9:30 PM MDT: How you'll know that Hillary's speech was a winner:
If the principal Republican talking point tomorrow is: "the speech was too good! It just proves that she should have been the [Presidential/Vice Presidential] nominee!"
9:17 PM MDT: More from Sean:
"When she turned to "Why are you in it?" from that point to the end of the speech she warmed even my slow-to-warm heart. That was a great speech. She did what she came to do. Nate's "Shame on You" moment was more or less accomplished by the Twin Cities line. She explained to her supporters that if you support my agenda, you will vote for Barack Obama. Like Nate said, she was sincere. A sincere Hillary Clinton is a great Hillary Clinton."
9:09 PM MDT. I wish I had a more substantive, less rah-rah reaction for you, but I really think she just accomplished everything that she needed to, and did so in style.
Or as Sean puts it: "goddammit, Hillary, don't make me like you again!"
9:03 PM MDT. One thing about Clinton -- really both Clintons -- they understand the audience they are speaking to better than any other politicians in America.
9:01 PM MDT. Like Schweitzer, Hillary started out a little slow, but there are Republicans kicking chairs over right now in RNC offices all across America.
8:58 PM MDT. Hillary's sincerity factor is very high tonight and getting higher.
8:57 PM MDT. C-SPAN could pretty much just keep a camera trained Bill's face 100% of the time and I'd be entertained.
8:54 PM MDT. Yes, one could certainly bring up the point that Hillary is talking a lot about Hillary.
8:48 PM MDT. "No way, no how, no McCain". Not quite a "shame on you" moment, but certainly getting warmer.
8:45 PM MDT. She's gotten off strong out of the blocks.
8.26.2008
Live from Denver, It's Hillary Clinton! (DNC thread #2)
@ 10:38 PM
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345 comments
Jesus, bottom of ninth, Mets 7 Phillies 6. It's like Sophie's Choice on my Fios.
She's doing great. Fantastic. All is forgiven.
"No way. Nohow. No McCain."
I love Hillz right now.
dave, haha you are very foolish if you think everyone who's mad at obama has forgiven him........there's still 15% who will not vote obama. no matter what she ever will say.
mccain 08!
average
which is good enough i think to end the PUMA story
(Repost)
That reminds me, I need to get the Halloween candy soon.
haha, do you people not notice she's just talking about her self? this is so great!. forget obama. talk about me!.
nevermind that sisterhood of the traveling pantsuits was stupid as hell
Uninspiring. She needs to kick this speech up few notches.
Schweitzer, by contrast, was way better. I'm a conservative and could see myself voting for that guy.
I'm sorry, it sounds like she's making a concession speech, not a convention speech. She seems sad and wistful; she needs to be angry.
7-7.
Eric Bruntlett just killed the Pumas that are NY Mets fans.
and the Pumas who are Luis Ayala owners.
Jaime, what else did you expect? this was supose to be her convention till obama stole it.
she is so upset he stole it she probly doesnt know what she's saying haha.
This isnt that good folks
Bill's crazy grin out in the stands is a little disturbing.
This is very, very bad. It's a speech about how great Hillary is, and little else.
Bill Clinton > Barack Obama > Hillary Clinton
She's hitting all the expected talking points. I guess the pundits won't be able to blame her if Obama can't break 82% among Democrats.
It's going downhill fast.
haha, look at him. he's just eating it up!. that was great.
biden didnt look to thrilled though.....this is so great!.
I have a feeling that, 20 years from now, Hillary will still be around, giving giving lines like "the Republicans let the oil companies fail, and hundreds of thousands of jobs were lost! We need bailouts to ensure that no oil company ever again falls through, and our jobs remain secure!"
Hillary and Michelle, sitting in a tree...
So, how, in ANY way, is Hillary better than Schweitzer?
She's the Ryan Howard of Democrats. Strikes out most of the time, but when she connects.... 450 feet. This ones looks deep and I don't think it's playable.
Nate:
if you actually think hillary is sincere, well then i've lost all respect for your judgement
LOL get real
If you have a job with the oil companies, then you deserve to lose it. No sympathy.
whoa!. braking news hillary just complemented mccain. in the DNC!. this is big.
even if she was supose to i thought they wernt supose to do anything of the sort.
Where did she get the "equal pay for equal work" slam?
Ah Screw it. She's Michael Jack Schmidt. And she should be wearing Orange Pumas with that atrocity.
Man stop cherry picking the speech and listen to what she's saying. She's tearing McCain up right now. Very strong speech I say.
She basically just called him a misogynist. I guess since you're a republican, you consider that a compliment.
i think Nate would suck obama off if he could
that being said mccain is a douchebag
obama will win
From a person who used to cringe listening to Senator Clinton, I have to say, excellent job. If some of her supporters don't come along, so-be-it, but I am willing to admit she is doing her best here.
oh shit it just got really good all of a sudden.
Did she just compare Republicans to fugitive slave posses?
This is where the equal pay comment came from:
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/04/24/by_juliet_eilperin_washington.html
wow, just cause i'm a republican and am talking about anything a dem is saying you get mad?.
dem's do it all the time. with mccain,rush limbaugh,hanity...
there is such a double standerd it's not even funny.
