doctors and nurses and pharmacists and therapists and surgeons all the myriad specialists do is for the money alone is extremely ignorant. You are relating the costs an HMO slaps on top of actual fees to the quality of care, which is total bullshit.
Also, chew on this: People come from overseas to get training in american Medical schools and hospitals... then go home and do the procedures for vastly less, with no decline in the level of care.
Tyrone, you can take your assertion and shove it, because you are completely, utterly wrong.
Brad Miller's my congressman! He's done a lot of good, pro-science work in the House.
You can tell Buchanan and Maddow respect and like each other in a weird kind of way.
Virginia,
Awhile back on Rachel's radio show, she said she and Pat have bonded over cheesy spy movies.
Ugh, I just went to a bad mental place thinking of Pat Buchanan and Rachel Maddow in bed together.
I missed it, so what did McCaskill do that prompted the 8:20 entry?
Rachel and Pat do have good on-screen chemistry. I think she doesn't take him so seriously and he tones down his barbs because he seems to have a genuine respect for her. I've never seen to people so ideologically apart laugh together so much on TV. Pat Buchanan is not a bad pundit really. I surely disagree with him, but he's a relatively intelligent and logical guy when it comes to analysis.
KS.
MSNBC certainly played it up for all it was worth in the "drama" department. They had to know that they set themselves up for this, and they did nothing to address it except for have Matthews go out and let people call Obama a registered Muslim who went to a radical madrassa without even pointing out the falsity of this smear. I thought it was a sad moment (one of many) in journalism.
justaguy8282 said...
"I'm sorry, but it just has to be said: Caroline Kennedy is a painfully dull speaker."
Caroline Kennedy is really shy.
CNN is pissing and moaning because there's no red meat being flung into the crowd. Fair enough, but what did they expect? I mean, look at the line-up. The only two names that jumped out were Teddy and Michelle Obama.
2004 Opening Night
Jimmy Carter
Al Gore
Hillary Clinton
Bill Clinton
But yeah, strange opening night. Maybe they're getting the sentimentality out of the way first? Like I said, what were they expecting from tonight's speakers?
At least Rachel pointed out the non sequitur response that McCain has made his response of choice for EVERY issue. "I was a POW, I don't have to be competent at anything or accountable for any mistake" - John McCain
I like Michelle Obama's brother wearing the orange tie and black suit - Oregon state's colors (where he coaches).
McCaskill's a dreadful speechmaker, but an outstanding attack dog--the difference between her giving a scripted speech and in a town hall-type setting is as stark as I've ever seen.
A heads-up to everyone: stats, news, bumps, etc. might be dwarfed by Hurricane Gustav. It's a tropical storm now, but all the models have it sitting as a major hurricane in the Gulf by Sunday. Deus ex machina, so to speak.
Link to the forecast models:
http://www.wunderground.com/tropical/tracking/at200807_model.html#a_topad
"You can tell Buchanan and Maddow respect and like each other in a weird kind of way."
Yes, I've noticed that also. They are both smart and tough, but they're also practically opposites in most other ways. It's reassuring, in a way, that they can disagree so vehemently and yet get along well. I suppose that Carville and Matalin have that going on even more, but they both seem strange and warped to me. Pat and Rachel seem more real, somehow.
de montfort,
Eww, I just saw your post. Not a pretty picture. Of course, Rachel is gay, so it's not likely to happen.
David -
Weather Underground. Ironic. But thanks for the heads up.
Not a fan l of that dress...she also looks nervous, which is out of character.
Now she's loosening up. Still nervy, though.
This night was always gonna be a wash. I'm not sure why they'd write it off.
@sedi
Pat probably thinks he can 'bring em back!' lol
Yeah, Michelle's speech isn't really doing it for me. Maybe it's not aimed at me. It's not bad, just not a lot of energy to it. It's obligatory for the spouse to speak, and she needs to get in front of the media. The rest of the week should be good though.
David,
That hurricane isn't going to clear cuba until the weekend.
I'm surprised there’s not more positive commentary on this speech. I think this is actually a really really good speech. She had come across as militant and angry and un-American to some, and this speech just totally stops those arguments cold.
Tito:
The speech seems oriented to women, HRC supporters, and doing as much damage to the 'Elitist' assertion as possible.
It's not meant to be energetic, it's meant to be an appeal to emotion and counter to the charges the GOP wants to make.
Theme of the night: Pass the hanky.
I think she pulled it off, at the end. She came off as sincere.
Ahhhh, kids.
It wasn't a stemwinder, but she really did a great job.
Wow. 39 Comments and only one about this this entry: Michelle Obama's speech - which just ended this moment. I must say I'm sorry the speech didn't do it for Tito. I thought it was amazing. She hit all the right notes, and delivered it flawlessly. Reminded me of her husband four years ago, or Clinton's acceptance speech in '92.
well, the reason we have men and women in the world is that we need both reason and heart. i found michelle's speech pretty dang impressive - a smart woman who is interested in improving the world around her rather than being primarily concerned about wealth and status
so if you men couldn't connect, don't worry, we women sure could! and it does take both!
SNED, I don't disagree but I never bought into all that BS myself. Like I said, maybe it wasn't aimed at me. Yeah, for those people who want to hate on her, she did a lot to silence their fear-mongering.
That follow up bit with Barack was an awesome, with a good look at them as a family. The daughters are adorable.
Ok - several posts about the speech made it up while I was typing...
Is Tom Brokaw drunk?
All in all, YAWN!!!!
At least she God Blessed America this time.
I hope it's not too late, in light of Obama's horrid campaign over the last month, for this to be salvaged, but I liked Michelle's speech quite a bit (though I agree the dress was not so great). I liked the kids -- and how Obama handled them on the big screen -- even more. They, unlike almost everything else, were not scripted, and Obama let them have a little time to be kids. You would not see kids grabbing the mike at the Republican convention in this manner. Good stuff which ought to get more air than how many houses either one of the candidates has.
sarasotajoe -
I'm a political junkie, not watching for emotional appeals. I think your comparisons are a bit of a reach too. Barack's speech in '04 was spectacular. This definitely wasn't the same kind of moment. To each his own though.
I wish I was drunk watching her speech.
She also didn't open up anything to attack, which Obama's team is probably terrified of at this point.
I was only listening, so I didn't see that the kid grabbed the mic; as such, I thought it had been scripted and the kid had the mic to start, which annoyed me.
Michelle did a fantastic job. I did not know she was such an effective speaker.
I also loved the unscripted family interaction.
jack, go and molest the neighbors cat or something.