Fair comparison in my opinion.
You know, until tonight I was hard-pressed to agree that there was a lot of sexism in the american voter's mind. Maybe I was just naive. But the amount of screaming that's gone on about what she's wearing tonight... yeesh. Honestly. If she were male, that wouldn't have happened. If I guy wore argyle or a dumb-looking hat, it would have gotten a brief laugh, not vindictive jeers. Ugh
I'm suprised. That ended up pretty good
The Harriet Tubman lines... now that's good stuff.
"If you have a job with the oil companies, then you deserve to lose it. No sympathy."
That's cold dude. How do you feel about coal miners? Steel workers? Lumberjacks? Fishermen?
Elitist.
You are so retarded, Joshua. It makes me sick to my stomach that I share a name with you.
I am just saying that because you are a republican, misogyny is one of your treasured moral values.
Holy shit do you overreact.
PUMA's....Unite behind Obama!
Not what I'd call a stemwinder (Schweitzer's was closer to that) but a terrific speech.
The "Twin Cities" line was a classic.
She's become a really good speaker. That went fantastically well.
Knocked it out of the park. A+
Eric- You do NOT want to see Schweitzer in an orange Pantsuit!
I like what she's saying, and I think she's hitting McCain pretty hard.
I'm actually glad I won't be around for the next few days. Wow.... VCon is going to be SO GRUMPY after this!
Wow, the GOP trolls are ranting all over the place here. I can see why y'all would be crapping your pants right about now, because that was a fantastic speech that Hillary just gave.
Seems like Brian Schweitzer put on the freshman governor 15... That must also be sexism. As if they were comparing him to Greg Luzinski or John Kruk.
Hillary's last 4 minutes was Ted-in-'80-esque
Thanks, beowulf. Here's McCain on equal pay from that article:
"I am all in favor of pay equity for women, but this kind of legislation, as is typical of what's being proposed by my friends on the other side of the aisle, opens us up to lawsuits for all kinds of problems," McCain told reporters yesterday. "This is government playing a much, much greater role in the business of a private enterprise system."
Maybe it's because I am an atheist...but this has got to the be stupidest fucking prayer I have ever heard.
Doesn't match up to Schweitzer, (I see what you're talking about Nate. The man is no joke!) but definitely a very good speech. I'd say tied with Michelle for 2nd best so far. PUMA's: Vote McCain at your own risk...
sean won't be able to get the hillmilf out of his mind now. great performance.
Darren - no doubt that is his position...but that is where the reference came from, agree with it or not.
josh - comparisons to slave hunters should automatically lose the argument.
Everything about that speech was perfect... but did she convince the majority of Obama holdouts to change their tune? Time will tell.
She certainly didn't phone it in. Maybe the best speech I have seen by her. She knew the significance of this moment and she didn't falter for even a second.
Ugh, all the people on Fox News are saying that she had a shockingly minimal endorsement of Obama.
Hillary hits a homerun on the speech!
I guess McCain won't be running any more of those Hillary ads anytime soon after that.
Man, she's coming out roaring! Fine. I'm sold. She can have some money to kill her debt now.
Good speech in the second half. Hillary endorsed Michelle more than Barack, though.
Twin Cities line wasn't bad. Harriet Tubman lines were solid (too bad Tubman isn't on the ticket).
Abolition now! Abraham Lincoln / Harriet Tubman '60!
New poll, just out
Florida
McCain 49
Obama 42
this showed how bad obama needed hillary. had he picked her for VP. i would just say pres obama right away.
but since he failed to do so....it's going to be very hard for him.
good speech not great. but just showed how she would have had obama up 10 points first second after he would have said her name for vp.
In another thread, we had a discussion about the personal narratives of Obama and McCain. McCain's identity centers, of course, on that time in the Hanoi Hilton. Obama's centers on the decision to become an organizer on the South Side of Chicago and the ensuing few years.
Clinton's?
The central, character-building passage in her life was not when she was 25. Instead, it began in January and continued through tonight.
Bravo!
I'm pretty sure I've said this before...but Wolf Blitzer is a friggin' scumbag.
Nice response from Eddie Rendell.
She sold that a vote for McCain is a vote against everything she has worked for her whole life pretty well. Lots of me, me, I, me in the middle.
She was not nearly as good as Schweiter.
The whole movie tribute to Hillary was worth it for calling Bill "Hillary's Husband". I bet that bothered him a little deep down, though he would never admit it.
Maybe it's because I am an atheist...but this has got to the be stupidest fucking prayer I have ever heard.
Maybe they'll dumb it down for you guys in the transcripts.
holy crap - so I know this is completely unrelated to anything, but the pastors are Korean! (I'm Korean-American) Cool! XD
Fox News is going to try to advance their own agenda so I'm definitely not surprised.
Hillary has become a powerful speaker over the life of this campaign. She did a great job.
Can't wait to hear Biden and Bill.
First impression: I was blown away.
After a minute: A lot of talk about herself, a big stump-speech arc in the middle, resulting in the urgent bid to vote for Obama. Probably the best way to convince her voters to join Obama. I can´t really say anything negative about it. She aimed at John McCain, focused exactly on his misogynist views that could win 50% of the electorate quite easily. She got the whole room excited, she was gratious, graceful, oh my...
airhawk86,
Thanks for the poll update, but I must say that I think every poll just became a bit obsolete, especially in a state like FL. Hillary just gave the speech of her life, and it might potentially be a game-changer. THIS is why there are conventions! Brilliant speech. Absolutely brilliant.
I'm betting lots of Clinton supporters who are unsure of Obama watch Fox News, though...
(For the record, I actually did think it ended up being a pretty good speech. I especially liked the dig at McCain on women's rights. Still, Bill Kristol's comment that the speech wasn't about Obama, but generic Democrats... is actually kind of correct.)
I guess McCain won't be running any more of those Hillary ads anytime soon after that.
That's not how it works. They'll run ads of Hillary and Biden criticizing Obama til Election Day. This speech just means that have to spend more on them to counteract.
haha, fox isnt the only one that lean's one way or the other in views......msnbc. lib. cnn. lib.
it's good to have another view for some of us once in a while.
SUSA releasing five polls right now
Florida
McCain 49-42
Ohio
McCain 47-40
Michigan
Obama 46-44
Pennsylvania(shocker)
McCain 46-43
Colorado
tied 46-46
I think she did what she needed to do, but I'd like to hear Hillary say one positive word about Barack Obama, the man himself. She just doesn't do it.
It really just amplifies the question why Hillary is on the ticket - top or bottom. Not picking her for VP was silly.
ok, enough with this live blogging malarkey - go get wankered!
Minimal endorsement of Obama, absolute minimum.
CNN is interviewing a Hillary delegate (black female) who is practically in tears over how presidential Hillary looked, and how she hasn't yet committed to Obama.
Yeah Jaime you're right but I think that some Hillary supporters will realize that a generic democrat sure as hell aint McCain so it's either Obama or nothing
Gotta love the conservatrolls. That's easily the best speech i've seen her give.
Those polls sure look good to me!
You almost wonder if Hillary intended to go out and give a speech that would say: "I bet you wish you picked me instead of Joe 'No-Bounce' Biden"
Hillary did not denounce McCain nearly well enough in this speech.
Instead she called McCain her friend.
That's just unnecessary.
I think you guys are not giving Clinton enough credit for degree of difficulty. She can't completely "sell out" to Barack because she's trying to persuade a very specific group of people that can possibly only be brought along just on policy. She compliments her voters by complimenting herself. I think the speech does exactly what it has to to bring voters back into the fold *even* if they can't trust Obama. In fact, I think the speech might actually bring some borderline honest-to-God racists back.
Doubting her sincerity is kind of silly: doubt her policies by all means--some are pretty silly, IMO. She's up there doing a job, and she's doing that job better than nearly anyone on planet Earth could do it. Professionals do jobs, and Hillary Clinton is an utter, utter professional. And the pantsuit looked great.
Far more interesting, I think, is this question; what are the odds that the four best speakers by far at the DNC turn out to be two husband-and-wife pairs? (Assuming Bill hangs up the crazy-guy stuff and comes back to life as Bill Clinton.)
Those polls are pre-convention, post-Biden. And that is the ONLY poll where I've seen McCain with a lead in PA. Not really a concern.
That was an incredible speech by Clinton. The best I've ever seen her, by far. If a Clinton supporter still supports McCain after that .. forget 'em.
What was that interview? That was horrible for the Dems...
airhawk--let's see a link.
It would be nice if Survey USA had said polls on their site, which they don't.
What if Obama's speech on Thursday doesn't measure up to this one by Clinton? (Or the even better one just prior by Schweitzer?)
His speeches haven't been as impressive since the winter.
They don't release them to non members until the next day.
Get over yourselves: It wasn't that good.
Well, of course Hillary is going to come out strong for Obama. There is hardly any real ideological daylight between them.
Obama and Hillary both staked out positions on the political spectrum that suited them and their campaigns. They fought to a duel because Hillary would not let Obama get rightward enough, so she held the center middle of the Democratic Party, while Obama got the left wing. That’s a bout a 50-50 split.
Now Obama finds himself as the left wing candidate again, but now he faces a less hospitable electorate.
Hillary would have been just a comfortable from a purity stand point running on the left. On healthcare she did, but not on foreign policy. If Obama had been allowed to outflank Hillary on the right, he would be almost unassailable now.
Hillary spoke the party line and it was like her stump speech and she simply ascribed her own virtues to Obama. She praised all the right people, including McCain.
Her remarks about McCain being Bush are old hat, disappointing. It hasn’t worked up until now, why would she think it would work now, the umpteenth time she has said, it Barack has said it, and each of you has said it!
Her peroration was a nonsequitor: How is it that the particular election of Barack Obama honors the sacrifice of those who came before? How will his ascension to the Presidency fill our children with hope? How will it re-assure us that there is no barrier to great, no ceiling to high, when her own hopes were just a dashed as Obama’s were exalted? More than that there was no ostensible tie to him and his attributes, no tributes to Obama and his character. It was all very abstract.