Oh come on! She said that hard working people should have a chance to make it -- if that's not un-American, I don't know what is. Commie! And her pro-children agenda...that's not the kind of message that will resonate with American voters. This woman is scary. She probably breathes fire. David Gergen is busy panning her speech right now, I bet. And then having the kids come out -- nobody likes to see kids saying "I love you" to their parents. That's not going to move anybody. Nice try, Obamas, but you'll have to do better.
VA Con, I think I did see her clutching a bottle of Bordeaux and a whole bundle of arugula. What an elitist!
[Sometimes I just have to channel my inner bizarro self]
I thought Michelle's speech was fine. Nothing too fancy, but solid and it certainly won't hurt any. The real drama (good or bad) will start tomorrow night with Hillary's speech.
this was some speech. it was a home run with women and that was the key demographic. also--making the case that they are an American family like any other. All around they did exactly what they wanted tonight.
Unfortunately with the foiled assassination attempt (see TPM) now looking serious tomorrow this might not get as much play as it should.
I read up on Vernon Robinson...he sounds like he is a real charmer!
Of course, it makes me wonder about the regression model for North Carolina. If North Carolina is being turned into "one big fiesta for gays and Hispanics", has that properly been factored into the voting model? That could make a big difference on election day.
David at 9:35,
I hope you are kidding about that hurricane; that would really suck. Any possibility it could speedup and hit Denver by Thursday.
By the way, Fox is really dissing Michelle.
Heh, Matthew, we still talk about Vernon Robinson's Big Gay Fiesta here.
Porridge Gun,
Wow, that is a great come back. Don't you think your are up past your bed time. Hurry up and go to bed before mommy comes in and gives you a spanking.
LAT -
I just read about that assassination plot like 20 minutes ago. That's some craziness. Makes me wonder about some of the commenters here...
jack black:
Should we suddenly expect the tabloid right wing at FOX to not attack Michelle?
Tyrone-
"Ted Kennedy once again pushing something that would have killed him a few months back."
How much of a jerk do you have to be to say something like this?
Jack Black-
"By the way, Fox is really dissing Michelle."
No way. I am shocked that Fox would be dissing Michelle Obama. Next you are going to post that the earth revolves around the sun.
I think I know what they should've done. Have Michelle on Tomorrow follwing after keynoter Mark Warner, and instead give tonight to the Clintons.
Or maybe they were really clever to put her out tonight. With Teddy, Michelle, Barack and the kids, they've softened Hillary supporters up to support Obama. And tomorrow Hillary will seal the deal. Does that make semse?
Of course, the MSM have totally missed that, they wanted some red meat.
I like the way they feathered her hair up.
But her fidgety, herky-jerky body language really told alot about her that a generic speech like that one couldn't hide.
Let me tell you this, I would NOT want to get into a debate with that woman. She would get unreasonable REALLY quick.
Jen, be careful mentioning that whole "earth around the sun" thing. The Republican trolls here might think it's a liberal plot to push a scientific agenda to defy the word of God.
jack - go troll somewhere else
Vernon Robinson is closing in on Chris Elliot as my favorite youtube comedian!
Good speech. She is so lovely, charming and intelligent. They are a very sweet family.
Tito, it's ignorant shit like that..that makes you look like an a-hole. What the f(*k does a comment like that add to anything you f**(king troll.
tito - i like that, let's start an earth around the sun rumor and see whether the trolls bite
Jen,
Don't get mad at me, I'm just posting what I hear; Cnn was no better, really turning into the Clinton News Network, look for more fireworks in the future from CNN. All in All, YAWN!!!
Tito--yes some craziness and one wonders what they listen to that drives them ah? Hopefully this is not very big.
I really thought the speech was great.
The only thing that Michelle Obama skit had going for it was the kids and Barack puff piece at the end. Serious people won't be swayed by anything like that. She still came off as latently angry and awfully liberal.
@jack black:
David's overexaggerating Tropical Storm Gustav a bit. It could become a serious hurricane, but there's a lot of land it will have to avoid to get there. Those in S. Florida should monitor it's progress. It could be there by Saturday. If the storm makes it into the Gulf, landfall would be a week away. Something to watch out for as a couple of the hurricane computer models have this storm as a major hurricane moving into the Gulf in 5 days.
ScottGA,
The latest discussion on Gustav raises the growing concern of it missing most of Cuba and going just to the north of the island.
One model has it being a major hurricane (Cat 3+) in 3 days.
prairiecomm,
Wow, another great comeback; you must be in what the 9th grade. You're up past your bed time along with porridgegun, and had better get to bed before Mommy comes in and spanks your butt.
Stop the Stutter,
Give em hell fellow; Okay, I have been trying to be nice, but Monday night at the Democratic Convention sucked!!!!!!!!
It was boring as shit and another tribute to the ONE who will arrive when the seas part and save the day; another we are the ones you have been waiting for;
I predict ODUMBO goes down in the polls tomorrow.
jack,
Tito is a total hack. All he does is snipe his bullshit lines and calls just about anyone with whom he disagrees with a "troll". Like the idea of trolls is simply a synonym for conservative. F&#k that. If we're trolls, then hes a God damn Ogre! OOOOOHHH I said God. That's like, forbidden language to a lib. That'll piss em off.
"Let me tell you this, I would NOT want to get into a debate with that woman. She would get unreasonable REALLY quick."
"She still came off as latently angry and awfully liberal."
Yeah, she sure did seem angry and unreasonable. And so black, too! And what about all those awful liberal things she talked about, like working hard to achieve your dreams or giving women the right to vote? They might as well have projected a hammer and sickle on the screen behind her.
jack black said...
"Porridge Gun,
Wow, that is a great come back."
Cheers!
@ People watching FOX Noise after Michaell's speech. Were they criticizing her for anything legitimate - what she said, her nervousness? Or was it typical throwing cold water on a genuinely nice moment featuring the family?
I suspect it's the letter.
stop_the_stutter said...
A bunch of useless shit.
Hey, asshat, I was calling out the Republican trolls here. Didn't name anyone in particular. But since you seem so offended, then I guess that makes you one of the people I targeted. Thanks for self-identifying. You calling me a troll and saying I added nothing to the discussion is such delicate and bittersweet irony.
By the way, the word is "fuck". If you're gonna use the word and directed at someone, you might as well spell it out. Otherwise you just look like a retarded kid who's parents would get on to him for using such language. Oh, wait...
Stop the Stutter,
They are just very nervous after the i hate AMerica lady gave her speech. The only minds it changed were the Puma's, who will definitely not vote for ODUMBO now.
did you hear her when she mentioned CLinton's name, you could see the fangs coming out of her mouth.
"Or maybe they were really clever to put her out tonight."
Yes, I think that tonight was the night. Michelle did three key things with her speech. 1. Dispelled any notions about her being an extremist or out-of-the-mainstream person. She came across as normal and well adjusted. 2. Personalized Barack and his family situation, making him a family man and not just a politician. The kids really helped with that also. 3. Went a long way towards combating the accusation of elitism. 4. Put the focus on strong women and their struggle for a voice in our society. This really does work to "soften up," if you will, some resentful Clinton supporters.
A highly effective speech, in my estimation. It didn't need to be grand in its rhetoric (stop_the_stutter uses "generic" to describe it) and was probably much better for not being too complicated. As Chris Matthews just remarked, "I think the reachables were reached." She doesn't need to win over jack black or stop_the_stutter, she just needs to win over my mom.
stop_the_stutter:
Amazing that you're able to tell so much based on your preconceived notions and confirmation bias.
Latently angry? Why don't you just say what you know is true, that she's about to blow herself up and kill whitey, since she's a militant black woman with a huge chip on her shoulder who can't be reasoned with and married to a secret muslim and they both feast on the souls of snow-white christian aborted fetuses?
Oh, and she's a commie, too.
No, I'm not saying you're racist.
I'm saying you're only seeing what you want to see, and your language reflects that. So why the pretense of civility when it's clear you can't stand her? I didn't watch most of it, but all I saw was her being nervous, trying to make eye contact with the crowd and knowing just how important her speech was as a setup for the rest of the convention.
It's interesting how bias colors perception, isn't it?
Tonight was defense. Tomorrow will be offense, courtesy of HRC.
Ergo,
No mention of government getting out of the way.
No real mention of our military.
No mention of how great our freedom is in this nation.
Nothing but liberal fodder in that speech. Since when is hard work a partisan thing? Invalid point.
"so black too" Ignorant comment, so's my wife.
Okay, I'm just going to say that even Pat Buchanon said it was effective. I mean, he's about as conservative as they come. It was a good speech and those who are undecided and who don't know a lot about the Obama's is who that speech was aimed towards. It was effective.
PorridgeGun,
I take your post was suppose to be an apology, so you are forgiven.
Yes, the said her speech sucked and would not change any minds. Liberal agendas, etc.
Tito,
Must you use such foul language, can't we use the word fornicate, or slap and tickle,or taking the big sausage, or my favorite, taking the big WANKER where the golden sunshine rests.
You're right, her whole proud of our nation for the very first time, I view as not a misstep, but a Freudian slip....and it soured me to her. I view her whole notion that we need to share a larger portion of the pie IS commie. So what's your point?
someone on MSNBC compares the Obama with the Huxtables. Does that mean the Obama daughters are Rudy.
Stop the Stutter-
"Let me tell you this, I would NOT want to get into a debate with that woman. She would get unreasonable REALLY quick."
I doubt she could get as unreasonable as you. What does this have to do with anything.
Jack Black-
"I predict ODUMBO goes down in the polls tomorrow."
I predict you will come back on here tomorrow and post something stupid.
Seriously guys, you clearly are not Democrats, nor swing voters, so why would you expect to be interested in or impressed by the Democratic Convention?
Jesus Christ, Buddha, and George Washington could return to earth and tell you that Obama would make a fantastic president and you would still be posting here about how much you think he sucks.
Tito,
I pity people like you. I honestly feel a sense of sadness that there are people in this world that have the mental image of the world like you do.
You live in the greatest land on Earth, arguabley, have access to the greatest opportunities on Earth, UNargueably, and how do you use it? To come on here and call people asshats and trolls. You have a great life!
If you want to turn it around, consider:
What if Michelle went on the offense against McCain? Wouldn't that play DIRECTLY into the 'angry militant black woman' that the GOP wants her to be? Wouldn't that crush the 'happy family' image, and open up an attack point on family values?
Now Jen,
Don't get all emotional. Just because we think the lady is a left wing, muslim loving, America hating, gun grabbing, baby killing communist doesn't mean we dislike her!
Far to the contrary, I thought she looked lovely in a Amazonian sort of way!
Jen,
I would bet my entire Ameritrade account that she is the type of person that would shout you down in a one on one. You honestly couldn't see that in her body language?
You don't have to be a Democrat to opine on her speech. Most real Dems are already in the tank for Obama. This was meant to appeal to all NON-Dems.
Aside from what spews from her brain, Michelle Obama is kinda hot...for a 40-something.
Jen'
I know Jesus Christ, Buddha and George Washington, and they wouldn't be for ODUMBO.
Jack,
I'm in ninth grade, what can I do for ya? Anyway, i found the DNC boring tonight, but at the same time i found it annoying that the media thinks things have to be nasty to be interesting. It very well could have been interesting tonight it just happened not to be because it was the sentimental night.
stop the stutter,
I don't think Jen wants to play anymore.
If Michelle was a man she wouldn't be viewed in the way she is. It is so funny to me how a lot of Clinton supporters trash her for being out spoken. Curious. Also, why is it that conservatives don't have a strong woman presnece ever? Maybe I'm too young to remember one besides Nancy Reagon.
jack black said...
"Yes, the said her speech sucked and would not change any minds. Liberal agendas, etc."
That's why I stopped watching FAUX News years ago. They can piss on her all they want. Unfortunately for them, Teddy, Tears, and the Huxtables will be the only pictures on the morning shows. I'm not saying I like it, for me the entire opening night was contentless. But Americans DO love sentimentality.
RE: Proud of my country comment.
Wanna know something? I turned 18 in April 2000. Since I became a legal adult, I've watched my country engage in an irrational war, torture, illegal wire tapping, uber-partisianship and division, the ignoring of our veteran's medical needs, and swiftboating, and watching people being called traitors or unpatriotic just 'cause they don't agree with the government, among many other things.
I've been paying close attention to these primaries and this election.
I WANT to say that for the first time in my adult life I'm proud of my country.
There have been times I've come close, but there's always something that just squelches that pride right back down.
Just LISTENING to Obama, and Biden(growing more and more confident he was the perfect choice), and a lot of the other democrats speaking lately, brings back some of that pride.
People forget that loving one's country means that sometimes you have to be critical of it, and of your government. Our country is BUILT on dissent and differing opinions.
Awww, stop_the_stupid feels sorry for me. Awwww... Awwww.
I'm gonna go to my bed and cry myself to sleep. Awwww.
Piss off dude. Everyone here knows you're a troll. Probably working up your McCain Action Points or whatever that ponzi scheme is.