The endorsement was a minimal one, a lot words but little rationale for Obama. Just words, little reasoning. Why Obama? The question is not yet answered.
There is no reason to think that she can move any of her votes to Obama, a parking spot was what she was for those still holding out, a vessel of anti-Obama sentiment. To turn that around is too much to ask of her. She can’t deliver.
Once again, Hillary got her ticket punched and Obama got his clock cleaned.
A good night for Clinton. Nothing much for Obama.
His task will be monumental Thursday night.
I´ll go so far and call the SUSA poll of Pennsylvania an outlier, the Florida one probably, too. Sorry, I can´t even recall the last Pennsylvania poll that had McCain in front. The 2 most recent polls aren´t a week old and both show Obama with a small, but comfortable margin. And the only thing that happened between the Quinnipiac poll and the SUSA poll was the selection of Biden, and that for sure did not cause a 10% drop in the polls.
News Flash! Media fails to extend story of Obama-Hillary conflict!
Transcript from MSNBC (meaning I typed it in going back and forth using my Tivo; ellipses do indicate omissions) :
Andrea Mitchell: I'm here with a 79 year old woman...Angie Gilareto from Pittsburgh...we were sitting together during Hillary Clinton's speech, and she was crying...
Andrea Mitchell: [to delegate]: Why are you so sad? Why not take her message to support Barack Obama?
Delegate: Oh, I am taking the message, wholeheartedly. I am supporting Obama and Joe Biden. I'm a true Democrat and a party leader, and I believe in what Governor Rendell said: We need a new beginning, and I believe in that.
You've got to hand it to the *liberal* media. They probably picked out someone who they knew wasn't convinced. They've been playing this PUMA stuff up all week. Did anyone realize that since June, 72% of the stories about Obama have been negative, compared to 57% for McCain. Some liberal bias...
If Hillary had given speeches like that starting in January 2008 she'd be the nominee right now. She was nowhere near that eloquent prior on or before Super-Tuesday when this nomination was decided.
I wonder if McCain will be running any more of those "Hillary is a truthteller" ads now! I'd guess that they get yanked quick and you don't hear any more praise from McCain about Hillary!LOL!
I knew that was a stupid blunder, to build her up as a "truth-teller" (his words). It just set up McCain as tacitly endorsing Hillary and building her up.
You can't have it both ways! Either she's a "truth-teller" or not. She can't be just a "truth-teller" when she attacks Obama, and NOT when she attacks McCain! A person either has integrity or not. And if McCain says she does have it, he can't suddenly walk that back and say "she's just a partisan Democrat when she attacks me."
He should have been ripping her down, not building her up! He should have anticipated this speech by saying "she's just another partisan Democrat. They're all the same. I pay no attention."
That was a flat fantastic speech! Amazing. I thought she'd be good but that was way better than good.
Nobody could ask for better than that.
The fact that the RepubliCons trolls are spinning so hard means it was a great speech.
Given that SUSA had a poll out yesterday showing Obama up by 8 in Ohio, I'm skeptical that there's been a 15 point swing in 24 hours.
Notice that Hillary never said hes "ready to lead", or listed any of Obama's accomplishments.
I don't believe those SUSA polls exist.
I think "airhawk" might just be an airhead.
Nice try, wingnuts. Nothing is gonna harsh the buzz.
And besides, what constitutes a proper endorsement nowadays? "Oh BARACK, I'll surely be sucking your dick all the way to White House."?
RCP just reported a Strategic Vision poll in Florida at 49-42 McCain, which matches the SUSA poll airhawk reported. Two polls with the same margin can't be dismissed as outliers (unless these are somehow the same poll?)
How about Brian Schweitzer? A little eccentric, but utterly entertaining.
Behold, the NEW Teddy Roosevelt.
That was a hell of a speech. As an Obama voter, I especially appreciated it when she separated herself from the causes she had espoused. It was very impressive. I hope that she will be out on the campaign trial for Obama, tirelessly, in the Northeast in particular.
If she does that, then I will be in her corner forever. It seems to me that Hillary Clinton is well-positioned to take the torch in the Senate from Ted Kennedy and run with it.
The other thing I liked were the attacks on McCain. Fantastic!
survey came out with a colorado poll yesterday with mccain up 2 not tied. unless they did one today. too.
I'm a conservative (liberal conservatism to be exact), and I'm not denying that it was a good speech.
There's nothing wrong with acknowledging achievement when you see it.
Which brings up an observation - how come every time a conservative is ill, hospitalized, dies, etc, the liberals come out of the woodwork to cheer their misfortune? Meanwhile, people like Ted Kennedy get well-wishes from places like National Review, et al.
We need a return to civility. There are things more important in the world than mere partisan politics.
Is there a vid of that speech up yet? I'd love for my boss to see it (and I'd like to actually listen to it instead of hear comments about it)
Though the best one was my wife, who's at home and watching "I'm getting tingles down my spine."