My original comment had nothing to do with you, didn't mention you, nada. And yet you want to get into some sort of flame war pissing match with me so you inserted yourself into this. If it bothers you so much, do the adult thing and tune it out. If I responded to every asinine thing you posted on this site I would go batshit insane. So why don't you stop being such an attention whore with your whole looking to pick a fight agenda and do something constructive with your time. Perhaps some coloring books or pokemon.
jack,
I hope for the sake of the never50+ers, that the dems can do better tomorrow.
Michelle had a real chance to personalize Barack tonight. There were only generic pieces of nonsense mentioned.
Notice nothing about God or Religion? Not until the VERY end when she managed to awkwardly spit out God bless America, did I remember her mentioning anything about a higher power than her grandiose vision of her husband.
Tito,
you are a hack.
STUUTER
you are either intentionally lying or you did not watch & listen to Michelle's speech.
so stop the troll spamming, please.
to try to say she didn't speak about the military is just plain false.
I actually thought she gave a remarkable speech for a non-politician [compare her to Caroline Kennedy fer crissakes]
AND I watched it on PBS with my 79 y/o mom in FL at her request. She loved her some Michelle and thought the speech was excellent. It went right to her heart & she was almost in tears with happiness.
Mom loved the topics she spoke on [mom was not a Hill fan though], loved the dress & lack of accessories, adored the kids BIGTIME, thought Obama was nice & modest on the screen at the end, and cannot for the life of her understand why some of her friends think that Michelle is not likeable or patriotic.
Mom loved her shout-outs to the military families, to working women, on healthcare, poverty, community activism, liked her brother & was enchanted by the intro video with the voice-over from Michelle's mom. Now the granny voice was BRILLIANT & connecting for the target audience of women & elderly for sure by my personal focus group. A homerun !
I was totally surprised as my expectations were low on such success in that forum.
Mom says she will finally live to see a real family oriented, happily married PROFESSIONAL women as First Lady [if not POTUS].
And to top it off, no comments on how 'black' Michelle was from mom [who bless her heart has some residual prejudices BTW].
Barb-doll, spoiled Cindy McCain who never met a charge card she didn't wanna max while living large on daddy's fortune in numerous houses + an estate & breakin up marriages/adultery will have a BIG disadvantage in topping Michelle with her speech & a life story that everyman & especially every regular american WOMAN can relate to. No contest IMHO.
CONGRATS, Michelle Obama on a job exceedingly well done in reaching your target audience.
She will make a wonderful 1st Lady !
sniperct watches too much network news. He's fed into the one-sided dung handed out by Brokaw and the sort. Yes, we are an AWFUL country that does nothing but evil evil things.
jack black said...
"Don't get all emotional. Just because we think the lady is a left wing, muslim loving, America hating, gun grabbing, baby killing communist doesn't mean we dislike her!"
I KNEW you were just pulling our legs all this time! And to think I actually thought you were serious... well done sir, well done.
How does Obama's 50 North Carolina offices compare with Kerrys NC Offices 4 years ago and even Obama's VA offices?
military families does not equal military.
It is a snipe at the war, dude.
"A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject." - Churchill
Just keep talking about the speech...it will just keep reminding us all how amazing good it was. I would only have wondered about the validity of her speech had some of you posters actually *liked* it. Thank you for hating it and keep it up please.
stop_the_stutter:
Good thing you've never misspoken in your life, better still that hostile eyes aren't watching you and waiting to pounce on any slip.
No second chances for a first impression, and evidently no chance of redemption in your eyes.
I'll admit my knowledge of communism is minimal, being born in the 80's.
But being a liberal is not the same as communism, that much I know.
All through the speech was the thread of 'enabling' Americans to succeed, even when they get screwed over by circumstances beyond their control.
That isn't communism; there's no single pay scale, there's no state control of all resources, and it isn't even a nanny/welfare state. There was no mention of gun control (after all, how could the obamas hope to shoot up whitey if the fuzz took their guns?), nothing about burning the constitution and adopting the communist manifesto, etc.
Of course, if you didn't like "liberal ideas" in the first place, of course your view would be tainted by a slip up.
Really, only education and health care were featured with any prominence. That plays well to HRC supporters, who may recall her attempt to pass that measure. And they're the party platform.
Enabling people by giving them more opportunities to succeed and not forcing them into artificially created jobs seems like a good idea to me. But then, I'm an atheist Pinko with too much empathy for the suffering of others, so you can discount my opinion entirely.
STUTTER
now you are just being an ass about the military. Like Michelle is supposed to talk policy - you are a tosser...
very sad, but not unexpected from a guy who supports tha man that believes he gets a pass on all his foibles because he was a POW 40 years ago...
BE GONE troll
beowulf,
I thought it was a decent speech and that's from a Republican perspective. Granted I thought it was a little boring, I'm sure the Democrats loved hearing what they hope is the future First Lady's story and see her with her children.
stop_the_stutter,
She could have shouted KILL WHITEY for her entire speech and those unscripted moments with the family at the end would still have done the job. Even the conservatrolls said the liked it.
Michelle Obama did fantastically.
However, it's interesting to watch Fox Noise. You'd think that someone did flash the sickle and hammer behind her during the whole speech...
I mean, geez, these damn liberals talking about doing hard work to achieve your dreams. Since when are women supposed to work? Aren't they supposed to be chained to their ovens, constantly preggers and pushing out babies?
How very UnAmerican that she talked about the value of hard work, morals, family values, patriotism, and love of country. Who does this pinko commie think she is? You could just tell that she was ready to do that "Black Panther Fist Bump" with her kids. And what kind of terrorist brings children to a convention? What does she think a convention is, some communist daycare center?
And then barack HUSSEIN obama comes out of his secret cave, where we're sure he's training suicide bombers, to appear Big Brother-like on a big screen to indoctrinate his children in his Muslim ideology! You could just hear them Muslims in the background yelling, "Allahu Akbar!" Then they showed that poor white Midwestern Christian family that's being held as hostages in exchange for the release of the prisoners at Guantanamo Bay huddling in fear next to barack HUSSEIN obama.
Shouldn't the CIA shut this whole thing down?
Besides STUUTER
we are not at war, since there was no declaration made BTW.
Call it what it really is. We INVADED & are OCCUPYING a sovereign nation that did not attacked or threatened us.
BUSH & CHENEY lied, so many people died.
Drowzee,
Minus the sarcasm at the end, I admire the honesty of your post.
Michelle did say the proud of country comment two different times though. That is why it really sucks.
The one payscale can be enforced through several different ways, one of which is an overly aggressive progressive tax scale. (didn't mean to rhyme that). This creates disincentive to produce....since it will be overtaxed. That is the line that Obama is toeing all too closely when you really dive into his tax policies, including the carbon caps. It's scary stuff if you believe in keeping our economy moving in the right direction.
James - The easiest path is to not listen and then attack, regardless of what actually was said. Thank you for taking the harder path by listening.
DCM,
Stop your liberal propoganda talking points that sound an awful lot like some bumber stickers I saw recently. True, there was never a declaration of war. Force was authorized by Congress and under the Constitution that's good enough. We are not required to ask the permission of the international community (thank goodness, they're pansies) and British, German, French, Russian, and American intelligence all pointed to WMD's. Give it up.
DCM, that is how you want to look at Iraq...fine. It's pretty fucked up, but it's your opinion.
We diposed of a dictator that vilolated 17 different parts of a UN agreement. Are we all supposed to what? Talk? Look the other way? After a while your options become limited. Even good ol' Bill Clinton bombed Iraq from time to time....
Thank you for being civil beowulf. I appreciate that you can compliment me even if we disagree completely on practically everything.
James,
stop your diatribe TROLL!
Don't you know that you're living in a world where Michelle Obama's speech was like nectar from the Gods? And there is NOOOO way possible that the moment at the end with the kids wasn't even a liiiitle bit choreographed?
We're both pounding our heads against cement here.
Sean, Mischelle is "strong" but she is not "brilliant."
Michelle admitted to Newsweek that she got into Harvard Law School via affirmative action.
She failed the July 1988 Illinois bar exam that she took before starting at Sidley & Austin in fall 1988.
She was only a lawyer for a few years befoire becoming a PR person/administrator for the University of Chicago.
Yes, because, you know, EVERYBODY watches the first couple hours of the convention. That's when you should have all your big names go. I'm sure they had a 25 share for those first two hours.
Or not.
I loved Michelle's speech. She did exactly what she had to do- sell herself as a strong woman, a real person (not just a joke to be put on the New Yorker), and a good first lady. She made no attacks, she made no references to race, and her talkingn about her dad tugged the heartstrings. Her mention of Hillary was good too.
The next time some idiot in the Republican Party wants to go after her, there'll be a heavy backlash. I don't give a crap that Carville didn't like it. Offense gets ratings, but defense wins championships. And wins elections. They knew exactly what they were doing on this one.
Ted Kennedy made a great speech, as always.
Tomorrow, we get to hear how McCain eats babies and forgets to wipe himself after he takes a dump. Today was a great introduction to the Obamas. I liked it a lot. The question is, for the non-puma Hillary supporters, how much did they like it?
I really couldn't care less what Team Troll thinks of it.
Ahaha I don't watch any network news at all. I get better, less partisan info from comedy central, unfortunately.
And various websites of course.
I'm not saying that this country ONLY does bad things, but I'm saying there's been precious few good things since I became an adult, to point out.
(mostly humanitarian stuff during disasters and the like. And Bush's african aids policy is actually pretty good. I also have to give him props for pushing for more manned space flight even if it was obviously to distract from the Iraq War at the time.)
But the US HAS done some very bad things, especially the last 8 years, but not limited to it(DEFINITELY not limited to it). We have to fess up to the bad, when we point out the good.
But what makes this a great country is the fact that I can say that. That we can all have these discussions in the first place, without fear.
Nice neo-con talking points JAMES & STUTTER
try to defend the morally indefensible & reprehensible actions of Bush & Cheney.
your twisted reality & warped sense of supremacy that Bush was annointed by the christian GOD to bring enlightenment to the entire world is pathetic, as well as apparently limited to creating 'democracy' only in oil-rich countries like IRAQ [as opposed to Sudan, etc.] where their BIG OIL & defense contractor cabal can get wealthier at the public trough off the sufferring of out military & foreigners...
how can you live with those lies that you are still telling yourself ?
you are the ones spreading neo-con talking points ad nauseum...
the worm turns so best crawl back under those rocks...
[McCain] forgets to wipe himself after he takes a dump.
Geez, there's a mental image I could have lived my life happily without.
sniperct,
I can respect that.
I just feel that the good is underreported because it doesn't get ratings.
Example: We know what our death toll is...but can you tell me (without looking it up) what our ENEMY's death toll is in the war?
Not that death is a good thing...but we are led to believe that our military is almost inept.
Wow, DCM. You are in loonsville tonight. Did you Deanscream after that irrational rant?
Michelle came off as 'authentic', so she will win over even more of the target - the Oprah demo & their peers.
No pearls around her neck - what a relief !
Agreed Stutter. News organizations rarely report U.S. good deeds because it doesn't attract ratings. DCM, your comments are so ridiculous I'm not even going to respond. You're clearly delusional and hateful. I will say this however. Where on earth did you get the idea that just because i'm a Christian makes me think President Bush was annointed to enlighten the world? Go see a psychiatrist.
DCM..this ones for you!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xiPXoIt3k-o&feature=related
an emailed message from Michelle Obama just before she spoke tonight:
"My mom, the girls, and I left home in Chicago and got to Denver yesterday. What a beautiful city!
The convention started this morning, and everyone here is getting ready for the big week.
All the work you've done is at the heart of what's happening here, and our team filmed a short video to give you a look behind the scenes at the convention center.
Take a minute to check out the video and share it with your friends:
http://my.barackobama.com/behindthescenes
This week, folks from across the country will get to know Barack and our family a little better. Tonight I'm giving a speech at the convention, and I'm planning to share a few stories about the Barack I know -- the husband, the father, and the man who shares my dreams for our girls, for this country, and for our future.
Before my speech, we're also going to show a video introducing our family to families across the country. Make sure to turn on your TV at 10:30 p.m. EDT (8:30 p.m. MDT) to see it, or you can watch it at www.BarackObama.com.
This is such an important moment, and I hope you'll join me by tuning into the convention tonight and all week long.
Thanks,
Michelle"
It is too late for Michelle. She already said her piece two times about how she's never before been proud of this nation.
She's already said that people with more pie need to give it up to those with less.
Everything she says now is probably HEAVILY scripted and predetermined. The Dems aren't going to let her find a new way for their candidate to lose in Nov.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMn6z6o3YCw&feature=related
James,
The voices of ignorance and hatred will always be louder and more numerous than those of simple reason. Neither "side" is even close to being immune.
You need only look at the comment sections for a few posts on this site to reinforce it.
(Or, in other words, people here need to settle the hell down, but they never will)
I'll take Michelle Obama over Percocet Cindy any day. But I didn't know we were voting for spouses...