Strategic Vision is an (R) internal poll so I'd take it with a grain of salt
The SUSA polls will drive down Obama's expected EV in Nate's model -- whether the polls are accurate or not.
where are survey's poll's anyway's i cant find them on the site.
I am an Obama supporter who is excited to make a contribution to Hillary tonight for retiring her debt, and would support her in 2016 happily. She knocked it out of the park, and convinced my PUMA family members (3) that she really does want him to win. Thank you for working to unite the party and help us defeat McCain, who is more of the same.
**********************
One House, One Spouse
Obama/Biden 2008
**********************
McCain ran the Hillary ad in the first commercial break post-speech on CNN. I wonder how much say they have on timing and if that was intentional.
In any case, they will run that and similar ads until the election - they can put the primary Hillary in people's living rooms 8 times a night versus the general election Hillary popping up only when she's campaigning locally.
Nate - Jeffrey Toobin just called Schweitzer the "Barack Obama of 2008" comparing to his 2004 keynote. You can start a fan club.
Can anyone tell me when these new Survey USA polls were taken?
Internal polls don't get added into Nate's model so the numbers don't matter
guys... airhawk INVENTED the SUSA polls.
Seriously, do the Republicans posters expect her to say that he is/was a better candidate than she was? Who would do that? She said he supports the policies and issues important to her, and if you agree with her on the issues you should vote for him. Anything more than that would have been fake.
I think she enjoyed sticking it to McCain. After what he said about her daughter, she should have. It would be poetic justice if her speech locks this thing up for Obama.
SUSA didn't put out a poll yesterday in CO joshua.
JC3. SUSA isn't an internal poll.
I wonder how much say they have on timing and if that was intentional.
A lot, and yes.
Similar to the VISA ads congratulating Phelps on his record-breaking gold wins a few seconds after he won them.
The spots are a bit more expensive, though.
They're running that Hillary-supporter ad right now.
I don't see an Ohio SUSA poll from yesterday that Dave reported either.
But SUSA does have an interesting set of polls from yesterday. They don't give Obama McCain "who would you vote for" number, but they do look at favorability and compares the candidates on various issues for fifteen states. Is this a retrospective culling of old poll data or is it new? It's hard to tell.
But it's interesting, anyway. Shockingly good results for Obama in New Mexico, where he's actually even on the terrorism issue, and up on everything else. Massachussets surprisingly close looking. Missouri also looks pretty close. Ohio also looks very strong for Obama, but Virginia looks strong for McCain. Wisconsin also looks like a McCain lean.
It's all pretty strange. If someone could make sense of it, let me know:
http://www.surveyusa.com/index.php/2008/08/25/dnc-special-favorability-unfavorability-and-issues-in-15-states/
BREAKING! SHOCKER POLL!
CALIFORNIA: McCain 55-35
The poll was conducted by the firm Shyster and Cheetam.
Rasmussen polls being released tomorrow:
New York: Obama +5
Michigan: McCain +10
I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt because no one can be that obsessed or stupid
wow if Hillary spoke in a way that inspired people during the primary she might have won
I'll buy Mark Penn a drink any day!
I keep coming back thinking how Hillary lost the nomination. The usual run of history would have been a Clinton-Obama ticket, and I keep on thinking she would have deserved it. But the simple fact is that the Obama campaign was more organized. In the end they were roughly even on popular vote, but Obama hat a 100+ pledged delegate lead - that´s it. And the Clinton campaign missed the alliance of their inner-party opponents, crystallized in the superdelegate vote and illustrous endorsements.
The greatest tragedy might be that Hillary Clinton simply was underprepared, and she only started fighting when it was already lost. Maybe she got her career handed to her too easily - married to the most talented politican of their generation, running one great populist campaign in 1992, a weak opponent in 1996 and replacements in her senate races. She possesses all the talent that is needed, but she, in contrast to her fighter/ready-on-day-one-image, never had to fight for herself.
Who is Barack Obama again?..they've made him the guy with the (D) next to his name. Seriously, no one can name a reason he should be president besides that he will support all the typical Dem positions. How about a speaker naming something he's done?
I said it before, I'll say it again:
I think every poll just became obsolete. Hillary Clinton just gave a potentially game-changing speech. Democrats outnumber Republicans by a large enough margin that bringing some of Clinton's supporters into the Obama camp could translate into a significant shift in the polls. There is no question that the GOP will get some bounce from its convention, but this was as good a speech as she could have given.
It would be poetic justice if her speech locks this thing up for Obama.
He's going to need a significant bump, not only to offset any possible GOP Veep/convention bump, but also as insurance going into the big debates.
Also, what are the likelihoods that either side has an "October surprise" in the wings? After Rezko/Wright/Ayers, it seems like there can't possibly be anything else on Obama. Meanwhile, McCain has been in the Senate for years, so it also seems unlikely that there's some scandal that hasn't been revealed already.
Sarah, sorry, I was looking at the favorability polls you were talking about. My bad; although Obama does have an 8 point advantage there. I'm still going to believe airhawk's numbers when I see them for myself.
Hillary really gave you nothing tonight tht will do any lasting good. if that spate of new polls is to be believed we have entered a new phase in the race.
Hillary outdid herself in magnanimity and helped herself a lot.
Just read Pete Kent: Dude! You're utterly hilarious tonight! Kudos!
I criticize trolls for coming on this site and contributing nothing, but you deserve our thanks!
"Get over yourselves: It wasn't that good."
That was "Dyn-o-mite." "Her peroration was a non-sequiter." Wow! You're right! That's exactly what Middle-America is going to be saying tonight!
How could I have missed that!
"Her remarks about McCain being Bush are old hat, disappointing." They weren't aimed at YOU, Republican-trolls!
Obama has a +8 - +10 Party ID advantage, but the election is largely tied because McCain has 89% of Republicans and Obama only 81% or so of Democrats.
This speech was aimed largely, almost exclusively at Hillary supporters, both Democrats and Independents.
If Obama can get them, he gains close to another 10% in party loyalty and this election goes from being tied to being a blow-out.
If he can get 1/2 of them, he'll win.
This was a big, huge step forward tonight.
I wouldn't worry about Obama being out-shone by Hillary either. As good as her speech-making is, his is flat great. Remember Obama first got interest because of his amazing 2004 key-note speech.
And his speech in Berlin, his speech on race, etc. He gives a great speech. And he will again on Thursday.
Obama is flat-out the best political speechwriter in America since Bobby Kennedy. Only Reagan comes close with his "Morning In America" speech. Bill Clinton's 1992 acceptance speech would be third.
New Gallup Daily Tracking Poll Numbers:
McCain - 85%
Obama - 15%
Seriously though, I know you conservative guys have to find a way to spin tonight, but that was a great speech, and it's really stretching to say she gave Obama a "minimal endorsement" when she just said the entire future of the country depends on electing him.
I just got an early release from Rasmussen, taken post-Biden...
Obama up 5 in Florida! Obama up 6 in Ohio! Obama up 12 in New Hampshire!
airhawk's previous post:
airhawk86 said...
i think Nate would suck obama off if he could
that being said mccain is a douchebag
obama will win
C'mon... does this sound like somebody who would get a whole set of polls before everybody else?
It was a fantastic speech that probably accomplished most of important goals for the party, but ... I was disappointed that I did not see two things in her speech:
1) She needed to call her fellow Senator a LIAR for slandering her by implying that she supported him for President.
2) She needed to hold up a COAT HANGER and ask "You know what this is? It's John McCain's health plan for women who need an abortion, even an abortion necessary to save her life."
The second one would give the PUMAs something to explain the next time they pretend supporting McCain is the feminist thing to do.
He can give great speeches, but can he lead?
I am also being told a Fox News National poll is coming out tomorrow.
McCain +7
Well, the haters can say whatever they want, but they have to be afraid - if it is true, as indicated in the polls Chuck Todd referred to last week, that just over half of the non-committed voters are Clinton supporters, then this election is over.
Ok people making up polls? That's my cue to exit...
Chuck Todd is a Democratic hack. Also, anyone see McAulliffe stick it to MSNBC?..they tried to talk to him and he said he was going to do Fox...priceless!
My Rasmussen and Fox numbers are real. Airhawk's SUSA's numbers are real.
McCain is getting Obama's convention bounce.
Virginia Conservative:
He was a POW, but can he lead?
(Not unless Lieberman whispers the answers in his ear)
Hillary really heaped praise on Biden...great endorsement.
New poll being released tomorrow morning...
McCain up 5...in France!
SHOCKER!!!
For the love of god, why isn't Hillary Odumbo's VP Pick. she should be. she was fantastic. So much better than BIDEN.
18 million voters and they were dissed by ODUMBO. Please, put Hillary's name into the nomination for VP.
Just listen to CNN and MSNBC, NBC, CBS and ABC. HILLARY was just great. Did everything possible for ODUMBO. She should be VP pick. The magic Negro, Harold FORD now talking on MSNBC he agrees with me. oh sorry Barack ( the middle name that shall not be named) Obama is the magic Negro. Odumblermann on MSNBC is now sucking HArold's c34k. It is really ugly, unless Odulbermann is a happy person.
Hillary, Hillary, Hillary, Puma lives.
Stop making up polls Nicholas.
OK guys we get the joke. Airhawk posted some fake polls now we all feel it's necessary to post our own fake polls. We understand that you uncovered the lie, no need to pretend you're hip/cool by making up your own polls.
Jack, you racist fuck. You're not a puma, you're a republican.
Go suck a cock.
Well said. I was skeptical coming in but she just blew me and everyone that was watching out of the water. The Hillary supporters--you are Democratic supporters. She made the connection beautifully and slammed the Republicans and McCain with great conviction and wit. Couldn't be more perfect. As Sean said, "All is forgiven."
Jack black,
we all know republicans "wanted" Hilary Clinton, probably because you'd be so happy to attack her as VP.
Hilary would have provided a short term bounce but long term headache. Biden provides a short term headache and a long term bounce.