We can take anyone's words and find a way to twist them if we really want to Stutter. John McCain "I never really loved the United States until I lost it"...we could twist away, but we don't...we know what he meant, just like we know exactly what Mrs. Obama meant.
eponymous,
I agree. I know I'm guilty of getting too riled up sometimes myself, but I'd like to think I do my best to keep people calm (especially Mule when he gets in those fights with Mason and DCM) People should remember that we're all Americans and God's children
How come Michelle neglected to mention that John McCain was a POW? The Democrats are disparaging McCain's service to his country by not pointing out in every speech that McCain is, in fact, a true POW.
Shame on Teddy Kennedy for not mentioning McCain's POW past.
eponymous and james,
I hear you. I had high hopes for this site, after hearing about it at baseballprospectus, nate's other site. It along with its partner sites footballoutsiders and basketballprospectus are a place where fans can go to have an intellegent discussion without any "your team sucks" comments. Unfortunately it seems as though once this great site started getting publicity the fools came rushing in and made at least the comment section an "i'm right your wrong" waste of time.
I don't blame nate, its just sad that there seems to be more people interested in being pompous arrogant jerks than interested in intellegent conversation. sigh.
No POW mention because she was too busy trying to redistribute the pie to the have-nots.
John McCain was a POW? I hadn't heard.
One would think being a POW was a requirement for being POTUS....
Hell, I leave the board for a few minutes and all hell breaks loose. DCM in FL must have been actually listening to Angry Black Woman, who hates her country; SOunds like there was some crying going on;
Stop the Stutter, keep up the good works. You are making many left wing nuts angry and incapable of making rational arguments.
Again, i predict Odumbo goes down in the polls tomorrow.
Jack,
Have you heard DCM's arguments? Sounds like straight out of a Bush-basher book to me lol. I guess we'll just have to wait till tomorrow to see the polls and Hillary's speech. I think it'll be an interesting one.
In the Democratic Party, requirements for being Potus include:
1. Must hate your country.
2. Must be a Muslim.
3. Must believe that people cling to bibles because they are bitter.
4. Must believe that people cling to their guns because they are bitter.
5. Must be against the Pledge of Allegiance.
6. Must believe that you sit at the right hand of God.
7. Must believe that it is okay to let babies die when they are born alive after abortion procedure-infanticide-just another name for birth control in the Democratic Party-known as Murder in the 1st Degree everywhere else.
I think DCM is some sort of abreviation from DeansCreaM
When you have a party so bereft of any meaningful substance...puff pieces and choreographed stage opportunities get you giddy.
The lack of intelligible ideas also leads to bashing of the other party. Unfortunately, since McCain doesn't really do it for me, I am somewhat in the camp of only bashing the other guy too...because he's worse.
JAMES
you only go further to prove your troll credentials.
BEHAVE or BE GONE
----------------------------------
here is the scientific rationale for your troll behavior...quoting:
"In today’s Nieman Watchdog we have an article that says:
The human brain…does not save information permanently, as do computer drives and printed pages. Recent research suggests that every time the brain recalls a piece of information, it is “written” down again and often modified in the process. Along the way, the fact is gradually separated from its original context. For example, most people don’t remember how they know that the capital of Massachusetts is Boston.
This phenomenon, known as source amnesia, leads people to forget over time where they heard a statement - and whether it is true. A statement that is initially not believed can gain credibility during the months that it takes to reprocess memories from short-term to longer-term storage. As the source is forgotten, the message and its implications may gain strength.
And here’s the corresponding lesson for journalists:
1. State the facts without reinforcing the falsehood. Repeating a false rumor can inadvertently make it stronger. In covering the controversy over a New Yorker cover caricaturing Barack and Michelle Obama, many journalists repeated the charges against the candidate - often citing polling data on how many Americans believe them - before noting that the beliefs were false. Particularly damaging is the common practice of replaying parts of an ad before debunking its content."
so your ilk just infest these sites to intentionally spread malicious nonsense in the hope it will stick. such sad & pathetic behaviour which would benefit from professional therapy - maybe.
JAMES
see what you get by encouraging the lowlife trolls such as STUTTER and KUNG FU PANDASS ???
you are in danger of sinking down to their noxious level...
DNFTT
Republican party membership must require that you be a lying, uneducated bigot. It sad that you other guys let folks like jack speak for your party.
TITO
agreed. they are trolling for their own personal spiteful hater purposes.
TITO
also because they are in desperate straits now that Kennedy & especially Michelle Obama gave such fantastic speeches.
These GOPer troll tools are in a panic...
DCM,
All I have to say is wow. I guess I'll take it as a compliment that you don't think I'm as low as jack and stutter, but then again it's probably not a good thing since jack and stutter are cool and you're just a liberal maniac. Tito, give it a rest. While we have lying, uneducated bigots in our party, so do you. Get used to it. The world's made up of them.
Comments on the night:
The Obama campaign had 6 hours of full cable coverage and thought it appropriate to use 1 hour as good TV and the rest with NOTHING. Ted Kennedy was great, Michelle Obama was fantastic, and the other 5 hours were useless. No attacking McCain, no convention theme, no message, nothing. It was like watching a bunch of amatures put a convention together.
Carville, who Obama fans may not like, was right on to discribe this as largly a waisted night. You have 4 nights to promote your agenda in front of the country unfettered and you waist 5 hours the first night. I could have put together something better than this crap. I must admit, the Obama campaign does not deserve to win this election with this garbage. Tonight was inexcusable. If the convention is when you put your best foot forward and show the country why you should lead, I heard 1 hour of riveting performance, and 5 hours of total amateur hour.
Responding that all republicans are a certain way really doesn't help...I know many wonderful republicans and these people do not represent them. Instead, they are desperate people who crave attention, enough so that they are willing to make fools of themselves on an open forum. They remind me a bit of the Jester character from medieval times...do anything for a response even if it destroys their dignity...let them.
DCM,
I said that I thought Michelle's speech was pretty good, just not from a Republican perspective. Did you miss that?
Just saw this...
http://cbs4denver.com/investigates/assisination.plot.obama.2.802827.html
Plot to Kill Obama: Shoot From High Vantage Point
Written By Brian Maass
DCM, it does seem like they've been in a panic since they found out that Hillary wouldn't be on the ticket. Now that the don't have anyone that they can get away throwing dirt at, I guess they've just gone full bore with the scummiest tactics they can come up with instead of being subtle or using innuendo. When you know you're gonna lose then I guess desperation is the only path left. So much for an election about policy and issues, it's all about the Angry Black Woman, Secret Muslims, and being a POW.
Thanks for saying that beowulf. I too know many wonderful Democrats, but don't think the people on this site represent them. You have to realize that all of us on here are political junkies from completely opposite ends of the spectrum, so obviously we're going to clash.
An assassination plot by a bunch of wankers - why am I not surprised?
I saw a clip of McCain on Jay Leno and heard him say he was a POW. Did anybody else hear that?