I do agree that Chuck Todd is a partisan commentator, but they were not his numbers. As I recall they were a conglomerate of the top 5 national polling numbers.
And his speech in Berlin, his speech on race, etc. He gives a great speech. And he will again on Thursday.
His Berlin speech that began a month-long slide in the polls that - so far - hasn't stopped?
Obama is flat-out the best political speechwriter in America since Bobby Kennedy. Only Reagan comes close with his "Morning In America" speech.
That's just silly. I think you mean his delivery is good. The content is generic.
PUMA LIVES. Fight on Hillary! Fight On.
T
Alex S.
Even if Obama wins and then wins re-election, Hillary will only be 71 in 2016.
Being a woman is a decided advantage there, as women tend to keep their mind a lot longer. Don't count her out yet.
Damn, though, if that speech doesn't get Hillary fans voting (D), I don't know what will. Now if only Bill doesn't screw this all up....
The insight that the talking point will be "the speech was too good" has already come to fruition. I was just listening to Charles Krauthammer on Faux News and he was saying exactly that. I don't care much for Hillary Clinton, but that was one hell of a speech. Especially the Twin Cities line.
So confused, are the polls real or fake? I didn't see the speech but these polls should be affected by it in the near future right?
Every time she said Obama it was like "insert Dem nominee name here" in the speech. 2 days of this and still no one knows who this guy is. Did he at least know where he was tonight?
"He's going to need a significant bump, not only to offset any possible GOP Veep/convention bump, but also as insurance going into the big debates."
The debates are what I believe many undecideds are waiting for. If Obama doesn't totally blow it, he is in I think. All he has to do is come across competent.
McCain's campaign already has realized that they cannot win the election; they have to make Obama lose it. That is why all McCain's ads are about Obama, and not him. Now that everyone knows that he was a POW, there is not a whole lot to say about him, besides the whole media was mancrushing on him in 2000.
josh,
I'm shocked, shocked that you could say such an ugly thing about me, where do you get your evidence. I simply said fight on Puma, fight on!! go Hillary, go.
Josh, are you up past your bed time? I think you are up past your bed time. Go to bed before Mommy comes in and spanks you on your bottom.
it's best not to stay up and play with the big boys. I wouldn't want you crying to mommy, " i was being picked on by Hillary's PUMA'S. Jack Black was being mean to me. Mommy can you go and beat up JB. I'm tired now, and I need my milk and cookies before bed.
Jack. I told you to go suck a cock. Why don't I hear you gagging?
In any case. I registered to the SUSA site because someone said polls are released early to members. Nope. Airhawk's polls are fake.
Jack Black, please shut the fuck up. You are a piss poor excuse for a human being, and I am tired of seeing your bullshit.
This speech will definitely help Hillary for 2012 but when Biden speaks tomorrow, the difference between the two will be palpable. Clearly, at least to the delegates, it will be clear that Obama picked the wrong VP.
James--most of the polls just described are fake. Straighten it out tomorrow here, RealClearPolitics, or whatever your favorite polling site is.
Don't expect ANY effect on the polls until Thursday, and not substantial effects until around Saturday.
NJ - the fact that you already know what you think of Biden's speech tomorrow, shows the value of your thoughts...is it really that difficult to wait and hear and then compare? Apparently so.
The official McCain response is that Hillary didn't retract her accusation that Obama lacks experience, not that her speech was too good. Campaign spokesman is on Larry king now.
Sarah,
You say "most". Have you heard taht any are real?
A+
couldn't have been a better speech.
any of her supporters who now vote for mccain are simply people who don't want to see two black girls running around the white house.
MJ,
Just because ODUMBO could never walk in front of Hillary for fear of getting a shiv in his back or eating in front of Hillary for fear of her poisoning his food, that's no reason for not naming her his VP choice. She was so good tonight.
I hope Mule Rider and Pete Kent were listening tonight. I know they were crying just like me.
Uh oh, the shrill bitch with the short hair and thick neck is now talking on MSNBC, and she is, no, yes, no, yes staring at nora Odonnell I think. Oh man, i think she likes Nora. that is really ugly.
James, none.
I just investigated SUSA's member area to see if the polls were real or not. They aren't.
The polls I cited I just made up out of thin air.
Don't worry so much.
McCain's campaign already has realized that they cannot win the election; they have to make Obama lose it.
I think you're probably right. The McCain campaign is probably at or near the plateau of support they can reasonably expect under current political conditions.
He loves to repeat his "maverick" status, but it still grates on many of us liberal conservatives.
McCain's only hope of winning is for Obama's star to fade in the next 10 weeks.
The official McCain response is that Hillary didn't retract her accusation that Obama lacks experience, not that her speech was too good.
Sounds like the McCain campaign doesn't understand subtext.
NJ Moderate-
"This speech will definitely help Hillary for 2012 but when Biden speaks tomorrow, the difference between the two will be palpable. Clearly, at least to the delegates, it will be clear that Obama picked the wrong VP."
1. Hillary's only hope for the Presidency is 2016. If Obama loses, she will be blamed, rightly or wrongly, and will have alienated the die hard Democrats. That would be the who decides the primaries.