James, as long as you're in agreement with racist comments like jack black's, then please refrain from even pretending you have any place to tell me what to do. I'm sure you're probably used to giving orders, but I'm not one of your servants. Why don't you try disavowing their BS that makes your whole crop look bad.
SAL
yes, in response to the houses question from Leno.
and with a straight face, what a tool...
somebody smack that old coot
I did disagree with Jack's comments about Michelle being an "angry black woman." If (heaven forbid) Barack is elected, I think she'll make a great first lady. Just as many Democrats find Laura Bush likeable, I'm sure most Republicans would like Michelle Obama as first lady. While I disagree with some of her past statements, I thought she gave a good speech tonight defining herself and her family. Good enough?
If Obama does not stand up to this POW stuff he's going to regret it. The McCain camp is daring the Obama campaign to say something to accuse Obama of degrading McCain's military service, but I'd get right into it, and not back down over this. You could take the POW stuff off the table if you wanted too go hard enough and be willing to fight tooth and nail all the McCain counter attacks but Obama is acting like a scared little girl this election and Americans don't elect scared little girls.
I've seen this narrative before in 04 and 00. The Republicans lie, smear, and attack relentlessly, questioning your character and democrats do nothing. I am ashamed of my party this evening. We elected a nominee who doesn't have the balls to stand up for himself or go on the attack. I know how this play ends. Be prepared for a dissapointing November 5th.
BEOWOLF
it is not all GOPers we complain about. There are some who behave civilly & even inject partisanship which is all fine & even appreciated.
It is the shameless tools that spam lies & hate & baiting trash as well as disrepectful behavior that many find too objectionable to let pass after the endless abuse.
STUTTER, CRACKER JACK BLACK, and MULE RIDER are among the worst of the serial offender along with PETE the PARROT KENT when he goes off an his hateful spamming jags...
others that behave & contribute rational & logical on point posts are always welcome.
I find Pete Kent's posts enlightening if sometimes a bit odd. You guys have your weirdos too such as Cugel, yourself, and that guy named Smitty (only included him because I love the name :).
DCM - I agree, I was only commenting on Tito's one statement referring to all republicans.
I don't even read Pete Kent's posts. Not because they offend, though I get the gist of his post from the reaction. I just don't have the time or focus to read the novellas that he comes up with. I have to seriously wonder how much time he spends writing those things.
JAMES
well when you start encouraging the neo-con trolls on here, then your cred goes down as a civil partisan.
but you attacked me several times in a vindictive manner, so lose the high & mighty moral tone, OK ?
your more recent posts are better, but remember this jewel earlier ???
--------------------
James 11:24 PM said...
"Agreed Stutter... DCM, your comments are so ridiculous I'm not even going to respond. You're clearly delusional and hateful... Go see a psychiatrist."
And now you claim to be the rational poster ?
hypocrite. look in the mirror as your posts betray you.
BEHAVE or BE GONE
DNFTT
You've got a point Tito. He is a little long-winded, but I think the response is disproportionate. You should try reading them sometime, he uses lots of logic (though liberals would suggest it is incorrect.)
Wow. I just wasted a lot of my night reading half of this thread's over-partisan posts (from both sides of the aisle). Some of you folks are showing your relative political inexperience. Truthfully. Let's aim a little higher, ladies and gents.
Look: The Michelle Obama speech was fine. It wasn't mind-blowing, but it was solid and, though it contained some of the fluffy rhetoric of Obama at his worst, it was certainly a very humanizing portrait, as revealed to the Americans who know little about her. It was altogether fair that she mentioned her modest upbringing - a father with MS and a blue-collar job, and later, a single-parent household - and it was probably a good thing that she was a little nervous. If you would have told most Dem ops proir to the campaign that Mrs. Obama's speech would border on the solid-yet-inoffensive tip, they'd gladly take it.
Remember, most of us that post here are political junkies who have long-since solidified our opinions. There are millions of Americans who watched this speech (and Sen. Edward Kennedy's) without as calloused a mindset. This speech was for them and not us. On that point - in that it showcased an actual human behind the political caricatures often painted of her - it succeeded. Over the course of a political campaign, one of my least favorite experiences is annually watching as both sides attempt to convert their opponent into some Automaton of Hate that runs on the blood of infants. Through our support of our respective candidate, let's not become the very strawmen we attempt to erect.
beowulf, and I was only responding jack black's smears about the requirements to be the Dem nominee for president. I'm really fucking tired of hearing the secret muslim, race baiting, and all the other shit that his ilk come up with.
James,
"That guy named Smitty" is a grandmother.
Ah yes DCM I remember that one. That was when you were spouting that whole "Bush lied, kids died" nonsense. I standby that because I think everyone gets a little riled from time to time. I rebutted your claims and you didn't bother to rebut mine but rather responded with some nonsense about what you call "Big Oil". While I regret your irrational response, I do not apologize.
BEOWOLF
point taken. sorry but TITO & some of the other regulars on here [which BTW is fully disclosed as a liberal-leaning blog] get tired of the over-running of the threads by the noxious posts that ruin it for everyone.
We actually like to exchange perspectives with rational GOP posters who stay on point or at least in the general ballpark.
but when the troublemakers fling crap [literally] some of us feel we must call them on if.
most unfortunate though.
but at times there is civil discourse when the DEMS are not hatefully attacked first without provocation.
Smitty,
Glad to hear from you. As I said, I only included you in that list because I love the name. Enjoy your grandkids!
JAMES
I only attacked you when you attacked me first pal.
But I stand by "BUSH LIED, PEOPLE DIED". It is factual & you did not rebut it.
Still, I only posted that trite summary of the last 8 sad years because it was in response to hateful posts by the usual trolls which you then encouraged !
Sean/Nate,
I thought that requiring registration would remove the trolls through self-policing and the (laughable thought it may seem) effort it takes to set up accounts.
But it's gotten worse.
This is unreadable partisanship. Jack Black and Stop_the_stutter make First Read comments look like the writings of Aristotle by comparison. Can we PLEASE have some, any level of moderation to keep the mule riders et al from destroying any chance at a dialogue? Signal to noise ratio is getting absolutely abysmal, and I'd recommend either adding a couple moderators or going the FireJoeMorgan.com route and only allowing select comments.
But as it stands? This is a partisan wasteland where it was once pretty cool. Fame has a price I guess.
I have had a few civil exchanges with PETE KENT, but most deteriorate into the gutter when he posts the lengthy screeds that he also has spammed on multiple blogs.
Yes, PETE is a serial post spammer which even he admits. That is why he has those long rambling posts up so fast...
But when PETE goes off the deep end eventually about how we are all baby killers going to hell & how Obama is the devil incarnate, etc. then he must be smacked down & stopped for spreading that hateful manure...
VA CON is another GOPer partisan who from time-to-time can stay in bounds. But he goes overboard as well it seems.
The concern posters are just so annoying after awhile.
James,
No grandchildren...just my way of saying I am a female with gray hair.
So, young whippersnappers, it is a statistical fact that there are more female voters than male voters. Mrs. Obama's speech was directed to the majority.
Pander, I concur. The childish prattle is beginning to osmote into the valuable service this site provides. Let's not let that happen.
Yes, pander, and part of that price is that we have to have handwringing posts from those like yourselves who simply cannot resist jumping in and asking everyone to get along, and pleading for a civil bipartisan debate.
I don't begrudge you your sentiment, and I even understand it to a degree, but it's funny to me how someone *always* has to come along in these situations and complain about all the bickering.
There are two very simple solutions for you: (1) don't read the comments; or (2) don't read particular comments that annoy you, and post something yourself that advances a point of discussion. If you do that, I can promise you that several people on the Democratic side, at least, will respond in an engaging way. You may not be as lucky with my pals across the way, but who knows?
Anyway, it's worth a shot. No offense intended. Thanks.
Barack has not seen much of a polling bump since introducing Biden for one major reason. Any discussion of Obama's Vice President immediately brings to mind the fear of assassination. What was Barack's biggest criteria in looking for a VP? It was always "someone who could step in" and assume the presidential duties. If John McCain had said that about Barack Obama's VP, that he has to be ready to "step in," every cable news anchor would jump on that like they did Hillary's RFK comments.
I wonder, Nate, if you have found any polling to suggest that voters are genuinely worried about Barack's safety.
DUNNO
I totally agree with your post.
Did you read that article 'How unscrupulous campaign strategists are taking advantage of a quirk in our brains – and what reporters can do to stop helping them' by Sam Wang & Sandra Aamodt @ Nieman Watchdog [Harvard U]
very interesting & timely article. helps explain troll behavior as a strategy as well as negative advertising and MSM narratives.
For this analytical site it further helps understand why certain pollsters might choose to influence their 'house effects' or bias for partisan reasons.
http://www.niemanwatchdog.org/index.cfm?fuseaction=background.view&backgroundid=00275
And now, a post on the substance of the day.
Ted Kennedy's speech was moving and brought tears to my eyes. The courage that must have taken was amazing, and if you didn't know he was fighting for life, you never would have guessed it.
Michelle Obama stepped up to the plate and blasted a grand slam. She dispelled every ridiculous (and racially-tinged) narrative the Republicans have attempted to use against her, she mentioned Hillary Clinton, she introduced herself as a daughter, sister, and mother, and spoke forcefully, effectively, and brilliantly. The unscripted exchange with the Obamas' daughters was the icing on the cake. This could not have gone better.
Sadly, this hasn't left much room for Team Troll (TM Matthew H) to operate. Someone, however, did claim that the night was boring and only featured two speeches of note, which is LOL funny. I'm guessing anyone who shares those sentiments is not familiar with political conventions. In reality, every speech is not a barnburner - - but two of them were, and that's what counts. (As if Team Troll didn't know.)
Tough night for the GOP, which has a pretty tough act to follow. Perhaps Cindy will warm our hearts with her compelling life story of inheriting $100MM and becoming a trophy wife, to which most Americans can assuredly relate. ROTFL.
Finally, Matt J.H. - - dude. You're a concern troll, not a real Democrat. No one with actual liberal or progressive credentials would post what you do. I'm sure you'll keep it up, but be advised that I'm not buying what you're selling. Sorry.
Frankly, I have paid zero attention to Michelle Obama so far so I didn't know what to expect from her. I suspect most Americans haven't heard anything directly from her either until now.
Michelle Obama made a wonderful speech. All she had to do was introduce Obama and her children and talk about the man she knows in a human and touching way and she did that.
She's not running for anything, she shouldn't give a policy speech, and she's not supposed to make the case against McCain.
There were no negative moments. The speech was all positive and got positive reviews from every commentator I saw. (I didn't watch FAUX News of course so no idea what their raven-like screeching was).
Her only job was to present herself as an elegant, intelligent woman and introduce her family. That's it and she did it.
To listen to our resident idiot trolls, she was a communist endlessly repeating "hate whitey." Fascinating projection.
DUNNO and CUGEL
thank you both ever so much for such straightforward and rational posts at this late hour.
I was feeling like a voice in the wilderness after all the troll attacks...
muchas gracias
Cugel, great analysis; I'm glad you shared that.
DCM, glad you enjoyed the post, and thanks for the (undeserved) props. I always enjoy your comments and I am going to read that article you posted about above right now, which I had not yet heard about. I'll comment on it in a thread tomorrow. Thanks!
Finally, don't let Team Troll get you down. Remember - - that is one of their goals; in fact, it's their primary objective - - to demoralize. Like their atrociously poor candidate, they know that they cannot win a debate on the issues, so they post nonsense in an effort to get progressives down. Look at it this way - - if they didn't know that their backs are up against the wall, they wouldn't be so active. Not even the ones who aren't being paid for their efforts. :) Have a good night.
I'm often hard on the Obama campaign, and they may not win this election. But this is one of those nights you have to be proud to be a democrat. The majority of the night was a waste and not very organized, but Michelle Obama is absolutely ready for Prime time, and what can you say about Ted Kennedy. The Obama family may not be elected, but we should be proud as a country if they do. I'd take them over McCain and Cindy any day of the week. Theres no comparison. If America wants to put family values in the white house, its the Obama's they want.
Has the live boggng finised _SORRY i missed it.
Finally, Matt J.H. - - dude. You're a concern troll, not a real Democrat. No one with actual liberal or progressive credentials would post what you do. I'm sure you'll keep it up, but be advised that I'm not buying what you're selling. Sorry.
I'm interested in winning. I know the democratic party is the pure party, I know they have principles and the republicans are morally bankrupt. But the country needs a democrat in the white house. I thought Michelle and Ted were brilliant, but the hatchet job on McCain needs to start in order to win.
Nobody's gonna care about Michell Obama's great speech when McBush starts wars with Iran and Russia and we institute a draft to supply the troops and this country damn nearly implodes with political strife. I'm all about winning this election, the stakes are too high.
mdt: munky donut time.
I agree that Michelle Obama was good. Really good. Too bad there's not a first lady debate. I think she'd wipe the floor with the Stepford junkie.
And again I was mightily impressed with Caroline Kennedy. I suspect there will be a role in the Obama administration for her.
Post a Comment