2. I agree that it was obvious who should have been the VP nominee from watching the speeches tonight. Brian Schweitzer was fantastic. His bolo tie was pretty lame though. I didn't realize that people still wore those.
The Stategic Vision FL poll release has an interesting internal for the GOPers.
Q 10. Would you favor or oppose John McCain selecting Florida Governor Charlie Crist as his vice presidential candidate?
Favor 34%
Oppose 52% <<<<<< [wow]
Undecided 14%
Q 13. If the election for President were held today would you support John McCain, the Republican, Barack Obama, the Democrat, or Bob Barr, the Libertarian?
John McCain 49%
Barack Obama 42%
Bob Barr 1%
Undecided 8%
Guess that should confirm McCain will not be choosing Chain Gang Charlie Crist for his VP or he will lose FL...
mason - does the average voter understand subtext?
Citizen Grimm - what exactly is a "liberal conservative"?
If Hillary just got the message across that Obama is a generic Democrat it will be an electoral landslide.
Please people, don´t compare her to Biden, he hasn´t spoken yet and he doesn´t carry as much weight as she does. Biden can get gritty on the tough area of foreign policy whereas Clinton is the I-feel-your-pain populist. These areas can´t really be compared.
And Hillary will "only" be 68 in 2016. She might have increased her chances now by a lot - but Schweitzer makes an uexpected play and Warner, hmm, hard to say..
beowulf, I live in NJ and have seen Biden 'perform' numerous times. If a normal politician takes 200 words to finish a though, Biden takes 600.
any of her supporters who now vote for mccain are simply people who don't want to see two black girls running around the white house.
All these accusations of racism are getting silly. Voters here in the U.S. are more complex than the binary tribalism mentality you suggest.
Josh, Josh, your words are so hateful! I for one am extremely appalled by your ugly words. What don't you like about what I have said.
I have blogged that Hillary's post were great. You keep telling me to do things with a male anatomy that as far as I can determine only Democrats think is okay to do in public. Oh I get it Josh, your a latent homosexual, yeah that;'s it, you keep bringing up that certain male part because that is what you want to do.
Hey Josh, I'm certain, but if you go to certain street corners in your city that you live, you will get your wish fulfilled.
widmerpool -
any of her supporters who now vote for mccain are simply people who don't want to see two black girls running around the white house.
not in a charitable mood tonight?
Darren - For the most part, yes.
They also understand, "Don't do it for me. Do it for them."
As mentioned the strategic vision poll is a republican poll and not accounted for in 538 calculations. In fact it is a one point decline from the previous poll released by the same company, so according to them Obaam is gaining ground.
And I have seen Senator Clinton speak 100 times on the campaign trail and was not impressed one time by her speeches...even the blind man hits the bullseye every once and awhile. Anyone with an even somewhat open mind would wait to see.
Citizen Grim,
What is a "liberal conservative"? I am asking seriously, since I have not heard the term used before.
After tonight, I agree that McCain probably can't get more support without bringing Obama down, so I have a hunch what the GOP convention will be like.
"I wish I had a more substantive, less rah-rah reaction for you"
Don't worry about it Nate, my reaction was the same, RAH-RAH!
What does it matter if I'm gay or not Jack?
All I am saying is, you have a constant stream of diarrhea shit streaming out of your mouth. You need a cock to plug it up. It's getting smelly in here.
Citizen Grimm - what exactly is a "liberal conservative"?
Wikipedia has a rough summary. Essentially, a conservative with some socially liberal positions (though not socialism).
For example, I cheered when Obama brought up his "least of these" line at the Saddleback forum. That's something Americans probably don't pay enough attention to.
Sore,
I get it Sore. You and Josh have been taking care of each other. Such ugly language. the language of ignorant, stupid people who do not understand their sexuality.
Hey Sore, i bet Josh was really good. He likes to give BJ's and you like to get it where the sun doesn't shine!! Oh man are you two Democrats. Pete Kent and Mule Rider will wish they were here for this exchange.
Grrrr. I hate typos. I wish you could edit!
They also understand, "Don't do it for me. Do it for them."
I'm glad you share my faith in the average voter. Though I think our opinions take a lot more than some good soundbites to shift.
Darren-
I find your lack of faith disturbing.
Josh,
Again, that ugly hateful language. You seem to be angry as well. Did your boyfriend have an affair on you? I know, you boy friend had an affair with a woman and found her to be better. You know Josh, if you try the RIGHT side, you might like it.
For the love of GOD, Mule Rider and Pete Kent are missing this. this is priceless.
Jack, I'd rather be a dick sucking gay sex fiend than the dick sucking christian conservative asshole that you are.
Kellyanne Conway just said on LArry King's show- "I wonder if the Democrats in the room tonight were thinking they picked the wrong candidate."
You called it - Hillary's speech was a MASSIVE home run.
Republican, just on Larry King:
"The quality of her speech should be leaving Dems scratching their heads as they wonder why she isn't on the ticket."
Seems like they were left relatively speechless.
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